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Thread: Older flu info

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    TexasStudent is offline Member 510 points
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    Older flu info

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    TexasStudent is offline Member 510 points
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    TexasStudent is offline Member 510 points
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    I am surprised that no one has commented on this yet. I guess people are starting to see the truth. Do you think the presidents of the US, Canada, and Mexico would have held a summit in a city where there is a huge outbreak? That makes no sense; this is all lie to try to get people to take drugs that can lead to death. When you put all the facts together, including birth control studies being conducted by agencies such as the Population Council and the WHO, it becomes quite clear.

    In this new link, see the video with Dr. Roby ********, who said that he stopped recommending the swine flu vaccine after he read the package insert and learned that, amongst many things, the vaccine was never proven effective, that it causes Guillain-Barre Syndrome, and that despite pregnant women being the number one target, it was never tested in this group of women.

    Pregnant Women Miscarriage After H1N1 Vaccine noworldsystem.com

    Here is another link for you to enjoy.
    O Administration Launches Deceptive Swine Flu Propaganda Blitz

  4. #4
    cpt.ricard's Avatar
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    Personally, I'm still waiting for better info.

    Flu shot + miscarriage ≠ H1N1Flu shot is evil.

    A good statistics teacher would've helped us here. But it doesn't mean it's perfectly safe either. We need more info, but public servants feel that the shot is just as safe as the seasonal flu shots (point of contention maybe?).

    Here's a great article from NYTimes.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/02/op...0deaths&st=cse

    Prepare for a Vaccine Controversy


    • Recommend



    By ARTHUR *****
    Published: August 1, 2009
    Washington
    Matthew Hollister


    Related

    Op-Ed Contributors: Ready for Swine Flu, Round 2? (August 2, 2009)

    Op-Ed Contributor: The ABC’s of H1N1 (August 2, 2009)

    Op-Ed Contributor: Fly the Germ-Free Skies (August 2, 2009)

    Op-Ed Contributor: E.R.’s May Be the First Victims (August 2, 2009)




    A FEW years ago public health officials set up a time share in Pennsylvania hens. Under contracts signed with several farmers, the hens continued to lay for their regular customers until the moment this past spring when the federal government requisitioned their eggs to grow flu vaccine.
    Strategic hen reserves are part of a success story: the government’s readiness for the current H1N1 flu pandemic. Public health officials had already stockpiled millions of doses of antiviral drugs, created diagnostic kits that detected the virus as soon as it appeared in California in April and enrolled five companies to make vaccine. By mid-October we may have as many as 80 million doses ready for a mass immunization program.
    But if there’s a weak link in this chain of preparedness, it is the federal bureaucracy’s torpor in explaining the risks of the vaccination program to the public. There is a chance, for example, that the H1N1 flu will sweep through cities before the vaccine is ready, causing serious illness and many deaths. (By the same token, H1N1 may turn out to be so mild as to seem harmless.)
    And there is a possibility that the vaccine itself might provoke side effects; for example, about one in 100,000 people who received the 1976 swine flu vaccine developed Guillain-Barré syndrome, a crippling nerve disorder.
    Public health officials have grown more vigilant since then. In 1999, for instance, doctors reported cases of intussusception, a sometimes deadly intestinal disorder, in a few infants given a new vaccine against rotavirus. After a causal link was confirmed, the vaccine was withdrawn.
    Six years later, there were more reports of Guillain-Barré, in patients who had received a new vaccine against meningococcal bacteria. This time, vaccine safety sleuths found that the association was rare or even coincidental, and the Food and Drug Administration kept the vaccine on the market.
    The need for good safety monitoring is more important than ever in this risk-averse age, in which a discredited link to autism has shaken confidence in childhood vaccination. It’s equally important that officials communicate the difference between correlation and cause.
    It is statistically inevitable that some of the millions of people vaccinated this fall will become ill or die. And there’s a high risk that the vaccine will be blamed for any coincidental health problems. For example, pregnant women will be urged to get the vaccine because doctors have seen how H1N1 can cause especially nasty infections during pregnancy. But about one in seven pregnancies ends in a miscarriage, so nearly 1,500 of 10,000 women in early pregnancy will miscarry this fall — whether or not they get the H1N1 vaccine.
    This all needs to be clearly explained by someone, and our new surgeon general nominee, Regina Benjamin, is a good person for the job. When schools open in September, Dr. Benjamin should make it her full-time job to explain the logic and unknowns of inoculation. If a vaccination campaign reduces deaths and illnesses caused by the H1N1 virus, it could also increase rates of vaccination against seasonal flu and other diseases. But if the campaign causes more people to lose any more faith in vaccines, it will have done more harm than good.
    Arthur ***** is the author of “Vaccine: The Controversial Story of Medicine’s Greatest Lifesaver.”
    __________________
    cpt.ricard

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    (11/May/09)

  5. #5
    doctorr is offline Member 513 points
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    Another point of view......

    Here's an article I read recently written by an infectious disease doc. It is intended for health care workers and not patients. If you suffer from a deficient sense of humor don't read it. While I don't agree completely with the author I do think it's a funny article.

    A Budget of Dumb *****

    Mark Crislip, MD, Infectious Diseases, 07:40PM Sep 7, 2009

    Flu season is here, kinda sorta, it never really went away thanks to H1N1. I was rounding today, lucky me with the three day weekend, when one of my colleagues mentioned a post I had written a year ago at the old blog about the flu vaccine. It was printed and put up in the break room, and he saw it, took it home to his wife, who promptly mailed it to a colleague that is a proud "I never get the flu vaccine" kind of guy.

    It is like people who are proud of being ignorant of science. I never understand why people brag about being ignorant or stupid. You would think they would be embarrassed, but then they are probably a... well, let us just see.

    Anyway, he read my short rant and evidently changed his mind about getting the flu vaccine this year. Yippee. So what was the powerful, reasoned essay that altered the course of human (well, maybe one human) history?

    I give you, slightly rewritten for 2009, a Budget of Dumb *****.

    I had my flu shot today. Well, my anti-flu shot. Protected me, my family, and my patients from sickness and death for another year. Whew.

    I wonder if you are one of those Dumb ***** who do not get the flu shot each year? Yes. Dumb ***. Big D, big A. You may be allergic to the vaccine, you may have had Guillain Barre, in which case I will cut you some slack. But if you don't have those conditions and you work in health care and you don't get a vaccine for one of the following reasons, you are a dumb ***.

    1. The vaccine gives me the flu. Dumb ***. It is a killed vaccine. It cannot give you the influenza. It is impossible to get flu from the influenza vaccine.

    2. I never get the flu, so I don't need the vaccine. Irresponsible dumb ***. I have never had a head on collision, but I wear my seat belt. And you probably don't use a condom either. So far you have been lucky, and you are a potential winner of a Darwin Award, although since you don't use a condom, you are unfortunately still in the gene pool.

    3. Only old people get the flu. Selfish dumb ***. Influenza can infect anyone, and one of the groups who are more likely to die of influenza are the very young. Often those most at risk for dying from influenza are those least able, due to age or underlying diseases, to respond to the vaccine. You can help prevent your old, sickly Grandmother or your newborn daughter from getting influenza by getting the vaccine, so you do not get flu and pass it one to her. Flu, by the way, is highly contagious, with 20 to 50% of contacts with an index case getting the flu. However, Granny may be sitting on a fortune that will come to you, and killing her off with the flu is a great way to get her out of the way and never be caught. That would make a good episode of CSI.

    4. I can prevent influenza or treat it by taking echinacea, vitamin C or airborne. Gullible dumb *** cubed then squared. None of these concoctions has any efficacy what so ever against influenza. They neither prevent nor treat influenza. And you can't boost you immune system either. Immunity is not a Jamba Juice. Anyone who says that the immune system can be boosted is also a dumb ***.

    5. Flu isn't all that bad a disease. Underestimating dumb ***. Part of the problem with the term flu is that it is used both as a generic term for damn near any viral illness with a fever and is also used for a severe viral pneumonia. Medical people are just as inaccurate about using the term as the general public. The influenza virus directly and indirectly kills 30,000 people and leads to hospitalization of 200,000 in the US each year. Influenza is a nasty lung illness. And what is stomach 'flu'? No such thing, dumb ***.

    6. I am not at risk for flu. Denying dumb ***. If you breathe, you are risk for influenza. Here are the groups of people who should not get the flu vaccine (outside of people with severe adverse reactions to the vaccine): Former President Clinton, who evidently doesn't inhale. And people who want to be safe from zombies. If you don't get the vaccine you do not have to worry about the zombie apocalypse, because zombies eat brains.

    7. The vaccine is worse than the disease. Dumb *** AND a wimp. What a combination. Your mother must be proud. Unless you think a sore deltoid for a day is too high a price to pay to prevent two weeks of high fevers, severe muscles aches, and intractable cough.

    8. I had the vaccine last year, so I do not need it this year. Uneducated dumb ***. Each year new strains of influenza circulate across the world. Last years vaccine at best provides only partial protection. Every year you need a new shot. And we have a new strain this season, H1N1, so you cannot be a parasite on the immunity of others.

    9. The vaccine costs too much. Cheap dumb ***. The vaccine costs less than a funeral, less than Tamiflu, less than a week in the hospital.

    10. I received the vaccine and I got the flu anyway. Inexact dumb ***. The vaccine is not perfect and you may have indeed had the flu. More likely you called one of the many colds people get each year the flu. Remember there are hundreds of potential causes of a respiratory infection circulating, the vaccine only covers influenza, the virus most likely to kill you and yours.

    11. I don't believe in the flu vaccine. Superstitious, premodern, magical thinking dumb ***. What is there to believe in? Belief is what you do when there is no data. Probably don't believe in gravity or germ theory either. Everyone, I suppose, has to believe in something, and I believe I will have a beer.

    12. The government puts tracking nanobots in the vaccine as well as RFID chips as part of the mark of the beast, and the vaccine doesn't work since it is part of a big government sponsored conspiracy to line the pockets of big pharma and inject the American sheeple with exotic new infections in an attempt to control population growth and help usher in a New World Order. Well, that excuse is at least reasonable. Paranoid dumb ***.

    So get the vaccine. And pass this url on to someone else. The life you may save may be your own. Or be a dumb ***.

    BTW: budget is an archaic term for a quantity of material, usually written. I do love dem dare archaic words, don't cha know.


    http://boards.medscape.com/[email protected]@.29f60079!comment=1
    Last edited by doctorr; 11-18-2009 at 01:23 PM.

  6. #6
    acgtacgtacgt's Avatar
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    I am shaking my head and rolling my eyes... Regarding Guillain-Barre, this is a disease when the body is made to recognize and attack something that just also happens to look like the person's own tissue (nervous in this case). If the vaccine "causes" Guillain-Barre in a certain person, it is becuase that vaccine looks like the virus that would have also caused it. So, in the case of influenza, you are likely to be exposed to the same antigen that could cause Guillain-Barre, whether is is from the actual virus or from the vaccine. What is the point of saying the vaccine causes Guillain-Barre when in fact so would exposure to the actual virus?



    Quote Originally Posted by TexasStudent View Post
    I am surprised that no one has commented on this yet. I guess people are starting to see the truth. Do you think the presidents of the US, Canada, and Mexico would have held a summit in a city where there is a huge outbreak? That makes no sense; this is all lie to try to get people to take drugs that can lead to death. When you put all the facts together, including birth control studies being conducted by agencies such as the Population Council and the WHO, it becomes quite clear.
    Quote Originally Posted by TexasStudent View Post

    In this new link, see the video with Dr. Roby ********, who said that he stopped recommending the swine flu vaccine after he read the package insert and learned that, amongst many things, the vaccine was never proven effective, that it causes Guillain-Barre Syndrome, and that despite pregnant women being the number one target, it was never tested in this group of women.

    Pregnant Women Miscarriage After H1N1 Vaccine noworldsystem.com

    Here is another link for you to enjoy.
    O Administration Launches Deceptive Swine Flu Propaganda Blitz

    "You do not truly understand something unless you can explain it to your grandmother." Albert Einstein

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    acgtacgtacgt's Avatar
    acgtacgtacgt is offline Ultimate Member
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    So, you are saying a terrible death is better than a miscarriage?

    "You do not truly understand something unless you can explain it to your grandmother." Albert Einstein

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    TexasStudent is offline Member 510 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by acgtacgtacgt View Post
    I am shaking my head and rolling my eyes... Regarding Guillain-Barre, this is a disease when the body is made to recognize and attack something that just also happens to look like the person's own tissue (nervous in this case). If the vaccine "causes" Guillain-Barre in a certain person, it is becuase that vaccine looks like the virus that would have also caused it. So, in the case of influenza, you are likely to be exposed to the same antigen that could cause Guillain-Barre, whether is is from the actual virus or from the vaccine. What is the point of saying the vaccine causes Guillain-Barre when in fact so would exposure to the actual virus?
    If you are shaking your head and rolling your eyes, it is probably because you do not understand. Before making your arguments, you should research the topic well, then present your case in a logical, concise, and scientific manner.

    You write that the vaccine looks like the virus. What in the world are you talking about? This shows that you do not know the exact contents of vaccines. This also shows that you are making stuff up just to try to come up with an argument. You write that in the case of influenza, you are likely to be exposed to the same antigen that could cause Guillain-Barre, whether it is from the actual virus or from the vaccine. If this were true, it would mean that the swine flu virus would cause Guillain-Barre, but this is not the case. All cases of Guillain-Barre manifest after receipt of the vaccine, not before. In addition, if it were true, the CDC would list Guillain-Barre or neuropathies as a symptom. Here is what the CDC has to say:

    "What are the signs and symptoms of this virus in people?
    The symptoms of 2009 H1N1 flu virus in people include fever, cough, sore throat, runny or stuffy nose, body aches, headache, chills and fatigue. Some people may have vomiting and diarrhea. People may be infected with the flu, including 2009 H1N1 and have respiratory symptoms without a fever. Severe illnesses and deaths have occurred as a result of illness associated with this virus."

    As I have stated here before, a simple check of any random prescription drug would show that the drug causes these same symptoms.

    So, to ask, what the point is in saying the vaccine causes Guillain-Barre when in fact so would exposure to the actual virus shows that you do not know what you are talking about because exposure to the virus does not cause Guillain-Barre Syndrome. A simple search would have prevented you from writing incorrect statements.

    Also, the point in saying that the vaccine causes the disease is due to the fact that the manufacturers state this fact in their own documents and package inserts. In addition, both Robbins and Harrison's state that Guillain-Barre Syndrome can be caused by immunizations, especially the swine flu vaccine. And nowhere in those texts is written that the syndrome can be caused by the swine flu virus.

    Also:
    Guillain-Barre syndrome occurring after rabies vac... [J Pak Med Assoc. 2005] - PubMed result
    Guillain-Barré syndrome following influenza vaccin... [JAMA. 2004] - PubMed result

    This is part of what Robbins has to say about Guillain-Barre:

    "A similar inflammatory disease of peripheral nerves can be induced in experimental animals by immunization with peripheral nerve myelin or its components. A T cell-mediated immune reponse ensues, accompanied by segmental demyelination induced by activated macrophages. Transfer of these T cells to a naive animal results in comparable lesions. Moreover, lymphocytes from patients with Guillain-Barre syndrome have been shown to produce demyelination in tissue cultures of myelinated nerve fibers."

    Now, if you had known this and if you had known that cholesterol is needed to myelinate neurons, you would see the connection, especially if you had known that squalene is a precursor to cholesterol, and if you had known that squalene is an ingredient in many vaccines.

    A wise UAG professor once said to me, just because I am a doctor and I am teaching medical students, I would never assume that there are no students in my class that may be more knowledgeable about the subject I teach. I share this because I get the impression that you feel that there is no one here that could be more knowledgeable about certain topics than you. Do not be so arrogant to presume that there are no people here who have done exensive research and studied extensively various topics. You may know a little about me, but you have no idea of my educational, work, and research experiences.

  9. #9
    TexasStudent is offline Member 510 points
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    If one really studies science and medicine, and then is able to apply the knowledge gained, one will see that many of the common beliefs do not stand up to scientific scrutiny. The theory of viruses as disease-causing entities is a perfect example. Those of you reading this will find this difficult to believe because you have been so brainwashed into believing that viruses cause disease. However, if one studies extensively the history of all the viruses that are said to cause disease, one would find that the actual cause of disease was not due to a virus. One of the many flaws in the viral theory of disease, I know turn to.

    If we are to believe that viruses are made up of protein that coat genetic material, it is not possible for these viruses to cause disease through the mucous membranes because proteins cannot cross membranes. The theory of disease causation by viruses ignores this basic fact of physiology. Proteins must be broken down to amino acids before they can cross membranes. If viruses could cross mucous membranes, it would mean that you could put a piece of meat against those membranes and it would slowly be absorbed. The belief that one can contract a viral infection through the respiratory tract is one of the biggest flaws in the viruses as disease causing agents theory based on this fact alone.

    Practically all of the Type II, Type III, and Type IV Hypersensitivity reactions come from the direct placement of proteins into the blood by vaccines and other injections. If the body is making antigen-antibody complexes, the only way it could do so is by the direct placement of foreign antigens into the blood. Even the pathology texts state that diseases such as idiopathic thrombocytopenic purpura and glomerulonephritis can be caused by immunizations.

    Where do the beliefs that viruses can infect through the respiratory tract come from? Well they come from people who are perpetuating the lies in order to come up with an explanation to questions that thinking people ask.

    A common example is the explanation that they have come up with to explain why an AIDS epidemic like they had predicted back in the 1980s never developed. To explain this, they came up with the "discoveries" that our bodies have a receptor to HIV and that a large population of the people of the planet have a mutation to the receptor; therefore, the virus cannot attach to the receptor to enter cells. Well, if you buy this, it ignores the basics of evolutionary biology and genetics.

    1. If this were true, it would mean that the body has in its genome the gene for a receptor that causes its own destruction.

    2. It would mean that HIV is endogenous because the body does not make receptors to exogenous proteins. Now, there are humans receptor proteins to proteins that are found in other species, but they do cause destruction of the body; they serve a specific function that is necessary for the health of the body.

    3. It would mean that this gene for an HIV receptor would be found in other animals, which would mean that there would be animal models of AIDS. And to date, no one has been able to induce AIDS in other animals.

    To believe these points would mean that one has to ignore the teachings of evolutionary biology, genetics, physiology, and biochemistry.

    One's understanding of science is not how well you can repeat what is repeated over and over again. One's understanding of science comes when one is able to understand the basics and apply those basics to determine fact from fiction. If we were not able to do that, we would still believe that scurvy, beri-beri, and pellagra were caused by infectious agents, as most doctors and scientists believed 100 years ago. Anyone who dared question that belief was labeled a loon and laughed at, but they turned out to be right, and the people who thought they were high and mighty and knew it all turned out to be wrong.

    I have asked several times before, at what point do we acknowledge that the plethora of chemicals that we are exposed to in our food, water, drugs, etc are responsible for many of the ailments that we have? If these viruses and bacteria caused the diseases that they are said to cause, the diseases would be seen in similar numbers across all species of animals. But since the other animals are not exposed to the same amount of chemicals that we are exposed to, you don't see the same problems in them. This is not rocket science. If, in testing a new drug, one sees the same symptoms and side effects in those animals as is seen in humans, then it does not take a genius to figure out that other animals should come down with the same problems, from viruses and bacteria, as humans in the same numbers.

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    TexasStudent is offline Member 510 points
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    If you really want to know why the body suffers various problems, you really need to study the various sciences very well so that you can apply what you learn. It takes many years to accomplish this, not just a college degree and a medical degree. This is something that I have done. I now relay a conversation that I had with someone the other day.

    This person told me that they had a bizarre dream (occultish) the other night and they wanted to know if I had any idea why they would be dreaming something like that. My first response to this person was that the consumption of some chemical, possibly coupled to certain nutrient deficiencies, is the cause. I said, knowing that it is a common drug, that nexium can cause these bizarre dreams. They said that they did not take this drug but that they took prilosec. My response was that any of the prazoles will cause bizarre dreams. I then proceeded to show them the side effects of prilosec, which included hallucinations and abnormal dreams. They were quite shocked to see these side effects.

    Now how did I know this about the prazoles? It is not becaue I read the side effects of these class of drugs, because I did not; I didn't need to. All I needed to know is that there is a certain class of compounds that causes these symptoms and that the molecular structure of the prazoles is made up in part of this class of chemical. I had never checked the side effects of prilosec before, but sure enough those side effects were there. I will leave it to you, the reader, to discover what part of the molecule can cause these symptoms and to what class of compound it belongs to.

    If you want to know why a drug has a particular side effect, you should start with looking at the molecular structure of the drug.

    Most people think that there is some mystery to having bad dreams; there is no mystery. How your body acts is dependent upon what you put inside it.

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