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  1. #1
    dr_tintin is offline Newbie 510 points
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    Some facts about Russia

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    Dear Friends
    I have been a regular poster in this forum 2 years ago..my Username was Drtintin .After that I got more involed in my clinics and stopped writing in valueMd...I had some probs with my prev username thats why I m writing under my my present user name

    At present I am a 4th year student at St Petersburg State Medical Academy ........After coming back to Valuemd after a year I see lot of posts and queries about Russia
    In this thread I ll try my best to stay as much unbaised as I can and will try to put some light in the main negative issues concerning Russia
    1 Skinhead/racist problems
    The racist problem in Russia is totally political ....Russia has the second highest number of immigrants in this world ...they are manily poor people from CIS countries ,Afganistan and China who have migrated to big Russian cities for better income ......They are called "Kabkaz" by the Russians.

    Some political parties(some opponents of president Putin) use this racial issue to gain political support.
    They complian about the high crime rates by the "kabkaz", their "dirty unhygenic habits" (which are to some extent true)etc and consider that immigrants are responsible for most problems in Russia and thus have the slogans
    "lets clean our city from all these garbage" and "Rusia only for Russians".

    These political parties brainwash some young Rusians under neo-nazism and make them attack the non-whites .....foreign Students and tourists are not their targets ,their hot targets are the central Asian immigrants ...but unfortunately occasionally foreign students (non whites) are attacked.

    However United Russia (president Putin's party ) the ruling party with about 70% votes are totally against it...The General Russians are not racist but in general they are not interested in foreigners unless he/she is from a country with rich European cultural heritage (mainly Italy,UK and Germany)

    Now how is the situation for a non-white foreign Student?
    Well I am a non-white Indian student studing here for 4 years ....I always hear about skinheads ....but I have never been attacked by any sort of skinheads, holligans etc ...
    There has been instances when I have been out alone at midnight at -20 digrees ..never faced any problem .

    Majority of my nonwhite friends have similar experiences.....but to tell you the truth 2% complain about attacks and slangs by racists .....Now these 98% who have never met a skinhead in life create a big story from a simple one ...exagerate it like anything and thus the Rumors spread ...and a newcomer in Russia is completely confused about what to do ...I can see many such exagerations in this forum ...so here is the simple gist of what I want to say:

    The racist problem is there in Russia but it generally dosent concern a foreign student ...and the problem is highly exagerated in this forum.

    In order to stay in safe side
    You just need to follow the normal safety rules that you must follow in any metropolitan city ...you must avoid nightclubs and bars at midnight

    You can look into travel website like like lonelyplanet and Waytorussia.net for details
    According to the Lonely planet big Russian cities are "as safe and as dangerous as other bigcities like Newyork and London"

    Spoken English by the faculty
    This is a big problem in many schools ....if you choose a Russian try to get information when the school started english medium faculty (this applies for any nonenglish speaking country)...most Russian Schools have started english medium faculty recently and hence their english is not that good .... ....following schools in Russia dont have problems with English 1 Kursk (first to start english in Russia) 2 Mechnikov(St Petersburg)..my school 3 pavlov(st petersburg)
    there many be others I dont know.

    Corruption
    Yes there are few teachers who do accept bribes ...and their numbers are decreasing day by day with the economic development of Russia and the continuous increse of salary of the teachers (this year Putin have increased salaries of Doctors and teachers by almost 150%)

    However someclaims in this forum like "everything goes below desk" etc etc are total rubbish ...today taking bribe by a teacher is an exception not not a common practice as some posters have exagerated ..moreover all depends upon u.....IT HAS NEVER OCCURED that a teacher has asked bribe from a student ..it's the students who try to offer bribes.(However I dont say that its good that a teacher accepts bribe from a student )...

    All depends upon you if want to stayaway from corruption and be true to yourself in ur studies no one is going to indulge you in corruption in Russia.

    Mafia
    Mafia is NOT AT ALL A PROBLEM for foreign students in Russia(as anywhere else in the world)....Russian mafias have far far bigger fishes to catch than Foreign students ,tourists and medical schools.

    Medical Infastructure
    (from what I heard from freinds )
    In short much inferior than North America and Western Europe ...far superior than developing countries like India ,China...far superior to other CIS countries (Ukraine Belarus included..I have been there ) and Romania (have friends who have transfered from there ) similar to Poland (I went to Warsaw for a project last year ) ...I dont have much Info but it must be a bit inferior to Hungary.
    However somethings things must be noted :

    This is about general govt medical facilities (there are some govt Hosps that are at par and sometimes better than many in the western world )

    Russian health care is completely free for Russians so its unwise to compare these state funded facilities with those in N America and West ...where they dam expensive.....

    If you go to Russian Private hospitals they are same in quality to any good N American Hospital(according to the website of US counsolate in St Petersburg and Moscow )...however they will charge you almost the same amont (some times even more )as they do in west and N America.

    Moreover facilities have improved a lot with the improvement of economy ...and these years the Govt are spending a lot in the Healthcare budget..unlike during the 90s ...The modern medical facilities like Ultra sound , radio neucleotide assay, CT ,MRI are readily available in general city Hospitals while expensive ones like Elctronmicroscopes are found in Big ones(our academy has two of them ).

    Facilities wont be a problem for an UNDERGRADUATE medico.

    Economy of Russia
    Tt really surprises when some of the ignorant posters call Russia to be a poor country while the same ones call China and India to be the most advancing economies today.....however advancement they make ..still today their GDP per capita is about two times(China) and four times (India) less than Russia .

    Moscow St Petersburg and some other big Russian Cities have infrastructure(transport communications and other modern facilities etc) that can be compared with any city in the West .(you can reconfirm this from travel websites) ...Infact I can bet MOSCOW is more developed and modern than ANY city in Eastern Europe (plz EE students take no offense )
    But same cant be said about the small towns and Rural areas ..they have along way to go before they catches their western counterparts .

    With this I ll end .....I welcome any constructive criticism ...but believe me I have tried my best to stay as unbaised as possible
    I know that Russian Medical education has some problems but still quite satisfied with the quality of education I am getting in Russia (Atleast I am learning far better medicine than i would have learnt in my own country) and I consider Russian Medicine today to be one of the best in the world in certain fields like Orthopaedics, Neurology, Opthalmology , Laser Therapy and Space Medicine -for their diagnostic and treatment approach.

    If you have any other question fell free to post
    ...
    Last edited by dr_tintin; 07-06-2006 at 08:47 PM.

  2. #2
    xxatti is offline Member 510 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by dr_tintin
    The racist problem is there in Russia but it generally dosent concern a foreign student ...and the problem is highly exagerated in this forum.

    In order to stay in safe side
    You just need to follow the normal safety rules that you must follow in any metropolitan city ...you must avoid nightclubs and bars at midnight
    So let me get this straight... most times everything is ok, but at night you must lock yourself inside, stay off the streets, and avoid going out to bars and nightclubs ?? Sorry, but if that's how foreigners have to live in Russia then I'd rather be someplace else. What good is being someplace where you cant even go out at night and enjoy yourself for fear of being attacked by crazy skinheads/hooligans?

    BTW, I find it hard to believe that things are being so exaggerated over there... especially when the Russian govt supposedly asked the UN to send a racism expert to evaluate the rising racism problems over there. http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?NewsID=18807&Cr=Russia&Cr1=

  3. #3
    dr_tintin is offline Newbie 510 points
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    I have a request xxatti , if you want discussion you are welcome but please stay away from debates...i hate debates

    First of all
    Not at night but at midnight.....
    that's a precoutionery measure for safety which I think any foreigner should take in any country......My brother who lives in Philadelphia was once beaten up by holligans at night ...though in 99% of cases you wont be beaten up at night...there is no reason that you should be taking extra risk of regularly flocking out at midnight when a normal student should sleep after his/her studies .

    Can you tell me a reason for which I will make up a story of "exageration"? When I and my community is supposedly at risk ?...yes I may be an agent attracting students to Russia ....Had it been so I would have told that there are NO Racism NO corruption No eveil in Russia today...and from my experience I can say that I could still find Chicks coming me.....there are people from various parts of E Europe(romania, Hungary,slovakia etc)they all say that their school is almost fine ...I have met many people from those countries who have complains about the system there but none of those problems are reflected here in this forum..

    .since I have told the probs of Russia it appears in Russia things are bad and else where things are good ...that is what I call...... where knowledge is bliss many a time ignorance is taken to be a sign of profundity ....

    About the UN experts ...I never said that racism dosent exsist in Russia ...I said that the main target of Racism are the foreign community from CIS China and other poorer country who have parmanently settled in Russia and that the foreign students are rarely targeted...such a form of racism exsists in most parts of Europe .... UK, France ,Denmark,serbia , Germany where ever there is a multi-ethnic community ..the manifestations may vary

  4. #4
    gawtti's Avatar
    gawtti is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by dr_tintin
    I consider Russian Medicine today to be one of the best in the world in certain fields like Orthopaedics...
    hello dr. tintin, great to have you back. i agree that racism occurs in any country due the influx of immigrants. i know it exsists here in debrecen where i'm studying but maybe not as much as in russia. some of my nigerian friends have personally experienced this on many occasions but it isn't that bad.

    anyway, i want to ask you about the level of education in the field of orthopedics in russia. could you please elaborate on your above statement please? also, how would you rate the ortho department at your school? and can you supply your school's website? i'm interested in ortho and hungary seems to lack in that area of medicine. your response is appreciated. thanks.
    You Can Do it!http://tiny.cc/ju97ex

  5. #5
    xxatti is offline Member 510 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by dr_tintin
    I have a request xxatti , if you want discussion you are welcome but please stay away from debates...i hate debates

    First of all
    Not at night but at midnight.....
    that's a precoutionery measure for safety which I think any foreigner should take in any country......My brother who lives in Philadelphia was once beaten up by holligans at night ...though in 99% of cases you wont be beaten up at night...there is no reason that you should be taking extra risk of regularly flocking out at midnight when a normal student should sleep after his/her studies .

    Can you tell me a reason for which I will make up a story of "exageration"? When I and my community is supposedly at risk ?...yes I may be an agent attracting students to Russia ....Had it been so I would have told that there are NO Racism NO corruption No eveil in Russia today...and from my experience I can say that I could still find Chicks coming me.....there are people from various parts of E Europe(romania, Hungary,slovakia etc)they all say that their school is almost fine ...I have met many people from those countries who have complains about the system there but none of those problems are reflected here in this forum..

    .since I have told the probs of Russia it appears in Russia things are bad and else where things are good ...that is what I call...... where knowledge is bliss many a time ignorance is taken to be a sign of profundity ....

    About the UN experts ...I never said that racism dosent exsist in Russia ...I said that the main target of Racism are the foreign community from CIS China and other poorer country who have parmanently settled in Russia and that the foreign students are rarely targeted...such a form of racism exsists in most parts of Europe .... UK, France ,Denmark,serbia , Germany where ever there is a multi-ethnic community ..the manifestations may vary
    Im not trying to debate with you. YOU are the one who said you should'nt go out at night... (or after midnight), because of taking "extra risk". I didnt say that, YOU said it. And that's crazy!! That just blows my mind that you couldnt go to a bar or disco on the weekend because of fear that you might be attacked. Who do you know that goes to a bar/disco and comes back home before midnight? Most places I know, if you show up to a disco at midnight, then you're the 1st person in the club.

    And let me tell you, as a (non white) foreigner I've lived in two different European countries and I NEVER had to avoid bars and clubs after midnight, nor did I have to be concerned about walking the streets alone at night. I wasnt taking any "extra risk" by doing those things. I used the metros and walked all over town at all hours of the night... 12, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 in the morning... there were no problems.

    The reason no one talks about all those other countries you mentioned is because 98% of the people here attend or are only interested in attending schools in Czech, Poland, and Hungary. BTW, there was a thread on racism in Poland a while back too. Lets ask the Polish students if they have to stay away from bars after midnight for fear of putting themselves at "extra risk".

    Quote Originally Posted by dr_tintin
    the foreign students are rarely targeted...such a form of racism exsists in most parts of Europe .... UK, France ,Denmark,serbia , Germany where ever there is a multi-ethnic community ..the manifestations may vary
    Im well aware that racism exist everywhere, but in no other place in the world do reports of such violent racist attacks happen with such frequency like they do in Russia. You never hear about groups of skinheads running around attacking and killing people in the UK.

    But you're right, I cannot debate with you because I have no grounds to do so. You're living there, and I'm not. So if you say that it's not a problem, and it RARELY exist, then I have no choice but to take your word for it. I have no 1st hand experience to say otherwise. I can only go by what native Russians, daily news reports, and people who post on forums like these have to say.

  6. #6
    xxatti is offline Member 510 points
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    On another note: are you studying in English or Russian medium? And you say your facilities are on par with or better than most Central/E Europeon countries. So how would you rate the quality of education at your university (and Russia as a whole) compared to the Central and E European countries... especially in comparison to the more popular destinations like Poland, Czech, Hungary, etc.?

  7. #7
    dr_tintin is offline Newbie 510 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by xxatti
    On another note: are you studying in English or Russian medium? And you say your facilities are on par with or better than most Central/E Europeon countries. So how would you rate the quality of education at your university (and Russia as a whole) compared to the Central and E European countries... especially in comparison to the more popular destinations like Poland, Czech, Hungary, etc.?
    I study in english medium .
    I didnot say that the facilities in GENERAL Russian Hospitals are at par with or better than Central Europe /E Europe hosps .....I said that there are some Exceptional Govt Hospitals whose facilities are at par with or even sometimes better than some Western and North American ones
    (Needlees to say that such exceptional hosps exsist in every european country)

    I said that Russian General Hosps are at par with general Hosps in Poland ....I can say this bcoz i have been to polish hosps last summer......

    But I cant say that about other E European Hosps coz I havent been there ......I have heard from my friend who has transfered from Romania that Russian facilities are better than Romanian ones ...........

    Moreover You must note one more thing by General Hosps I mean common Hosps situated in big Russian Cities like Moscow ,St Petersburg ,Ekaterinburg Vladivostok etc ....I have heard that facilities in Rural Russian Hosps and those in Chechnia are very poor.

    Post Soviet Russia has unfortunately shown unequal development ...while the Big Cities like Moscow St Petersburg Ekaterinburg has grown to an extent that they can be compared with any of their western counterparts (that what most foreign tourists say)....the small towns and villages are stll lagging far behind their western counterparts .

  8. #8
    dr_tintin is offline Newbie 510 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by gawtti
    i want to ask you about the level of education in the field of orthopedics in russia. could you please elaborate on your above statement please? also, how would you rate the ortho department at your school? and can you supply your school's website? i'm interested in ortho and hungary seems to lack in that area of medicine. your response is appreciated. thanks.

    I consider that Russian Orthopedics to be great due to its unique approach in complex situations Knee replacement surgery ,Ellizarov Surgery etc ....since these Techniques were originally discovered in Russia ,,,so Russian Docs are much experienced in these fields (Just like the way the Americans and the French are developed in certain fields of Psycratry )....Their continuous intervention in these fields have led to many innovations in Technique which is to be learnt practically in the OT...and is impossible to learn by reading few litratures ....

    I dont like the Ortho Dept in my Academy ...the professors are very good but the facilities are not worldclass......but in Russia our clinicals are arranged in a bit diffrent way than many other parts of the world.....If I am a student of Mechnikov it dosent mean that I will be attending my clinics only in Mechnikov Hosps ....we are also generally sent to some other afftlated Hospitals that are specialized/superspecialized in the city for that particular field say ortho ...and students from Pavlov may be sometimes sent to the same Specialized Hosp....

    From my experience I like the Ortho Depts of Pavlov , PFU (moscow) , MMA(moscow) and LETI (Post graduate Institute in St Petersburg)

    But I wont recommend you doing ur Post Graduation in Russia (or any non English speaking country)unless you know good Russia ...which I suppose you dont ....In Russia PG can only be done in Russian NOT in English ...however you can get a professor who knows english ...but still I think that when u r doing PG you need to interact with patients in Native language..which will be impossible unless you know the local language
    however if you stiil want to do PG in Russia I ll suggest you to go for subjects in which you need not interact much with the Patients ..like Radiology and Pathology....
    .In our Academy the good Depts for doing PG are Radiology,Radiodiagnostics , Medicine , Gynecology and Laser Therapy but I dont like the administration in our academy .(however the girls are damm sexy....ohhhhh i ll miss them when I leave Russia)

    The official website of our academy is
    www.mechnik.spb.ru
    (The english Version has much less info than the Russian one )


    The Best PG facilities in Russia are mianly located in Moscow ....If you can arrange a seat in Moscow State University (faculty of Medicine ).that will be the best option (apart from the language problem)..Moscow State University is regarded to be the best in Russia and one of the best in the world.

    Can you let me know, just for information .....what are the Depts that are good in your Medical School.for PG ?..I dont have much knowledge about Hungarian Schools...can you officially do PG in Hungary in English langauge?...a year ago I met an exchange student from Hungary in our academy he said facilities dosent differ much between Hungary and Russia ...some approaches do ...but Hungary is a bit richer Country than Russia .
    Last edited by dr_tintin; 07-07-2006 at 12:00 PM.

  9. #9
    gawtti's Avatar
    gawtti is offline Member
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    not post graduate

    actually, i'm just interested in how advanced russia is in ortho. i'm going to do my residency in the usa. but, i was just curious on how good ortho is in russia. i would like to learn a lot, and maybe do some research in this field while im still in med school. it'll help my application when it comes time for residency. since imgs have a very difficult time getting into these fields. it'll be nice to have some research experience in this field before graduating. thanks for your reply.
    You Can Do it!http://tiny.cc/ju97ex

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    pearllysun is offline Newbie 510 points
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    dear dr_tintin :iam a regular observer of ur treads & answers . ur return was most expected by me , since not many russian students drop in here.since im going to join the moscow medical academy i.m.sechenov russian medium i have alot of doubts and trust ur the right person to ask for.i need ur mail id greatly kindly mail me the same at pearllysun@yahoo.co.uk

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