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  1. #1
    Bloor's Avatar
    Bloor is offline Junior Member 518 points
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    Residency options outside the US?

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    Hi there,

    Having waited a year and missing out, I dont think I'd like to wait any longer. Would anyone have experience with residency training provided outside the US? My objective is to get 2 years of English training in say, Family Medicine and then ultimately head to work somewhere.

    Looking at eventual (decade?) settling anywhere. Options seem to be more restricted compared to SGU (e.g. taking PLAB?/UK exams, SGU's partial overseas med program seems a better deal). I've looked at some of the Caribbean islands, NZ, Australia et al but internet research mentions difficulty in securing a position even after taking their local board exams.

    Do have Step 1 and 2; will take Step 3. Have some of the Canadian exams as well.


    - Cheers
    A canuck
    Last edited by Bloor; 02-03-2014 at 11:15 AM.

  2. #2
    kerpal is offline Junior Member 518 points
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    yeah, no

    nice try

  3. #3
    Tricuspid is offline Member 535 points
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    Well you can always apply to Canada if you are Canadian. Otherwise not really. UK is not open to non EU citizen grads of non-UK medical schools for foundation training which you would need.
    Cardiothoracic Surgery Resident

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    devildoc8404's Avatar
    devildoc8404 is offline Ultimate Member 12699 points
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    It largely comes down to whether or not your Carib degree is accepted in a jurisdiction, the languages you speak, and your citizenship. If you are thinking only about English training, then you are not in a very good spot.

    UK is essentially out from the get-go, as Tricuspid mentioned. Ireland is not likely, either, but you would need to check on the acceptance of a Carib degree with the IMC. Malta is out, as they only hire EU citizens. Canada was mentioned above, but come on... Canada is statistically a much harder match than the US for FMGs, so that is not happening.

    If you have the Steps complete you might look at some places in the Middle East, I had some classmates from there and they could return if they completed Step 2, as I recall... but they were from there, so it could be different for non-citizens. And, hey, it is the freaking Middle East.

    Oz and NZ require at least 3 years of post-grad clinical experience.

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  5. #5
    Bloor's Avatar
    Bloor is offline Junior Member 518 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by kerpal View Post
    yeah, no

    nice try
    Quote Originally Posted by Tricuspid View Post
    Well you can always apply to Canada if you are Canadian. Otherwise not really. UK is not open to non EU citizen grads of non-UK medical schools for foundation training which you would need.
    Quote Originally Posted by devildoc8404 View Post
    It largely comes down to whether or not your Carib degree is accepted in a jurisdiction, the languages you speak, and your citizenship. If you are thinking only about English training, then you are not in a very good spot.

    UK is essentially out from the get-go, as Tricuspid mentioned. Ireland is not likely, either, but you would need to check on the acceptance of a Carib degree with the IMC. Malta is out, as they only hire EU citizens. Canada was mentioned above, but come on... Canada is statistically a much harder match than the US for FMGs, so that is not happening.

    If you have the Steps complete you might look at some places in the Middle East, I had some classmates from there and they could return if they completed Step 2, as I recall... but they were from there, so it could be different for non-citizens. And, hey, it is the freaking Middle East.

    Oz and NZ require at least 3 years of post-grad clinical experience.
    Excellent replies guys (yes even you kerpal), and very detailed information devildoc, thank you.

    I've looked at the Caribbean itself a means to get started however. Grenada for example is a viable option for SGU graduates. The objective would be to complete a residency and aim for a provisional provincial license in Canada (see Our Resources | Society of Rural Physicians of Canada - www.srpc.ca)

    The road seems long but I've been known to be quite stubborn.


    - Cheers


    EDIT 1: From what I read, prior to 2005?, a postgrad from Trinidad for example would have received a GMC from the UK but of course that route has closed due to EU regulations.

    EDIT 2: Also need to mention that the provincial regulations I read (http://www.cpsa.ab.ca/Services/Regis...l_Licence.aspx) generally mention a 24 month residency but the Caribbean would only provide a 12 month internship option. Not sure if the two would be equivalent. Surprisingly enough Newfoundland does permit for a 12 month program (http://www.cpsnl.ca/default.asp?com=Pages&id=117&m=319) but care must be taken to ensure your residency program has all the requisite weeks needed in each of the required fields.

    EDIT 3: Good laaawd, another option would be to apply for medical school all over again in Canada. Not even sure if I'd be accepted or if they'd want a candidate who's already passed all his Canadian boards. (EE, NAC, QE1)
    Last edited by Bloor; 02-03-2014 at 05:59 PM.

  6. #6
    medic300107's Avatar
    medic300107 is offline Supermedic Moderator 10497 points
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    Just to make it clear any training outside the US can NOT be used in the US. You would have to repeat residency in the U.S.
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    Bloor's Avatar
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    Appreciate the reply, medic. I understand the ramifications of this decision but as a Canadian must be cognizant of student loans to pay back...

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    devildoc8404's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by medic300107 View Post
    Just to make it clear any training outside the US can NOT be used in the US. You would have to repeat residency in the U.S.
    In most cases, yeah. There are a few exceptions, however. For example, Irish/British GP training receives direct reciprocity with the ABFM (assuming completion of the USMLE Steps, etc.). Additionally, there are Alternate Pathway programs for foreign-trained radiologists and anesthesiologists that involve the completion of fellowships and faculty service in exchange for US board certification.

    These are rare outliers, however, and in general the point made by medic300107 stands.

    "When I haven't any
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    - Pablo Picasso

    BA - Oregon MS - BYU MD - MU-Sofia
    Clinical Research Fellow / Resident
    Fleet Marine Force Hospital Corpsman 1996-2003


  9. #9
    Bloor's Avatar
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    ^^ IIRC you do have a convoluted route to obtain UK licensure (even from a non EU citizen perspective)
    FAQs for doctors - NHS Careers

    So in a roundabout Chris Columbus way, would you eventually be able to practice in the States via reciprocity?

  10. #10
    devildoc8404's Avatar
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    IFF you could get trained as a GP in England, or either of the Irelands, or Wales, or Scotland, which is really-really (really) difficult if you are not a UK or EU citizen -- (How difficult? Difficult enough that British recruiters told me "Not a chance in hell, mate" at a medical fair, and I speak the language pretty damn well) -- then, assuming you passed the USMLE Steps, you would be able to get direct reciprocity in Family Medicine in the US. Note that it does not work like that with the US boards for other specialties.

    The first part of that pathway is by far your limiting factor, however. Marry a saucy Brit or a sultry European, or find a path to EU citizenship through your ancestry, and that problem fades away a mite. Otherwise, it is a veritable brick wall. Yes, people have occasionally come on VMD talking about getting hired in the UK as a non-citizen, but note that these are NOT residency positions. They are temporary, usually locum, house officer positions that do not count toward a specialty.

    "When I haven't any
    blue... I use red
    ."
    - Pablo Picasso

    BA - Oregon MS - BYU MD - MU-Sofia
    Clinical Research Fellow / Resident
    Fleet Marine Force Hospital Corpsman 1996-2003


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