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  1. #1
    popozao is offline Permanently Banned 510 points
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    realistic residency expectations...?

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    if you compared a US student with a carib fmg, stats/scores being equal, with step 1 score of 225, lets say.

    how much better off would the US student be? Would he generally get a much better program? I mean, how much better?

    A 225 isn't bad, nor is it good. So is the fmg stuck with mediocre residencies?

    What is the unwritten conversion scale that you've observed, i.e a 225 fmg score = 200 US score?

    And where does the glass ceiling lie in terms of quality of residency? Is it extremely difficult for fmg's to get into academic programs?

    Does anyone have any insight?

  2. #2
    making_success is offline Junior Member 512 points
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    I don't have good insight, given I haven't secured a single residency interview after 1.5 weeks. However, common sense to me says that as an IMG your chances will always be less than the equivalent-score US grad precisely for a few reasons: 1) US grads have been through a "proven" medical school, 2) Through some institutional form of nepotism, US grads will be favored over IMG's because a majority of PD's are US grads, 3) An unwritten mindset exists that if you are an IMG, you were not the highest quality student to begin with (b/c you were not able to secure a US medical school position). As a result, there is a mindset that suggests you are a high-risk candidate. 4) US grads take standardized clinical clerkships, whereas most IMG's take an equivalent which doesn't come close to the level or quality of US medical school clerkships. 5) Think about it. If I had to choose, I'd first look at US grads before looking at IMG's. This is just common sense (even though, obviously, many IMG's are excellent residents precisely because they have to bust their behinds to prove themselves, but, from what I have seen, despite their industry, IMGs are really not as academically "gifted," if you will, as US grads, despite how lazy US grads really are. Further, some IMGs are just slightly off, where something just isn't right.)

    Stop worrying and just apply...You'll do fine with the scores you have.
    Last edited by making_success; 11-04-2006 at 09:51 PM.

  3. #3
    popozao is offline Permanently Banned 510 points
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    actually, i'm not in the application phase yet. I still have a year to go.

    I'm just wondering how much work I should put in. If i'm gonna bust my butt and still end up in a (small) community program, then I might as well kick back now if it's not gonna make much of a difference. I'm just a middle of the pack student. What does this mean? will i be limited to 3rd tier residency programs?

    When you look at match lists for the various big carib schools.... are most people in 3rd tier residency programs? How do you determine the rank of these programs?


    and lastly, a US student with 225 probably will be able to get into anesthesia. But the fmg probably will not huh?
    Last edited by popozao; 11-04-2006 at 10:31 PM.

  4. #4
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    swimguy23 is offline Elite Member 516 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by popozao View Post
    actually, i'm not in the application phase yet. I still have a year to go.

    I'm just wondering how much work I should put in. If i'm gonna bust my butt and still end up in a (small) community program, then I might as well kick back now if it's not gonna make much of a difference. I'm just a middle of the pack student. What does this mean? will i be limited to 3rd tier residency programs?

    When you look at match lists for the various big carib schools.... are most people in 3rd tier residency programs? How do you determine the rank of these programs?


    and lastly, a US student with 225 probably will be able to get into anesthesia. But the fmg probably will not huh?
    it depends on a lot of factors. If there is somewhere you really want to go, try and rotate there
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  5. #5
    doctormua is offline Permanently Banned 510 points
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    225

    a 225 is actually a great score, it's above the national average of 217 or so. it's really good for a caribbean grad, since most caribbean grads score between 190-210. so, you can get anesthesia...............maybe not a top notch program, but if you apply to a LOT of places, you'll match somewhere, maybe in the south or somewhere...........but u'll match........

  6. #6
    MushieCookie is offline Senior Member
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    ...

    Quote Originally Posted by doctormua View Post
    a 225 is actually a great score, it's above the national average of 217 or so. it's really good for a caribbean grad, since most caribbean grads score between 190-210. so, you can get anesthesia...............maybe not a top notch program, but if you apply to a LOT of places, you'll match somewhere, maybe in the south or somewhere...........but u'll match........
    The KEY is to do a rotation at the place where you want to match. If you are unable to do a rotation at this place, pick somewhere that has a residency program attached to where you will be rotating.
    There's nothing like getting a GREAT LOR from an attending, or PD, at a place where there is a residency program...and the letter writer can compare you to your US counterparts (although it probably won't say this explicitly in the LOR).
    If you take one thing away from all this...get a GREAT LOR (work your tail off; i.e. come in early, and stay late) from somewhere there is a residency program attached to where you will be rotating. This can, and will, help you out tremendously.

    (You still may not match at your #1, but I guarantee that you will get more interview offers than you would otherwise!!)

    It's a game...play it right.

  7. #7
    Chianti is offline Senior Member
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    A 225 is an excellent USMLE score.

    Assuming you do comparably well on Step 2 (210+) and have solid letters of rec., you will NO PROBLEM AT ALL matching anesthisiology and have a GREAT shot to match at a good university program. I remember a Ross student a few years back who had a similiar STep 1 and 2 score and got something like 25+ anesthesiology interviews- all at major universities (Wake Forest, Ohio State, Florida etc...). I personally know a Ross grad who was disappointed that he ended up matching at SUNY-Downstate. You're in a good position. Good luck!!!

  8. #8
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    grace is offline Elite Member 510 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by popozao View Post
    I'm just wondering how much work I should put in. If i'm gonna bust my butt and still end up in a (small) community program, then I might as well kick back now if it's not gonna make much of a difference. I'm just a middle of the pack student. What does this mean? will i be limited to 3rd tier residency programs?
    You should definitely still work your butt off. I'm sure you've worked hard until this point, why not try your hardest and see what happens? Who knows, you might change your mind regarding specialties and decide to try for something more competitive later on. The above posters are very correct regarding the value of good LOR's, especially from sites where you might eventually like to practice.

  9. #9
    grace's Avatar
    grace is offline Elite Member 510 points
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    You might want to check this website out to give you an idea of average scores for various specialties. This link was posted on another thread in this forum.

    http://www.nrmp.org/matchoutcomes.pdf

  10. #10
    popozao is offline Permanently Banned 510 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by grace View Post
    You might want to check this website out to give you an idea of average scores for various specialties. This link was posted on another thread in this forum.

    http://www.nrmp.org/matchoutcomes.pdf

    ive seen that b4.
    it's not very informative for carib fmgs. notice how fmgs only get a small piece of the pie in most specialties

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