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  1. #1
    Shiz77's Avatar
    Shiz77 is offline Elite Member 671 points
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    Hospital cuts reversed

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    "I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies... " - ****** Jefferson

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    AmericanIMG's Avatar
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    thats nice. cracking down on medicare fraud will save a TON more money and keep the ranks staffed.
    -
    i am guessing a 30-40% pay cut in specialists over the next decade. any one else think the same?
    but remember that, even when those who move you be kings or men of power, your soul is in your keeping alone. When you stand before God you cannot say "but I was told by others to do thus" or that "virtue was not convenient at the time." This will not suffice. Remember that.

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    WendyMBBS is offline Permanently Banned 517 points
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    Its way too early to say if that will happen. I see specialist income as more a supply and demand issue. It really all depends, and I really doubt Specialist income will drop relative to PCP income. I am more worried about NPs and PAs doing what most primary care doctors do. So does this mean that IMGs will still be able to get residencies in the US? Everything I hear is so discouraging lately.

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    Chopdoc is offline Senior Member 528 points
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    "Supply and demand" would imply certain economics that it would seem the powers that be wish to remove from medicine and health care in general.

    NPs and PAs were created specifically to fill the gap in primary care docs. That was the overt intent of the creation of those fields. They did not arise by any natural evolution of a field of practice. That being said....this has been a coming reality for decades.

    What can we do? Hard to say. But I do believe that replacing the role of the physician with PAs and NPs only compromises care.....after all, it is by nature a compromise.

    Do I think specialist income will go down? Certainly. Ideally it will affect those at the top the most. The lower end, I hope, will not change. I don't think there should be a "ceiling", but perhaps it should be harder to earn astronomical and (IMHO) undeserved incomes from specialty medical practice.

    Now, of course, that is limited to payment for medical care.....for those docs who are in the business end....well....that's business....I don't think we can touch that directly....nor should we.

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    GLOBALMED is offline Senior Member
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    ..........
    Last edited by GLOBALMED; 11-26-2010 at 04:38 PM.

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    Chopdoc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GLOBALMED View Post
    But that includes every private practice group....at that level they are all businesses.
    Of course medical practice is business. I excluded medical practice specifically. When I said "business end" I did not mean practice, I thought that was clear.

    Obviously many physicians earn income from non-medical practice business. Please note that such business can be in health care and yet not be medical practice. Simply having an ownership interest in a group practice in which one practices is not just a business pursuit, it is practice. Owning a clinic, nursing home, MRI, medical supply company, etc is not practice unless one is providing medical care in that setting. Hence, such things can be and often are purely business and not practice even though the person with ownership interest happens to be a physician.

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    AmericanIMG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WendyMBBS View Post
    Its way too early to say if that will happen.
    incorrect, it's already being proposed at the govt levels. when the VA/Medicare system drops payouts, insurance companies follow suit.
    but remember that, even when those who move you be kings or men of power, your soul is in your keeping alone. When you stand before God you cannot say "but I was told by others to do thus" or that "virtue was not convenient at the time." This will not suffice. Remember that.

  8. #8
    WendyMBBS is offline Permanently Banned 517 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chopdoc View Post
    "Supply and demand" would imply certain economics that it would seem the powers that be wish to remove from medicine and health care in general.

    NPs and PAs were created specifically to fill the gap in primary care docs. That was the overt intent of the creation of those fields. They did not arise by any natural evolution of a field of practice. That being said....this has been a coming reality for decades.

    What can we do? Hard to say. But I do believe that replacing the role of the physician with PAs and NPs only compromises care.....after all, it is by nature a compromise.

    Do I think specialist income will go down? Certainly. Ideally it will affect those at the top the most. The lower end, I hope, will not change. I don't think there should be a "ceiling", but perhaps it should be harder to earn astronomical and (IMHO) undeserved incomes from specialty medical practice.

    Now, of course, that is limited to payment for medical care.....for those docs who are in the business end....well....that's business....I don't think we can touch that directly....nor should we.
    Supply and Demand affects doctor incomes even in countries with socialized medicine. Even in those countries where the government pays doctors, if there is a shortage of certain physicians their pay goes up. British PCPs have seen their income double over the last 8 years because of this.

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    Chopdoc's Avatar
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    Yes I understand that, but I don't feel that is based on natural economics. It is synthetic and manipulated. I am familiar with the NHS. I'm confident you wouldn't have me believe that it isn't dysfunctional financially especially in terms of compensation of physicians, GPs or otherwise.

    To put it more plainly: We have a serious shortage of primary care doctors in the US. You wouldn't have me believe that under the proposed quasi-socialized systems we should expect their incomes to double....would you?

    If you would then I might that is a mighty optimistic application of imagination.....

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