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Thread: Best for the Profession or Best for the Public?

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    AgActual's Avatar
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    Best for the Profession or Best for the Public?

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    I'll tell you, the guy that runs my school is really pounding away at this issue, as of late. He is traveling the country, giving speeches, testifying at state legislatures, giving interviews, and apparently now, writing articles. The man wants chiropractic to have an expanded scope and he seems hell bent on seeing it happen.

    Best for the Profession or Best for the Public?

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    khiro is offline Member 512 points
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    go back and read my post where i blasted the ICA and ACA for holding back chiropractic. where i specifically mentioned how the DOs transtitioned into PCP; where i specifically wrote about how PAs and NPs were medicating the pts of chiropractors and speaking ill of us whenever an opportunity allows; where i specifically wrote that it is long past time for the profession to move forward. i feel good knowing that i stand in the company of dr. w. this profession needs many more men (and women) like him.

    it is a sad day indeed when you have to read or experience the kind of nonsense that happened in new mexico, and how the straights from life and others came out to oppose any progress.

    about 4 or 5 yrs ago the FCA was really close to establishing a chiro research center at FSU; hopefully leading to a state supported chiro school in the future. although we do have a research center at another college, it did not happen at FSU. why? 2 reasons. one, a very strong and influential drive by a large orthopedic group in tallahassee (we are talking very large and lots of money but wait, i thought that mds didn't dislike us anymore. think again), and for reason number 2 surprise, palmer. palmer wanted their own school in florida (and they established one). there are not enough words to describe my disgust with the politics of this profession.

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    Its no secret MD's dislike chiropractors. They dont practice evidence based medicine. If you seriously believe in evidence based medicine you discount chiropractic. The idea of them prescribing meds without going to medical school and passing the boards is dangerous. If you want to be an MD, fine,please go to med school. There is a reason that not one university medical center has a school for chiropractors, its because very few in mainstream medicine believes it has true value. You can rant and rave all you want, you know its true.
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    Attending Physician

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    CARICOM-MED is offline Permanently Banned 530 points
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    I agree for the most part, however, not much evidence based or science behind Psychiatric drugs for that matter
    For Acute Psychosis perhaps we can argue, but, for most chronic psych conditions I've seen it fail over and over again, in the past 8 years of my clinical practice. Nevertheless, I hope and do wish to see Chiropractors adopt public health, and move forward in the same direction of allopathic medicine. Evidence based is where the future of medicine is moving towards, integrative medicine, is what the public want, hence why not offer both ??

    Cheers !

    Quote Originally Posted by finishingfifth View Post
    Its no secret MD's dislike chiropractors. They dont practice evidence based medicine. If you seriously believe in evidence based medicine you discount chiropractic. The idea of them prescribing meds without going to medical school and passing the boards is dangerous. If you want to be an MD, fine,please go to med school. There is a reason that not one university medical center has a school for chiropractors, its because very few in mainstream medicine believes it has true value. You can rant and rave all you want, you know its true.

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    AgActual's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by finishingfifth View Post
    Its no secret MD's dislike chiropractors. They dont practice evidence based medicine. If you seriously believe in evidence based medicine you discount chiropractic. The idea of them prescribing meds without going to medical school and passing the boards is dangerous. If you want to be an MD, fine,please go to med school. There is a reason that not one university medical center has a school for chiropractors, its because very few in mainstream medicine believes it has true value. You can rant and rave all you want, you know its true.
    Ok but I think that they are proposing that current chiropractors receive an extra 3 years of training before earning prescription privileges. And changing the curriculum of chiropractic programs in order to allow future DCs to know how to prescribe medication once done with school.
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    CARICOM-MED is offline Permanently Banned 530 points
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    GREAT !!
    In that case, why not
    Would also recommend at least 12 months or 1 year of rotating type internship in accredited hospital !

    Cheers,

    Quote Originally Posted by AgActual View Post
    Ok but I think that they are proposing that current chiropractors receive an extra 3 years of training before earning prescription privileges. And changing the curriculum of chiropractic programs in order to allow future DCs to know how to prescribe medication once done with school.

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    Forsaken38 is offline Junior Member 513 points
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    I read once that any MD over 40 will probably hate you. I think it goes back to the training they received in the 80's and previous. The whole not evidence based argument has diminished over time as new data comes available. Chiropractic is very evidence based, those who think it isn't do not have a clue what strides the profession has made in the last 10 years. Do some research, read the peer review journals. The data is there. National has a great peer review journal btw. I read it when I'm not studying.

    Like USHADOC said we have very little research for many psych drugs. I had a long talk with my psychiatry prof about this, he said it boils down to "the more we learn about brain chemistry/ pharmacology, the more we understand how little we know."

    A rotating internship would be great!!

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    AgActual's Avatar
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    I read once that any MD over 40 will probably hate you.
    My chiropractic history professor said the exact same thing at one point.

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    khiro is offline Member 512 points
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    finishingfifth;
    thank you for your post. it is important that agactual and forsaken38 and others who might be interested in entering chiropractic school know of what the average MD thinks of chiropractic. your view is one shared by most MDs who have not worked with chiropractors and pts with back injuries, and although there are a lot of specialities where it doesn't matter what an MD thinks, there are a few where it is extremely important. b/c chiropractic has refused to throw away "subluxation" as the cause of all illness and other out-dated mantras, not only have the medics been against us but it has confused the public almost to the point of beyond repair. no one in chiropractic is recommending prescription rights without education (however we do want the right to "adjust" animals without being a vet?). it is extremely interesting to see the discussion within the ranks of chiropractic education about such changes as drugs. however, with the way things are now in chiropractic i do strongly recommend interested students to carefully weigh the pros and cons of this profession and i am happy to see that you agree with me in recommending that if you want to prescribe then go to med school (MD or DO). i do see why mds and others have credibility issues with chiro b/c i sure do.

    in my years of treating disc injuries i have only found solid support from neurosurgeons. half support from neurologists. zero from orthos. family docs (NP, PA) mostly just get in the way. and i do not treat animals. come to think of it, in 25 yrs of practice i have never told a pt that they have a subluxation. now that is incredible; i was able to build a practice without using the subluxation. from my experience the public could use a well trained chiropractor with prescription rights (i know my town could use one) and i think that UHSADOC has the right plan.


    Quote Originally Posted by finishingfifth View Post
    Its no secret MD's dislike chiropractors. They dont practice evidence based medicine. If you seriously believe in evidence based medicine you discount chiropractic. The idea of them prescribing meds without going to medical school and passing the boards is dangerous. If you want to be an MD, fine,please go to med school. There is a reason that not one university medical center has a school for chiropractors, its because very few in mainstream medicine believes it has true value. You can rant and rave all you want, you know its true.

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    Quote Originally Posted by UHSADOC View Post
    I agree for the most part, however, not much evidence based or science behind Psychiatric drugs for that matter
    For Acute Psychosis perhaps we can argue, but, for most chronic psych conditions I've seen it fail over and over again, in the past 8 years of my clinical practice. Nevertheless, I hope and do wish to see Chiropractors adopt public health, and move forward in the same direction of allopathic medicine. Evidence based is where the future of medicine is moving towards, integrative medicine, is what the public want, hence why not offer both ??

    Cheers !
    I agree there is a high rate of failure for chronic psychosis, the reason is often medication complaince. The same is true of diabetes, the meds work gret, but few pts take them as prescribed with the proper lifestyle modifications, the result is sub- optimal glycemic control in most patients, this neither a failure of the primary care phsycian or the medication, but rather the patient. Pts with psychiatric illness are further complicated by the fact that the intrinsic nature of their illness leads to non compliance. If you require any resources that could help in your practice in the biologic basis of disease and evidence based medicine in psychiatry,please let me know, I will be happy to provde links.

    The truth is I feel bad for chiropractors, I believe most of them are guys trying to make a living selling stuff that in their hearts they know is nonsense. It must wear on them after a while.
    Attending Physician

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