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  1. #1
    anoncan is offline Junior Member
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    thinking of returing to Ontario after residency in the U.S.?

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    Dear Doctor:

    To engage in independent, unsupervised medical practice in Ontario, a physician must hold a certificate of registration for Independent Practice issued by the College.

    The core requirements for an Independent Practice certificate are as follows:

    < Part 1 and Part 2 of the Medical Council of Canada Qualifying Examination.

    < Certification, by examination, by the Royal College of Physicians and Surgeons of Canada or the College of Family Physicians of Canada.

    < Canadian citizenship or landed immigrant status.

    < Completion of one year of clinical clerkship or postgraduate training at a Canadian medical school or one year of active medical practice in Canada.

    As a first step toward registration for medical practice in Ontario, international medical graduates must pass the Medical Council of Canada Evaluating Examination (MCCEE). Please provide us with your mailing address and we will forward an application form and information booklet concerning this examination. Eligibility for Part 1 of the Medical Council of Canada Qualifying Examination is contingent on successful completion of the MCCEE.

    I regret that residency training completed in the United States is not recognized for the purpose of registration in Ontario. From the standpoint of the requirements for an Independent Practice certificate, your specialty completed in the United States would assist you only if it were to qualify you to take the certification examinations of the Royal College of Physicians and Surgeons of Canada (RCPSC). For further information concerning the training requirements and examinations leading to certification, please contact: The Royal College of Physicians and Surgeons of Canada, 774 Echo Drive, Ottawa, Ontario,

    K1S 5N8, Telephone: (613) 730-8177 or 1-800-668-3740.

    To undertake any postgraduate medical training in Ontario, a physician must hold a certificate of registration for Postgraduate Education issued by the College. Successful completion of the MCCEE is one of the basic requirements for a Postgraduate Education certificate.

    Before beginning the application process for a Postgraduate Education certificate, a physician must secure a training appointment at an Ontario medical school. I should point out that opportunities for any postgraduate training in Ontario are extremely limited. You may wish to contact the Ontario postgraduate medical education offices listed in the enclosure for complete information on the availability of training positions. I have also enclosed a list of other postgraduate medical education offices in Canada you may wish to contact. Licensing requirements vary from province to province and you may find that another province offers more opportunity for you to gain entry to practise.

    I trust this information is helpful. You are welcome to write or contact me at (416) 967-2617, extension 221, should you have any questions.

    Sincerely,
    Rose Farrelly
    Inquiries Advisor
    Registration Department

  2. #2
    CanIMG is offline Moderator
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    and...?

    Thanks for the info, but it seems to me that there is nothing new in what you have posted. In fact, Ms. Farrelly only confirms what I have been saying all along: complete a college-approved residency in the US, write the RCPSC exam, do a year of practice somewhere in Canada, and voila. Of course a US residency alone doesn't qualify you to come back to Ontario.
    CanIMG
    Moderator - Canadian IMG and Immigration Visa Forums

  3. #3
    anoncan is offline Junior Member
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    question for CAN IMG

    you write:

    "complete a college-approved residency in the US, write the RCPSC exam, do a year of practice somewhere in Canada, and voila. Of course a US residency alone doesn't qualify you to come back to Ontario."



    you are oversimplyfying the process!


    the EXAMS you have to write when you come back include MCCEE, MCCQE Part 1, MCCQE Part 2 and the Residency Board exam.

    There are other exams depending on what residency you did in the U.S.

    now how will you get one year of practice in Canada? When you do not have a license to practice medicine? a temporary one year license? forget about it. . .no pronvince will grant a temporary license, if you don't believe me then do your research

    so my dear friend, there is no "VOILA"!

    when you come back basically you will be unemployed, desperate and doing odd jobs trying to put food on the table for yourself and you family, no job, no opportunities

    then when that "return to canada for two years' requirement is up, you WILL go back to the U.S. on an H-1B and stay there permanently.

  4. #4
    CanIMG is offline Moderator
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    research

    forget about it. . .no pronvince will grant a temporary license, if you don't believe me then do your research
    In fact I have done some research on various provinces' licensing regulations, and I have not come up with anything that contradicts what i am proposing. I turn the challenge back upon you, to do some research on the subject...I am willing to listen to concrete information describing why the path is not feasible. I will start you off with links to the various provincial licensing authorities:

    http://www.rcpsc.medical.org/english...olleges_e.php3
    CanIMG
    Moderator - Canadian IMG and Immigration Visa Forums

  5. #5
    anoncan is offline Junior Member
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    Advice I like to give

    CanIMG,

    nothing is impossible. I am not saying getting a license to practice medicine in Canada is impossible.

    What I am saying is that the advice I give is for the 'average' joe

    now I don't know much about you, wether you have inside connections or not.

    But for me, I have zero. Nothing. Nada.

    So I have to take the most realistic path. And most Canadian IMG's will take this path also. What is this path?

    --> Residency in the U.S., in primary care, on H-1B.

    then get Green Card and live in the U.S. permanently.


    so my dear friend, Canadian IMG's won't take 4 extra canadian board exams.

    Canadian IMG's won't waste 2-3 years trying to fulfill all the requirements in Canada.

    Canadian IMG's won't go to some **** rural place in Canada.

    Realistic advice.



    look basically it goes like this:

    1) These Canadians having realized that it is soooooo tough to get into a med school in Canada (Ontario is the toughest in all of North America by the way) head down to the Caribbean for med school.

    2) They don't really know what they are getting themselves into until they get there and find out the realities

    3) When the find out that they will not be able to return to Canada, they get pissed off and try deperately to refuse to believe it

    4) But after these Canadians get residency in the U.S., they get comfortable with the U.S. lifestyle

    5) After they finish residency in the U.S. and are offered these 'fat' salaries they are MORE than willing to stay in the U.S. and quickly develop amnesia about Canada (Canada? where is that?)


    I have seen this scenario over and over. . .

  6. #6
    iza0iza is offline Junior Member
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    I agree

    I am going to totally agree with anoncan on this one.. you hit it right on... Canada makes things extremely difficult for anyone trained outside of it's borders... I don't see why anyone would want to come back to Canada and practice anyhow, from what I understand the pay rate is lowere than in the states with a higher work load...

    Iza

  7. #7
    anoncan is offline Junior Member
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    How Canadian IMG's can help each other

    We can really help each other if we post about how to get a residency in the U.S.

    We all know that Canada is a dead end for us IMG's

    so let's all post about things like H1b Visa, NRMP, ECFMG, etc

  8. #8
    Nica7 is offline Junior Member
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    ...

    It seems that the safest bet to not come back to canada and waste 2 years here is to get the HIB. But from what I have read- you have to take a year off at the end of your four years of med school to wait for this visa and to sit USMLE3. However, once you have this you are set and can start your life in the US.
    The other option is the J1- visa- easier to get and no waiting around for residency. However, after the 2 years you have to come back to canada and write all those canadian exams. Another option is once you finish your residency you will be "american board certified" and then you can go and work for two years in Europe-(i.e. England) However, I don't know if this is violating the JI condition of coming back to canada.
    Does anyone know if you can get someone in the US to sponsor you to get a green card and by the time your 4 years are done you may have a green card?

    I think that we should totally help eachother out in this process- we are all in the same boat. My view is who wants to come back to this country when they did not invest any time in training us. Caribbean schools as well as US hospital put their investment in us- working and living there should not be so bad!

  9. #9
    anoncan is offline Junior Member
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    I agree!

    Thanks Nica7.

    We need more people like you on these forums.

    I agree that H-1B is the best option. Because after you get it, you are eligible to apply for a Green Card which would give you Permanent Resident Status in the U.S. and you can live and work in the U.S. forever.

    With J-1 as soon as you get it, you are stuck with it. You MUST fullfill that "return to Canada for two years" requirement.

    Even if you married a U.S. citizen (after getting J-1) you would STILL have to go back to Canada for those two years.

    Also, getting a waiver (which MOST J-1 doctors get) is not possible as a Canadian citizen, because one of the requirements for the J-1 Waiver is a "No-Objection Letter" from Canada. And Canada does not give this.

    They lie to you, when you first get the J-1, but at the end of residency you are left screwed.

    I think we should all start posting about H-1B Hospitals. Another Canadian IMG has compiled lists of H-1B sponsoring residency programs, and he has posted those lists on the web at: http://www.usmile.us/resstep.htm#h1btable

    I am researching my own list. And I will post it here when I am finished.

    Let's discuss REALISTIC paths. Not fairy tales. Please.

  10. #10
    Nica7 is offline Junior Member
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    ...

    hey anoncan,
    are you in a carib school right now? I am thinking of going to SGU in August.
    The visa issue is a big disadvantage but there are others who have done it. I think that you are limited with the HI-b visa to certain hospitals. With the J1 visa you have more choice.
    In order to get the HI-B visa you have to write USMLE 3 in one of 12 states that allow you to sit this exam with out doing your residency.
    My biggest fear is that after all this I will not have a job, I know this sounds silly but you never know. I guess it is a risk we all take.
    Talk to you soon,
    nicola

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