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More Info Req'd
09-15-2005, 10:02 PM
To all the prospective and current students attending Xavier,
I also was accepted into xavier for this but declined the offer due to further research (being new to the foreign med school thing) that made me weary of the school's admission policy as well as the school's WHO status.
1.) They asked for a telephone interview without a complete application!!!
2.) They do not have WHO recognition yet..not to say it won't happen, but this is why prospective students should wait till it does:
a.) w/o WHO recognition you can complete a MD degree but never use it
as it will not be accepted anywhere in the world.
b.) if you are thinking of attending Xavier prior to them being recognized
by WHO and transferring -DON'T!! Call any other school up and ask if
they will accept a transfer student from Xavier? Well, I'll save you some time - they won't! This is b/c they are not recognized by WHO, meaning
if you want to transfer you will start from scratch again...therefore,
don't even attend it to begin with.
c.) Last but not least most important piece of information, if you are
attending Xavier and are hoping it will get WHO recognition, it still
does not mean your MD will be of value. Why you may ask? This is
due to this nasty "grandfather clause" that you may get caught in.
A grandfather clause may state "from this so and so day forward
Xavier will be listed under WHO" This will not include those of you
who have started to obtain your MD's prior to that date therefore,
your degree will still be of no value.
3.) I do understand that this is a new school which makes it difficult to really follow up on their quality of education and residency matches in the USA, but not having established clinical placements...not even in NY is something to be very concerned about. When I called up the admissions director and asked about when is Xavier going to give us a list of clinical sites...he literally hesitated for 30 seconds...NOT A GOOD SIGN!!

All in all, I do not want anyone to get frusterated or upset regarding this information, just don't be a victim. Make sure you do your homework on any university before applying; don't blow $200,000 for a medical degree worth nothing. Your worth more than that. You can still get a quality education somewhere else, don't sell yourself short. I'm only posting this to inform others who are wanting to know more!

Best of luck to you all!

sukhtinder
09-19-2005, 12:23 PM
i think xavier is a fine insititution. if it didnt exist, we wouldnt have these great discussions comparing it to st james (another fine establishment). both of these schools need to stay in business so that we all and learn and grow from reading these fine posts.

ghostwriter
09-20-2005, 10:55 AM
'More Info Reqd' brought up some good points and even if they're not 100% correct, they're still worth thinking about. When I first started asking questions about Xavier and WHO a while ago, I'd usually get an Xavier student/potential telling me that what really matters is IMED approval. After enough posts, I got a response from the admin saying that only 'a few states' (whatever that means) want the school to have WHo recognition before they'd let u work there and that some others don't require it at all. Apparently no one as of yet has been able to tell me which exact states require WHO recognition and which dont, and where an Xavier grad can expect to work in the future...which i find disturbing.

Posts like this aren't intended to scare/badmouth current xavier students for choosing the school. I'm sure Xavier is a fine institution but thats not the point here...the point is that there are a lot of issues when it comes to a new school such as Xavier, and whenever someone replies on a post like this with a comment like "Xavier is great", etc., without telling how the situation with regards to Xavier's who/work status and work prospects is "great", then that's not much help.

Xavier Admissions
09-26-2005, 02:39 PM
We are sorry that the person who stated the initial post is so incorrect about ours and anyone else's WHO listing. This person obviously is trying to create rumors to deter future applicants or is passing along information that they have not verified themselves. If you have WHO questions we will be more than happy to help you, or you can get your answers at www.WHO.org (http://www.WHO.org).
-WHO is NOT needed to practice "anywhere in the world"
-WHO IS retroactive to prior students
-We have never given an interview without an application, we allow interviews over the phone for your convenience
-We have not had any students transfer out of Xavier, minus those who have been expelled for poor academic performance and one student who needed California state approval
-Our clinical program is VERY established! We have it set up for our students so that they do not have to tour the country in search of their rotations! This saves the student both time AND money. We will be adding Chicago rotations in the upcoming months. As far as the New York comment, if you had known how long our school had been opened, you would know that we have not gone for NY state approval. Without it, you are only allowed 12 weeks of rotations to reamain eligible for liscensure.
-We use the same clinical program as 10 other Caribbean schools, many of whom have been around much longer than us. This proves establishment of clinicals.

Xavier Admissions
09-26-2005, 02:41 PM
To determine the status of WHO needed approval in your state, please visit www.FSMB.org (http://www.fsmb.org/).

AUCMD2006
09-26-2005, 07:50 PM
only a few states may require who or imed listing but its required by ecfmg to let you take the usmle.....isn;t it?

Xavier Admissions
09-27-2005, 09:22 AM
only a few states may require who or imed listing but its required by ecfmg to let you take the usmle.....isn;t it?

Xavier IS IMED listed! WHO is not an accrediting body. We are and have always been ECFMG certified, allowing our students to be eligible to take the USMLE's.

Scott1981
09-27-2005, 08:56 PM
hey, at least they are honest. its not like the school official stated that you can do clinicals in new york and cali......... like another startup school does.

sukhtinder
09-27-2005, 10:36 PM
i commend xavoer's administration for being so forthcoming and honest. cheers to them...

More Info Req'd
09-30-2005, 09:21 PM
I as well commend the Xavier administrator speaking up for the university. Yet, I still recommend that each student take the time to research the information on your own due to your own due diligence. Call other universities, State Medical Associations etc. and see if your MD degree would be acceptable. I have contacted each of the provincial medical associations in Canada and an Xavier MD degree is unacceptable until it has WHO recognition. Therefore, always do your homework, and be critical of everything you read including this, it is your future.

More Info Req'd
09-30-2005, 09:26 PM
Oh yes, as for Ghostwriter thank you for bringing to everyone's attention that my intent was not to badmouth the university. I simply intend to inform students of what I have learned. I always welcome constructive criticism and knowledge others have acquired. It is the only way we can really question and decipher what is correct and incorrect!
As from my experience, at the end of the day this is a business transaction like any other institution - always make sure your getting the best bang for your buck!

Shrabee Punjabi
10-06-2005, 03:45 PM
Hi I also inquired about applying at Xavier in May of this year, but after talking to the school admins at there head office I became worried about the school. It seemed really shady!

The school could not even send me out any info on the school through the mail, since they had no school packages to sent out or any written corresponce at all relating to the school. On numerous occasions I was told that the material was at the printers and would be sent out soon = Sketchy. Questions I had asked where not responded with definite answers or I was told they did not know the answer to (and this was the admissions dept). The schools website was a mess with many broken links, which as I just noticed has now been revamped (could be due to complaints). Also I became really worried when I was sent an application via email by the school and not in the mail (maybe to save money, i dunno). The application was a word file that looked "home-made" to put it nicely.

I was also surprised to learn on further inquiry from other sources that the Xavier pre-med program does not constitute the full amount of hours for a undergrad degree that is required by many states in the US to get licensed. When I asked questions about whether they had any Cadavers, I was told that they where looking into getting some. One of my friends who was missing his Organic Chem who attended an Xavier Seminar was even told that he didn't need Organic Chem for Med. SChool and that they would let him in regardless. I don't have anything against the school or anyone who goes there, but I'm just saying my peace about my reasons as to why I chose to not apply at Xavier.

lmoliver
10-06-2005, 07:39 PM
I went thru the appl process and was accepted to med school. During the interview Dr. C. noticed the one deficiency I had in my undergrad transcript, Calc. He must have gone over it very carefully to notice that as I had been to 2 colleges and had many, many courses. He told me I wouldn't have to have calc to get in, but, at some time in the future, probably during licensing, it would come up again. So I decided to do it before I come down. Your friend probably was told something similar about Org Chem.

i did not notice anything shady and feel comfortable with the school.

More Info Req'd
10-08-2005, 08:44 PM
At the end of the day everyone has got to do what is best for them. Despite Xavier being a new school, there are many other options for students such as MUA, SMU, and St. Christopher's etc.. So why settle for less. Of course we are all trying to obtain the same goal of becoming an MD b/c we could not get into other N.American schools. Still, that does not mean you gotta be the guinea pig. If Xavier wants to get more clinical sites and recognition it better start having a well organized system and that means having proper applicationi packages, having answers to students questions, and oh yes, being recognized by the WHO. I think it is a very big compromise to make by attending this school for an MD degree that may result in more dissappointment at the end. So be very critical and look into other's findings, not based on what your friend said or what you heard or read. Really investigate it and you will soon find that both myself and Shrabee Punjabi are correct.

sukhtinder
10-08-2005, 11:19 PM
At the end of the day everyone has got to do what is best for them. Despite Xavier being a new school, there are many other options for students such as MUA, SMU, and St. Christopher's etc.. So why settle for less. Of course we are all trying to obtain the same goal of becoming an MD b/c we could not get into other N.American schools. Still, that does not mean you gotta be the guinea pig. If Xavier wants to get more clinical sites and recognition it better start having a well organized system and that means having proper applicationi packages, having answers to students questions, and oh yes, being recognized by the WHO. I think it is a very big compromise to make by attending this school for an MD degree that may result in more dissappointment at the end. So be very critical and look into other's findings, not based on what your friend said or what you heard or read. Really investigate it and you will soon find that both myself and Shrabee Punjabi are correct.

lets not forget that there is also st. james to consider.

kpp011
10-09-2005, 06:32 PM
going going gone
Forthcoming and honest about what?
This school tried hook and crook to steal SJSM students. Then they lost Bonaire. Now they are in Aruba and are losing their students to All Saints University.
All the current students at Xaviers know that they currently have NO ROTATIONS of value for them when they leave the island. Xaviers is desperately trying to make up for it by starting rotations in Aruba which they still have not acheived.
Xaviers has been around for 3 years and have moved all their facilities from Bonaire to Aruba. 3 years with nothing to show. NO LABS, NO FACILITIES.. the students use a stairwell as their lounge!!!! They have no room for their library which is smaller than one households collection of books. They have no room for that? This school does not even have a single microscope!?!? Their histology course is taught on a computer with a disk.
The current xaviers staff were trying to poach one of the All Saints university profs... who basically laughed in their face and turned them down. The xaviers staff also tried sending students to All Saints to try recruit them into xaviers which backfired and now the students are trying to transfer into All Saints.
Xaviers is now so scared they are trying to pull a St James fiasco by withholding transcripts. Ironic isn't it? :)
By the way for those who are still skeptical... Xaviers has lost their Atlanta Medical Center rotations. This is verifiable by tenet healthcare systems.
Xaviers is also making a profit off the students by ripping them off in rent agreements.

Brainy
10-10-2005, 01:43 AM
I agree, it's 100% true. Xavier administration are unethical, they just care about money. They can go to any extent to recruit students from others schools. Good they left Bonaire, now they will try to fight with ASUM.
This school looks really shady. The administration people are dishonest.
They are the same people who owns GMC.
Stay away from them if you can.

Xavier Admissions
10-12-2005, 03:19 PM
going going gone
Forthcoming and honest about what?
This school tried hook and crook to steal SJSM students. Then they lost Bonaire. Now they are in Aruba and are losing their students to All Saints University.
All the current students at Xaviers know that they currently have NO ROTATIONS of value for them when they leave the island. Xaviers is desperately trying to make up for it by starting rotations in Aruba which they still have not acheived.
Xaviers has been around for 3 years and have moved all their facilities from Bonaire to Aruba. 3 years with nothing to show. NO LABS, NO FACILITIES.. the students use a stairwell as their lounge!!!! They have no room for their library which is smaller than one households collection of books. They have no room for that? This school does not even have a single microscope!?!? Their histology course is taught on a computer with a disk.
The current xaviers staff were trying to poach one of the All Saints university profs... who basically laughed in their face and turned them down. The xaviers staff also tried sending students to All Saints to try recruit them into xaviers which backfired and now the students are trying to transfer into All Saints.
Xaviers is now so scared they are trying to pull a St James fiasco by withholding transcripts. Ironic isn't it? :)
By the way for those who are still skeptical... Xaviers has lost their Atlanta Medical Center rotations. This is verifiable by tenet healthcare systems.
Xaviers is also making a profit off the students by ripping them off in rent agreements.

- Lost Bonaire? I think you are confused. Losing students to All Saints? They're cheaper, yes, but are hurting student's future's by not abiding by the correct and ENTIRE Pre-Med curriculum, www.FSMB.org (http://www.FSMB.org) will give you the ability to search for guidelines for your state. 4 extra months to complete US medical school standards or your entire collection of medical loans with a degree that is worthless.... you take the pick.
No Xavier student has been without ACGME rotations, ever. Aruba clincals will only help our students because when a student completes his/her medical education in one country this accredits their liscence, making your liscence the equivalent as in any other country. We have a library large enough to need a second building.
Do you not realize that Histology on disk is so much more comprehensive and informative than a room full of microscopes that it is taught that way at Emory University, a prestigious medical school here in the US. You can't take a microscope home to practice and study, but everyone has a computer that they can use and replay!
We have not and will never withhold any transcript from a student trying to transfer so as long as they are financially cleared. We ask that you make a formal request and the school of your choice should recieve it within 14 days.
Please note: XUSOM will never work in a way to intentionally impede your educational career. If you feel you have been mistreated please call the Admissions Office in Atlanta.
Xavier has not asked for or made any profit off student housing. Whatever price you pay is between what the student and landlord agree to.

Xavier Admissions
10-12-2005, 04:17 PM
[QUOTE]Hi I also inquired about applying at Xavier in May of this year, but after talking to the school admins at there head office I became worried about the school. It seemed really shady!

The school could not even send me out any info on the school through the mail, since they had no school packages to sent out or any written corresponce at all relating to the school. On numerous occasions I was told that the material was at the printers and would be sent out soon = Sketchy. Questions I had asked where not responded with definite answers or I was told they did not know the answer to (and this was the admissions dept). The schools website was a mess with many broken links, which as I just noticed has now been revamped (could be due to complaints). Also I became really worried when I was sent an application via email by the school and not in the mail (maybe to save money, i dunno). The application was a word file that looked "home-made" to put it nicely.

I was also surprised to learn on further inquiry from other sources that the Xavier pre-med program does not constitute the full amount of hours for a undergrad degree that is required by many states in the US to get licensed. When I asked questions about whether they had any Cadavers, I was told that they where looking into getting some. One of my friends who was missing his Organic Chem who attended an Xavier Seminar was even told that he didn't need Organic Chem for Med. SChool and that they would let him in regardless. I don't have anything against the school or anyone who goes there, but I'm just saying my peace about my reasons as to why I chose to not apply at Xavier.[QUOTE]

If you really want a printed application please give me your mailing address so as I can send you one on our letterhead. Will it also bother you that you can download the application as well as other required items from our new website?
Have you called other formal medical schools and universities?? Because we did to see what worked for other schools and to see how students responded, the conclusion being that many academic institutions are now using or moving towards electronic documents and information. This way we do not have to read through scribbled and scratched through answers, and also their is less mail delay. When talking to me I even reference my fax number for you. Yes, everyone will have to take Org Chemistry.
Through life if you are looking for "shady" you will find shady, and if you are looking for "ligit" you will find ligit. Make an educated decision and live with it, but don't be derogitory.

AUCMD2006
10-12-2005, 04:26 PM
wow, "This way we do not have to read through scribbled and scratched through answers, and also their is less mail delay. When talking to me I even reference my fax number for you"

what kind of applicant pool are you getting that a professional level candidate to a MD program would mail in any documents that are in that condition? better yet are you admitting these applicants?

Xavier Admissions
10-12-2005, 04:43 PM
Wow... I guess you didn't read the part about us sending our electronic copies.... so how exactly would we know how bad your handwriting is? Too bad I cannot grade your handwriting skills....... haha.
A little bit of common sense goes a long way.............

AUCMD2006
10-12-2005, 04:56 PM
handwriting is different than scratching out and writing new info like it was a mc donalds fry cook application...yes common sense should go a long way but often times it is a little short on the menu isn't it?

kpp011
10-12-2005, 05:40 PM
- Lost Bonaire? I think you are confused. Losing students to All Saints? They're cheaper, yes, but are hurting student's future's by not abiding by the correct and ENTIRE Pre-Med curriculum, www.FSMB.org (http://www.FSMB.org) will give you the ability to search for guidelines for your state. 4 extra months to complete US medical school standards or your entire collection of medical loans with a degree that is worthless.... you take the pick.
No Xavier student has been without ACGME rotations, ever. Aruba clincals will only help our students because when a student completes his/her medical education in one country this accredits their liscence, making your liscence the equivalent as in any other country. We have a library large enough to need a second building.
Do you not realize that Histology on disk is so much more comprehensive and informative than a room full of microscopes that it is taught that way at Emory University, a prestigious medical school here in the US. You can't take a microscope home to practice and study, but everyone has a computer that they can use and replay!
We have not and will never withhold any transcript from a student trying to transfer so as long as they are financially cleared. We ask that you make a formal request and the school of your choice should recieve it within 14 days.
Please note: XUSOM will never work in a way to intentionally impede your educational career. If you feel you have been mistreated please call the Admissions Office in Atlanta.
Xavier has not asked for or made any profit off student housing. Whatever price you pay is between what the student and landlord agree to.

Xaviers started with 6 semesters of premed in May 2004. By January 2005, it was reduced to 3 semesters of premed. And by September 2005, they changed it to 4 semesters of premed ... from 6 to 3 .. 3 to 4.. all within the space of 15 months.
ASUM started with 4 semesters of premed since last year and it has still been 4. So Which university is consistent and which one isn't?
Which school looks like it knows what its doing and which one doesn't?
Is it XUSOM or ASUM?
Can anyone DENY this?
What is the effect of the students who did premed in Bonaire? Are you making up the grades for the 4th semester for them? Can you tell me the name of a university that changes its curriculum from 6 semesters of premed to 3 semesters to 4 semesters all in the space of 15 months? Can you DENY this? Then I will give you MORE facts about XUSOM.
SO are you saying that at EMORY University, A PRESTIGIOUS UNIVERSITY that they don't do ANYTHING with microscopes? OR maybe what you are trying to say is that they don't own any?
And with the change of your curriculum so are you fees changing every semester. There is no consistency with this school. And then you ask why ppl think you are very shady. This is ONE of the reasons of MANY... that this school is shady..
Are you saying a degree from ASUM is worthless or any other degree from any other medical school is worthless like Christopher, SJSM and ROSS? Yet a school that bounces from island to island all within the space of one year and which has no microscopes and specilizes only in recruiting students from other schools with empty promises is of any worth? hmmm....
And what is the fate of the students who were stolen from St James? Then transferred once to your defunct Bonaire campus and now to another university entirely which is Xaviers ARuba... which is a DIFFERENT SCHOOL because of a DIFFERENT CHARTER. This means you have made your students transfer into THREE different schools all within the space of 1 YEAR! HOw would this reflect with FSMB of ECFMG? OR are you going to give them all the same transcript from Bonaire or ARuba... and make you remain consistently unethical and shady in your dealings.
CAN U DENY ANY OF THESE POINTS? AND I WILL POST MORE FACTS BASED ON YOUR RESPONSE TO FURTHER PREVENT RUINING PPL'S FUTURES.

Brainy
10-12-2005, 08:35 PM
You said ASUM cheaper, so are you very expensive. Your tuition is also same as them, may be a little more.
Please go and read ethics, you have transfered many st. James. You guys go in the campus and recruit, is that ethical? Then you hop to other island, who knows which is your next destination? I heard in Caribbean med. schools students transfer from one school to other, never heard that schools too transfer from one island to other.
So now you guys will try to play the dirty game with ASUM also. if I am not wrong initially you had some kind of partnership with the current CEO of ASUM who then was working at SJSM.
So now you will recruit faculty and students from ASUM, please justify this. All your faculty and student are from SJSM, if not all then most of them. Am I wrong?
So are you trying to say Emory doesn't have microscopes n histo. lab. Are you kidding me..............
Your school is not at all upto standards, don't try to justify which doesn't exist. Go buy some microscopes, during residency everyone will make fun of xavier graduates if they are not able to use microscope properly.

Brainy
10-12-2005, 08:47 PM
The comments by Xavier Admissions that WHO is NOT needed to practice to practice any where in world is completely false.
Please don't try to misled the students. We are not stupid. WHO is required everywhere outside US to practice medicine. Please edit your post or try to explain where WHO is not required.
Call GMC, UK they doesn't follow IMED or ECFMG. SO WHO is required in UK. Ask Canada MCC, they follow both IMED & WHO. So WHO is required in Canada.
May be you should call emergency board of director meeting.
Please come back and justify yourself.
WHO is same as IMED both do not accredit any medical school but they just list the medical schools as per information given by respective country.
Try to correct yourself.


We are sorry that the person who stated the initial post is so incorrect about ours and anyone else's WHO listing. This person obviously is trying to create rumors to deter future applicants or is passing along information that they have not verified themselves. If you have WHO questions we will be more than happy to help you, or you can get your answers at www.WHO.org (http://www.WHO.org).
-WHO is NOT needed to practice "anywhere in the world"
-WHO IS retroactive to prior students
-We have never given an interview without an application, we allow interviews over the phone for your convenience
-We have not had any students transfer out of Xavier, minus those who have been expelled for poor academic performance and one student who needed California state approval
-Our clinical program is VERY established! We have it set up for our students so that they do not have to tour the country in search of their rotations! This saves the student both time AND money. We will be adding Chicago rotations in the upcoming months. As far as the New York comment, if you had known how long our school had been opened, you would know that we have not gone for NY state approval. Without it, you are only allowed 12 weeks of rotations to reamain eligible for liscensure.
-We use the same clinical program as 10 other Caribbean schools, many of whom have been around much longer than us. This proves establishment of clinicals.

asyed
10-18-2005, 01:37 AM
Personally, I by no means contemplated that Xavier was an unethical administration based University, however they decided to prove that wrong. Recently Xavier provided two anonymous tips to the Aruban police department stating false accusations against All Saint University, also located in Aruba! It was said that malaria was being spread through a certain individual and that individual’s file was made public! How low can you get, I mean that is far off limits for anyone, an individuals health records are meant to remain confidential! However the truth of the matter was that the health issue was nothing more than a fewer, which had already been treated! Next unethical practice consisted of the false statement declaring that the student visas were invalid! The result of such immature absolute envious actions was that the entire faculty and student body, during exams were "arrested" and held for nearly 4-5 hours in a warehouse all to learn the statements were false! Well Congratulations to Xavier they really achieved a lot! Xavier is obviously willing to steep to the lowest levels possible to stain the name of other schools rather than merely working hard to progress its own facilities! Sending spies for information is simply ridiculous! It’s very shocking! How can such a school be able to discriminate against other universities when its very own is tainted with so many issues based on deceit and corrupt morals? I am just thankful I found out about this university before I applied!

Dungargee
10-18-2005, 11:40 AM
Personally, I by no means contemplated that Xavier was an unethical administration based University, however they decided to prove that wrong. Recently Xavier provided two anonymous tips to the Aruban police department stating false accusations against All Saint University, also located in Aruba! It was said that malaria was being spread through a certain individual and that individualís file was made public! How low can you get, I mean that is far off limits for anyone, an individuals health records are meant to remain confidential! However the truth of the matter was that the health issue was nothing more than a fewer, which had already been treated! Next unethical practice consisted of the false statement declaring that the student visas were invalid! The result of such immature absolute envious actions was that the entire faculty and student body, during exams were "arrested" and held for nearly 4-5 hours in a warehouse all to learn the statements were false! Well Congratulations to Xavier they really achieved a lot! Xavier is obviously willing to steep to the lowest levels possible to stain the name of other schools rather than merely working hard to progress its own facilities! Sending spies for information is simply ridiculous! Itís very shocking! How can such a school be able to discriminate against other universities when its very own is tainted with so many issues based on deceit and corrupt morals? I am just thankful I found out about this university before I applied!

If they were anonymous how do u know the school was the culprit? Maybe they had to comply with the authoritys and release the students record to the authorities. You said it was made public. was it in newspapers, news reports, etc... where did you hear about this ? Was it word of mouth or did you read it firsthand, if so where can i obtain facts about the incidents? I am not trying to attack you but i want hard evidence before i write off the school, too many people write too many myths about all the schools based on things they heard.

p_in_da_wind
10-18-2005, 01:49 PM
OK! what asyed said may or may not be true but how is this for a HARD PROOF that this school admitted me in a PRE-MEDICAL program when i have already finished all my Pre-Medical in US with ALL A's and B's.
The school sent me a letter teling me that i have been accepted and in vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvery small font was written (pre-medical program).... This only showed me that this school is tring to scam me out of my money... I mean, why would you admit a student in a program he/she DID NOT even apply for?

During the intervew, they told me that they have clinical rotations ONLY in Atlanta but on their WEBSITE they say that they have MANY clinical sites throughout US.... HOW IS THAT FOR A LIE for new students applying at their school.... The new website is NOTHING but a bunch of lies... According to the person who interviewed me, "WHO approval is not required and that WHO is JUST a health organization... no one has to be approved by them in order to practice as a health care specialist...."

I dont know about you guys but there is just something not right about this school... i would avoid it at all cost...

snipper
10-18-2005, 06:33 PM
If they were anonymous how do u know the school was the culprit? Maybe they had to comply with the authoritys and release the students record to the authorities. You said it was made public. was it in newspapers, news reports, etc... where did you hear about this ? Was it word of mouth or did you read it firsthand, if so where can i obtain facts about the incidents? I am not trying to attack you but i want hard evidence before i write off the school, too many people write too many myths about all the schools based on things they heard.

Actually, this isn't even new for Xaviers, they did the same thing to SJSM students, and got away with it. What they failed to understand is that they are now dealing with a different school whose admin and students have pride in their school and aren't afraid to take action against such a miserable low level of deception. When asyed said they received the anonymous tips he meant that they do not know who the EXACT people were, but it was confirmed that the telephone calls were traced to come from Xavier University.

As for confirmation, the authorities themselves who took the ASUM students informed the students themselves that it was a tip off given by Xavier on two counts - one concerning health of the students (totally false) and the other concerning immigration documents (false again), even though all papers were submitted to DINA and were in progress

If you want proof, just stay tuned. Pictures will be posted shortly on this forum (if the Xavier admin block access, they will be posted to the Main Medical School Forum). More info will be provided as it arises.

The ASUM Executive Dean visited the DINA (Department of Immigration and Naturalization of Aruba) office today and was informed by the person handling the termporary residency permits of All Saints, that they were not even aware that such a horrific thing took place - they were not responsible for any of it since the students' papers and health are fine.

It's really quite sad, that Xaviers university had nothing really bad to say about All Saints, so they had to resort to creating their own 'evidence' and then actually called an administrative meeting for the Xavier students DURING the whole incident, while ASUM students were being loaded on the buses (xavier students themselves attested to this), and bad mouthed All Saints saying basically 'look what's happening to them, why would you want to move to that school'... it begs the question, how did they know beforehand (and therefore had time to organize a meeting) that this would happen if they didn't have a hand in it? They were so scared about losing students that this is what they resorted to. Xaviers had even sent in one of their staff members into the ASUM campus the previous day (he had pretended to be a new professor for ASUM), and he had looked over the ASUM notice boards quite carefully - the incident the next day was timed to occur while students were writing an exam, in order to try and maximize the psychological damage.

While ASUM students were initially jolted, once they became aware that Xavier was behind it all, they were able to gain a different perspective on the situation. The funnist thing is that this has totally backfired for XUSOM , and now MORE students are attempting to transfer to All Saints. Xavier will lose all their students by January, just because even if anyone had any 'doubts' about Xavier before, this incident has served to solidify their bad reputation and image as deceptive and unethical. They simply care about money, and not at all about students.

Anyway, to the point: there's no doubt about it as to the validity of asyed's post. Just stay tuned for more info.

IQ version 2.0
10-18-2005, 06:44 PM
Amen Snipper and asyed. I have heard a lot of talk about this Xavier staining other schools business. If you speak with any of the ASUM students who were a part of this unfortunate incident they will all tell you the same thing - why would an Xavier administration staff ( to my knowledge the dean himself) be wandering around ASUM campus for three consecutive evenings and during the fourth day when exams are being conducted, barge into a lecture hall to arrest the faculty and students? - two words--> Pathetic turds. It is really sad that a bunch of crooks are fiesting off the lives of unaware students. Not only is Xavier so unethical, but they are very insecure. If Xavier had sufficient resources and facilities they would not have the need to spy on other schools. What I found funny was that the "spys" that were sent to ASUM, transferred to ASUM because of the better facilities and overall stability! Sucks for Xavier doesn't it? Their own plan slapped them across their faces. With the choice of other medical schools being available, I don't see why an individual would even consider Xavier - unless there's a fetish for administration and student one night stands. Don't be so shocked Xavier, truth hurts doesn't it? Anyways Dungargee, it doesnt take a rocket scientist to figure out what looks better in the end for you.

1. Xavier jumping from island to island, increasing and decreasing the number of premed semesters in the span of one year, having no microscopes. OR any other caribbean medical school who has been established longer and is way more secure. Eventhough ASUM is pretty new, I gotta hand it to them for knowing what they are doing! Unlike Xavier, ASUM doesnt hop back and forth where ever their overall net profit increases.

2. Yes, Xavier has TERI Loans for American students, but ever wonder how they have gotten that right. According to the elegibility of the TERI LOAN approval, a school must be a couple of years old ( three to be precise). BUT Xavier doesnt fit the guidline. St.James is not an excuse because this is Xavier in Aruba not St.James, two seperate schools right? Or am I wrong? OR how about, Xavier likes to make friends when its in their interest (Hello St.Christopher, hello TERI LOAN? - goodbye St.Chris) Seems fishy but the facts are all out there.

3. NO MICROSCOPES, YOU HAVE GOT TO BE KIDDING ME! Dungargee if you want to go to a medical school and come out without knowing how to use a microscope then Xavier is the PERFECT choice for you! Just don't feel humiliated when all the other students at clinicals know what they are doing but you pull out your histology disk and go find a computer to stick it in.

There are plenty more facts out there, you just have to keep our eyes open WIDE for crooks like these. They are going to run around like chickens with their heads cut off until its GAME OVER XAVIER. Bounce your way to a another island.

On an end note, I'll leave you all with a little incident I experienced. When I went to the ASUM head office in TO - one of the deans recieved a phone call from a "student" from "BC" so I heard. This "Student" kept asking questions about ASUM and the dean kept replying and then suddenly he goes wait this number is from Atlanta. The person on the other end of the phone hung up. The dean was confused and so after waiting a couple of minutes he calls back to the number on the caller I.D. and all you hear is "Xavier administration how can I help you?" - WHAT A BUNCH OF CRACK HEADS! Man oh man, I almost died laughing, how dumb can you get? Are these guys even real doctors?

Anyways, If this isn't enough for you then sweetie I wish you all the best @ Xavier!

Dungargee
10-18-2005, 09:12 PM
its all interesting. Been digging around and i see what you guys mean. I wasnt trying to protect them or argue with you guys but i know you all are well aware of people just running their mouths on the site. I think i might just cross them off my list based on what info i have on them now. Been hearing and reading too many negative things. BTW any of you current or former students?

IQ version 2.0
10-19-2005, 10:21 AM
Also, something else that crossed my mind is that how in the world did Xavier manage to get a DOE (Director of Education) number. What school did they USE this time. I want to know what false documents Xavier has submitted to achieve the DOE number because in order to get a DOE number a school must be ATLEAST ten years old. First TERI loans, then DOE numbers...whats next you CROOKS? MY advice to you is do yourself and everyone else a favour - JUMP INTO THE CARIBBEAN SEA!

asyed
10-19-2005, 10:32 AM
First of all there is solid proof on all the events that occured i will post up the newspaper articles! As for Xavier they are the responsible for the events due to the fact that the police clearly stated that 2 anonymous tips were given by xavier! Iq version 2.0 xavier cant even jump in the sea, they will be rejected by even the fish for their will possibly steal the "treasure"!

XsuX
10-19-2005, 11:10 AM
you want to know the truth about xaviers administration? Well you can't HANDLE the truth. Its disgustingly horrendus, unethical is too good of a word. The current dean of administration who was formerly staff at St.James, where I attended but later transferred to Xavier ASKED, WAIT NO TOLD ME THAT IF I "GIVE IT TO HIM" HE WILL MAKE SURE I HAVE A STABLE FUTURE. Now lets get one thing straight, "give it" referrs to not only the money but engaging in the deans personal sexual interests. I was disgusted at the thought and left the school. Lucky for us all, he is now dean! I transferred to another medical school after encountering such a queer individual. As for the fish, asyed, their lives will be endangered because the DEAN of administration would even rape them!...He seemed to call kpp011 CONFUSED, but the only confused individual here is him who mistakes his students for his "wife"! Hahaha IQ version 2.0 that phoney phone call you witnessed was too funny. You are right, Xavier is nothing but a bandit house. By the way make sure you post up the articles from Aruba. Its clear that the only two schools there are Xavier and ASUM soooo... if ASUM is the victim then that leaves only one suspect (with a record)... take a "wild" stab at it dont'cha?

godeep85
10-20-2005, 03:22 PM
hey everyone...... lets make up fake names on the internet and bash medical schools on online forums with no real evidence, and hearsay rumors from angry students who are mad that their school sucks.... IF YOUR IN SUCH A GOOD POSITION ENJOY UR LIFE AND STOP TRYING SO HARD TO BASH A SCHOOL ONLINE ... YOU'RE ALL TOOLS ... take ur pick, wrench or hammer. Kuz u might as well be that dense.

snipper
10-21-2005, 01:09 PM
hey everyone...... lets make up fake names on the internet and bash medical schools on online forums with no real evidence, and hearsay rumors from angry students who are mad that their school sucks.... IF YOUR IN SUCH A GOOD POSITION ENJOY UR LIFE AND STOP TRYING SO HARD TO BASH A SCHOOL ONLINE ... YOU'RE ALL TOOLS ... take ur pick, wrench or hammer. Kuz u might as well be that dense.


They're just bashing the school online and that's about all they've done, but what have the Xavier admin done? Are you intentionally being blind to the facts? There are so many other better (read: ethical at the very least) schools out there, you'd be better off transferring or applying to ANY one of them. Shall we look at a history of Xavier, and then you tell me what kind of evidence you want?
- can you deny that they have poached students from SJSM using extremely unethical practices that are far worse than 'bashing' online?

- can you deny that they started off with 6 semesters of premed in bonaire, and changed it to 3 and then 4, and then they have the audacity to say that ASUM's premed curriculum is wrong? (They can't even deny this)
- can you deny that they don't have anything to show for 3 years of operation, not even basic lab equipment such as microscopes? (Are they pocketing all the money?)
- can you deny that they promised a brand new 30,000 square foot building, but students were carted instead to much smaller and old rented building instead?
http://www.valuemd.com/t29688-xavier-university.html
- Can you deny that Xavier has stated that they are currently renovating their 30,000 sq foot campus on Aruba, yet when asked (they seemed rather prompt to reply before), where exactly it is located, there is a noticable silence?

- can you deny that they were unable to obtain their WHO listing from the Bonaire Government, because as they themselves stated, the government itself wouldn't cooperate with them?
Now with the negative publicity brought on by their recent actions, there is a very strong possibility that the same story will repeat on Aruba concerning bad relations with the Aruban government. Perhaps their charter will be revoked this time.
Now their excuse is 'delayed meetings' from WHO, or 'being mistaken with the Bonaire campus'? Give me a break... you actually believe that?? Well, its just a waiting game now. Simply sending one piece of paper doesn't guarantee listing in the WHO, there are criteria to be met, and Xavier falls miserably short of them

- Xavier falsely indicates on their website that their MD Degree program is accredited, yet how can a government accredit a University Program when the University only actually started in Aruba on Sept. 12, 2005, which is less than 5 weeks ago? WHen did the inspection take place? How can a university be accredited before it even sets foot on the island? (It is what they're basically claiming). This should raise several red flags, and it attests as to the lies that they are willing to spread to people who will blindly believe everything that comes out of their mouths.

- can you deny that they stated that the government of the Netherlands Antilles petitioned them to open up the school in Aruba? (And that it doesn't make sense since Aruba is independant of the Netherlands Antilles)
http://www.valuemd.com/t31124-xavier-aruba-campus-info.html DeansRedHalo said that he got this information from Xavier Admin itself, and yet now they fix their story (after this discrepancy was pointed out) and say on the website that it was the Minister of Aruba who was impressed - are they incapable of distinguishing between the Aruban and Netherlands Antilles governments?
Are they now trying to imply that the Minister of Education of Aruba is so uneducated as to be impressed by a university that lacks even the basic lab equipment (no microscopes)?
- can you deny that they had falsely implied that they had their WHO listing for Aruba, and then later admitted that it was still in progress? (People had said that they had 'seen' the listing, and Xavier admin had not corrected them on the fact that it was simply a copy of the document sent by the Aruban government to WHO and not the acceptance itself by WHO for listing)
- can you deny that they state that WHO listing is not required for practing anywhere else in the world?
- can you deny that Xavier professors and staff were, and still are, sneaking around the ASUM campus? Can you provide any strong reasons as to why this would be acceptable for a school to do? Why do they need spies? Are they not secure?
Pure and simple: They were on the offensive in Bonaire, but they are on the defensive in Aruba
- can you deny that Xavier Aruba is less than 2 months old, but yet it has Teri loans? Call up Teri yourself - they have rules stating that the school must be a certain number of years old. So, tell me, how did they get Teri loans? By deception, or by honest dealings?
Or are they trying to imply that this 'dual charter' thing is their saving point?
Note: Xavier Aruba charter and Xavier Bonaire charter are two different countries, two different schools, and two different charters.
- can you deny that Xavier admin called a meeting during this past recent incident with ASUM students in order to bash ASUM, and that NO ONE thought that was odd? Or if not odd, that it reeked of desperation?
- can you deny that Xavier consistently says that they have numerous hospitals around for rotations, and yet they won't divulge the names of those hospitals to their OWN REGISTERED students who have paid fees and are attending classes at Xavier? Isn't that odd?
- can you deny that Xavier admin are liars? Or that, at the very least, most of what they say sounds extremely doubtful (trust your gut instincts, there's a reason why you have doubts).
Just deny those points first, and then we can move on to more.
Then tell me, what evidence do you want exactly that Xavier is not shady, unethical and deceptive.
While 'bashing' schools is a waste of time, telling the truth is valuable. Information that comes out forces a school to change its policies at the very least, but more importantly it deters new applicants who would better invest their money at the many other schools available on many other islands. Being a doctor, ethics should be a very strong focus, shouldn't it? Schools like Xavier are the types of schools that give Caribbean schools a bad name.

And for a little joke,
you say that we're TOOLS, like a wrench or hammer?
Well, in that case, you're like SCREWS or nuts being screwed by Xavier University
hahaha, couldn't resist... not meant to be a direct insult to you, but its the first thing that I thought of when I read your tool joke :)
No hard feelings, everything is directed toward the school and not towards the students
take care godeep

godeep85
10-21-2005, 05:18 PM
number 1 - xavier didnt have to use tactics to steal students from SJSM, it was never xaviers fault that administration in SJSM is laughable. if they didnt have the lowest tuition in the carribean i doubt anyone would even go there.

number 2 - the WHO accreditation has nothing to do with our admin, because they really have no control over the situation. if the people at WHO take their sweet time then we have to live with it. WHO accreditation is really just formality anyways... ECFMG and IMED approve xavier and WHO is forthcoming. Again this fact has nothing to do with our admin.

Number 3 - Xavier was 10% of bonaire's GDP, they did not want us to leave i have no idea where you get that. Numerous government officials in bonaire spoke at school events and were sad to see us go.

Number 4 - Xavier has an excellent relationship with the government of aruba, Education Minister Cruz has spoken several times to the students and is excited to have us on the island. He is avidly helping us establish ourselves in the community. Again ur assumptions are incorrect. We do own the 30,000 sq ft building but it is under construction, and the admin has always informed us of the campus situation.

Number 5 - The changes to our pre-med were done due to meet national licensure requirements in the US. ASUM can have the SAME system for a 100 years, just because its stable doesnt mean its effective. infact change and evolution of programs isnt uncommon and it often is for the best.

Number 6 - We have teri loans, i assure you that an organization of that stature isnt readily conned sir. If our administration is connected, that is a good thing, not negative.

Number 7 - the admin doesnt give us hospital names because they dont want students contacting resident directors and CEOs asking dumb questions. This promotes the professionalism of the school and maintains our integrity. These hospitals dont want forum trolls calling them and asking why they rotate Xavier students, and other idiotic ideas people have.

snipper
10-21-2005, 06:14 PM
number 1 - xavier didnt have to use tactics to steal students from SJSM, it was never xaviers fault that administration in SJSM is laughable. if they didnt have the lowest tuition in the carribean i doubt anyone would even go there.

First off, UNIBE has a lower tuition than SJSM, so they don't have the lowest tuition. So your first point is WRONG. Plus the $2000 administration fee that SJSM adds makes it come up to $4,700 (if you divide that 2000 by 4 semesters of Basic Science) for SJSM, which would, in that case, mean that there are cheaper schools available - (St. Luke's & Spartan)
http://www.valuemd.com/medicalschools.php for the list
You may also want to take into account the clinical sciences tuition and any hidden fees that are put forth by the other universities.
Xaviers had students going into SJSM campus in an attempt to canvas all their students, there was a student who was actually appointed to recruit students for Xavier from the SJSM campus. This student has failed all his exams and was given a transfer into Xavier - he is still there. They had seminars specifically for SJSM students. They also put posters up on the SJSM campus. They offered scholarships to the students as well. You're telling me that Xavier didn't do anything to try and steal students from SJSM? If you are a new student at Xavier (prior to Sept 2005), then you can't be expected to know anything that really went on - suffice to say, they did a lot of underhanded things, perhaps you should do your research. Or maybe you're just pretending not to know all the facts. Do you even know what percentage of Xavier in Bonaire comprised SJSM students? They couldn't get any of their own students on their own merits, they had to resort to stealing them from SJSM.

number 2 - the WHO accreditation has nothing to do with our admin, because they really have no control over the situation. if the people at WHO take their sweet time then we have to live with it. WHO accreditation is really just formality anyways... ECFMG and IMED approve xavier and WHO is forthcoming. Again this fact has nothing to do with our admin.

If there is no proper administration, how do you expect WHO to list them. WHO is a body that checks out EVERYTHING before listing. If Xavier admin tell you otherwise, they are LYING. Why were they not listed while in Bonaire? The administration is responsible for this, and they couldn't do it in Bonaire. The admin has not changed since. So what should be different here?
There are several Canadian students at Xaviers. If these students want to practice in Canada, without the WHO Listing of their school, they cannot do so.
If you don't believe this, contact the Ontario Physicians and Surgeons Association, and then you will realize what I am talking about.
Any student who wishes to work outside of North America can just forget about it if there is no WHO listing. So, you're wrong about it just being a formality. Strike out point 2.

Number 3 - Xavier was 10% of bonaire's GDP, they did not want us to leave i have no idea where you get that. Numerous government officials in bonaire spoke at school events and were sad to see us go.

Here's where Xavier Admin stick their feet in their mouths:
A direct quote from Xavier Admin Office on VMD:
WHO Paperwork
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbubba
One more question,
you said in the initial post re: WHO
Xavier University is officially accredited through IMED for both campuses. WHO has been signed, sealed, and delivered to WHO (which I clearly stated before.) And, as you quoted, we are waiting for it's return. There is a lengthy process for this letter on both the the side of island government and WHO administration. One of the many reasons we moved to Aruba was because we had the Arubian government copmlete our WHO letter by signing it, something that was unable to be accomplished through the currently changed rules and regulations of Bonaire. We will be POSTING the WHO letter as soon as it is returned.
__________________
Xavier Admissions
Xavier University School of Medicine
http://www.valuemd.com/t39757-p2-xavier-administration-common-questions-and-answers.html (http://www.valuemd.com/t39757-p2-xavier-administration-common-questions-and-answers.html)


So, you tell me, why did they move from Bonaire again?
Also, if its just a formality to get the WHO listing, then why did they feel they had to move to Aruba?
Come on and start thinking now. Don't get confused by what they say. Now they're using you to spread their excuses, (like Frankenstone did before), instead of saying anything themselves.
I can't believe you take their word without even doing a little more digging around.

Number 4 - Xavier has an excellent relationship with the government of aruba, Education Minister Cruz has spoken several times to the students and is excited to have us on the island. He is avidly helping us establish ourselves in the community. Again ur assumptions are incorrect. We do own the 30,000 sq ft building but it is under construction, and the admin has always informed us of the campus situation.

They didn't say it was 'under construction' on their website, they said that it was 'being rennovated'. Do you know the difference between the two?
Construction - being built
Renovation - already there, but being redone
So now they don't even have a 30,000 sq ft building? It's under construction? Hah!
As far as the Education Minister Cruz is concerned, he does not do any favours for anybody. He is cordial and helpful to everyone, not just Xaviers. His individual position is not a reflection of the whole of the Government of Aruba.

Number 5 - The changes to our pre-med were done due to meet national licensure requirements in the US. ASUM can have the SAME system for a 100 years, just because its stable doesnt mean its effective. infact change and evolution of programs isnt uncommon and it often is for the best.


So they didn't get it right in the first place?? The admin wasn't aware of what was required at the beginning? Are they just learning right now and using the students as lab rats?

You're actually trying to tell me that STABILITY is a BAD thing? What are you talking about?

The point was:
1. ASUM had it right from the beginning
2. Xavier was lying about this
3. How many students are going to have licensing problems as a result of already going through this 3 semester program in the future? OR, what deceptive practices will Xavier employ in order to correct their own mistake (UNETHICAL)
They used the 3 semester gamit as a ploy to just lure students away from SJSM, and then tried to bash SJSM on this point. Goodness gracious, DO YOUR RESEARCH instead of taking what the admin says for granted.


Number 6 - We have teri loans, i assure you that an organization of that stature isnt readily conned sir. If our administration is connected, that is a good thing, not negative.


When Xaviers initially started, they had a loan through St. Christophers. And then they got the TERI loan by providing FALSE DOCUMENTATION
It's one thing to be 'connected', its quite another to falsify documentation.
The requirement by TERI to list a medical school in their loan program is:
3 years of audited financial statements of the school
You work out how long the school has been in existence for, and then tell me where they got this documentation from?
CALL TERI and ask what the requirements are.

Number 7 - the admin doesnt give us hospital names because they dont want students contacting resident directors and CEOs asking dumb questions. This promotes the professionalism of the school and maintains our integrity. These hospitals dont want forum trolls calling them and asking why they rotate Xavier students, and other idiotic ideas people have.

HAHAH! That's a good excuse.
And you fell for it?
:)
Very good.
And I'm sure that Saba, Ross, and my goodness SJSM as well, divulges this information to their students.
And Xavier is the exception? Are they saying that their students are dumb?
Hehehe... oh gosh..








number 1 - xavier didnt have to use tactics to steal students from SJSM, it was never xaviers fault that administration in SJSM is laughable. if they didnt have the lowest tuition in the carribean i doubt anyone would even go there.

number 2 - the WHO accreditation has nothing to do with our admin, because they really have no control over the situation. if the people at WHO take their sweet time then we have to live with it. WHO accreditation is really just formality anyways... ECFMG and IMED approve xavier and WHO is forthcoming. Again this fact has nothing to do with our admin.

Number 3 - Xavier was 10% of bonaire's GDP, they did not want us to leave i have no idea where you get that. Numerous government officials in bonaire spoke at school events and were sad to see us go.

Number 4 - Xavier has an excellent relationship with the government of aruba, Education Minister Cruz has spoken several times to the students and is excited to have us on the island. He is avidly helping us establish ourselves in the community. Again ur assumptions are incorrect. We do own the 30,000 sq ft building but it is under construction, and the admin has always informed us of the campus situation.

Number 5 - The changes to our pre-med were done due to meet national licensure requirements in the US. ASUM can have the SAME system for a 100 years, just because its stable doesnt mean its effective. infact change and evolution of programs isnt uncommon and it often is for the best.

Number 6 - We have teri loans, i assure you that an organization of that stature isnt readily conned sir. If our administration is connected, that is a good thing, not negative.

Number 7 - the admin doesnt give us hospital names because they dont want students contacting resident directors and CEOs asking dumb questions. This promotes the professionalism of the school and maintains our integrity. These hospitals dont want forum trolls calling them and asking why they rotate Xavier students, and other idiotic ideas people have.

p_in_da_wind
10-22-2005, 12:28 AM
Snipper, just forget it.... i think GODEEP is an Xavier offical trying to defent the school acting as a student....
Think about it, how else would this person would know how the relationship is between the shool and the government of aruba... The campus just opened less then 2 months ago.... If he/she is at Aruba then how does this person know that Bonair wanted them not to leave... Also, NO ONE but the school officials would think the WHO is JUST a formality... i am pretty DARN SURE that every medical student who knows what he/she is doing, knows that WHO approval is very important. I was reading some of the state requirements and every one requires the SCHOOL to be WHO apporved.... SO godeep, Good luck to you if you are trying to come back to US to practice...
By the way, can we get a list of Xavier Alumnis... i just wanted to see how many Grads are actually Practicing in U.S at this time... I asked the school and they told me that most of them went to a country other than US...
Well! heck i would go somewhere else too if i did not get licensed and had over a 100K to pay back with no job....

p_in_da_wind
10-22-2005, 12:28 AM
i dont know whats REALLY going on with Xavier administration but there sure is something fishy... Just by knowing what i know so far, i would avoid this school...

librarian
10-22-2005, 07:54 AM
quote: [Number 3 - Xavier was 10% of bonaire's GDP, they did not want us to leave i have no idea where you get that. Numerous government officials in Bonaire spoke at school events and were sad to see us go.]


10%! It's truly amazing that a school who had only a handful of students, a few faculty and staff (who probably did not pay income tax here), employed only a few Antilleans, and undoubtedly kept most of the school's money in the U.S. could be responsible for 10% of the GDP of an island of some 12,000 permanent residents and about 40,000 tourist visitors each year. As a permanent resident of Bonaire I find it fascinating. Or did you mean 10% of the GDP stemming from medical schools and locally grown produce? Really, I want to know.

p_in_da_wind
10-22-2005, 09:59 AM
i wonder where the Xavier Administrator here on VMD has to say about all this.... they dont seem to reply to these kind of questions.... Could it be because all these things said on this thread are true and they just dont have the answer or is it because of some other reason.... I would like to know...

kpp011
10-22-2005, 04:41 PM
i wonder where the Xavier Administrator here on VMD has to say about all this.... they dont seem to reply to these kind of questions.... Could it be because all these things said on this thread are true and they just dont have the answer or is it because of some other reason.... I would like to know...

LatinLover... they are probably calling an administrative meeting to discuss how to answer the question. Once they figure out which lies is more believable they will announce it :D

The amount of garbage on their website is hilarious.
Xaviers School of Medicine
:lolup:
With all the crass, low level dealings they have been portraying, its hard to believe its a medical school.
IQ version 2.0, it is a shame that you had to witness such an incident like that from a "medical school".. and I use the words "medical school" very cautously. Schools like this are a disgrace to medical education and the field of medicine in general.
If this is how the adminstration acts.. it truly is a sad and deperate state of affairs.

livvydoc
10-23-2005, 02:05 PM
Talking about low level dealing kp001 let's talk about how u asked your students to lie to Aruban immigration and say that they were tourists just so they can stay on the island. Any why haven't they gotten their DINA forms yet? I guess it was the luck of one of your low level dealings that got them to stay on the island so long but that was corrected when immigration raided your school!!! You let them drag your students out of their classes during exams. Instead of worrying about Xavier worry about ASUM and your students. Get your stuff together and do it the right way or you will have to answer to a whole lot of disgruntled students arright!!!!!!!
Let's attempt act like grown intelligent future doctors plz.

PEACE

kpp011
10-23-2005, 05:28 PM
Talking about low level dealing kp001 let's talk about how u asked your students to lie to Aruban immigration and say that they were tourists just so they can stay on the island. Any why haven't they gotten their DINA forms yet? I guess it was the luck of one of your low level dealings that got them to stay on the island so long but that was corrected when immigration raided your school!!! You let them drag your students out of their classes during exams. Instead of worrying about Xavier worry about ASUM and your students. Get your stuff together and do it the right way or you will have to answer to a whole lot of disgruntled students arright!!!!!!!
Let's attempt act like grown intelligent future doctors plz.

PEACE

SO now I'm telling students to lie? Who exactly do you think I am??? So its pretty obvious that you have NO IDEA of the events that procured towards the DINA incident.. either that or you feign ignorance. Maybe I should place all the dirty details up here of the anonymous calls from Xaviers to scare students into thinking they were going to be deported... and also scaring the locals into thinking a malaria epidemic would start.
And you think that's not underhand? Playing with the psyche of students during examination.. the only thing they have succeeded in doing is portraying their true nature. It had nothing to do with luck.. it had everything to do with legality...
You've only proven how low Xaviers is by bringing this up :)
Part of being an intelligent grown up doctor is to have a sense of moralilty.

livvydoc
10-25-2005, 09:16 PM
Dude I talked to some of your students and that's what they said. Don't shoot me clear it up with the students.

Constantine
10-31-2005, 07:17 AM
Check out the website:

"Official name:
Xavier University School of Medicine Foundation, a non-profit organization"

Ironic ain't it.

C.

reality
10-31-2005, 09:29 AM
Check out the website:

"Official name:
Xavier University School of Medicine Foundation, a non-profit organization"

Ironic ain't it.

C.

lol.........................

Xavier Admissions
10-31-2005, 03:29 PM
Check out the website:

"Official name:
Xavier University School of Medicine Foundation, a non-profit organization"

Ironic ain't it.

C.

Don't you know that most or all private schools are "non-profit foundations?" This is a simple business practice. You guys are really stretching to create some kind of fire...

librarian
11-01-2005, 06:36 AM
Don't you know that most or all private schools are "non-profit foundations?" This is a simple business practice. You guys are really stretching to create some kind of fire...

I think what people find amusing (or horrifying, depending on one's perspective) is the idea that you (and other schools) try to make it look like no one will ever profit financially from these schools, and we all know that the whole purpose of these schools is for someone to make money.

reality
11-01-2005, 08:37 AM
ur rite ...these schools are for earning money (only )without any standards or consideration for good education...and absolutely not non-profit organisations!!!

Xavier Admissions
11-01-2005, 09:16 AM
I think what people find amusing (or horrifying, depending on one's perspective) is the idea that you (and other schools) try to make it look like no one will ever profit financially from these schools, and we all know that the whole purpose of these schools is for someone to make money.

This is such an ignorant statement........ of course schools make money. All of them do. Please do some simple research do identify the reasons for creating a foundation. And also, please do research before the next subject of your choosing, hindering you from making yourself look uneducated again.

librarian
11-01-2005, 09:33 AM
This is such an ignorant statement........ of course schools make money. All of them do. Please do some simple research do identify the reasons for creating a foundation. And also, please do research before the next subject of your choosing, hindering you from making yourself look uneducated again.

I understand perfectly well what a not-for-profit organization is, I have worked for several. And if I were you I would not cast stones about my education. Read my comment again. What I take issue is how you try to make yourselves APPEAR to prospective students. And by the way, making a profit is in fact NOT the primary purpose of most educational institutions, it IS the primary purpose of most Caribbean medical schools. Please, try to convince me I'm wrong about that.

Xavier Admissions
11-01-2005, 09:42 AM
Believe what you wish.... Our current and incoming students are obviously not so easliy confused as you.

AUCMD2006
11-01-2005, 10:54 AM
This is such an ignorant statement........ of course schools make money. All of them do. Please do some simple research do identify the reasons for creating a foundation. And also, please do research before the next subject of your choosing, hindering you from making yourself look uneducated again.


simple question. why create a non profit foundation in the caribbean???? aside from advertising gimmick, tax purposes. you make a non profit organization but there is no research funding or anywehre else that the money is to be spent...so how can it be a noon profit institution? well you pay the board and president A LOT....enough to take care of all "profits" thereby rendering an institution "non-profit" and noty only avoiding taxes but probably getting tax breaks, governemnt land and who knows what else after a few local pay offs.

please post the foundation's profit expenditures, all non profit organizations have public budget reports.

all caribbean schools are for profit that is a fact so until you provide proof that funding is going to cancer research and not in the board's bonus checks your school is also for profit regardless of what your students beleive.

Constantine
11-01-2005, 01:15 PM
Indeed rrod makes an excellent point. Xavier runs it's operations from GMC in Atlanta, therefore xavier does not have any overhead costs apart from the rent in Aruba and the professors salaries.
I highly doubt that if asked Xavier can produce a transparent budget report.
Since it is a foundation could you email or PM me your public budget report.
They are also playing with the IRS in this "business scheme".
The students at Xavier have just received a 775$ tuition hike in the middle of the semester (October 28).
How far can the admin. keep trying the students patience.

C.

humpalot
11-02-2005, 11:41 AM
Increasing tuition in the middle of a term, is that an attempt to make more money before closing down? Is this common practice in the caribbean?

p_in_da_wind
11-02-2005, 06:24 PM
Don't you know that most or all private schools are "non-profit foundations?" This is a simple business practice. You guys are really stretching to create some kind of fire...




Check out the website:

"Official name:
Xavier University School of Medicine Foundation, a non-profit organization"

Ironic ain't it.

C.



Webster defines the term "nonprofit" as:

"not established for the purpose of making profit"

*Does that mean if i go to Xavier i dont pay anything? free education?

Because if you say that the teachers have to get paid then the teachers are going to profit from it... so then it would not be "non-profit"

After reading some of the posts by current and former students, articles on the internet news sites and finally after the XAVIER ADMINISTRATOR's posting that they have only 2 Grads so far.... i am convinced that students are not profitting from Xavier.... so in this case, the school really is a "non profit organization"

So i guess that is what the statement "a non profit organization" on their website means... Students will not profit from them... they are letting you know up front... no lies, nothing hidden... it is all their on the website so you can not complain in the end...

prof
11-02-2005, 08:08 PM
Quite the thread. This reminds me of the fun reading when Xavier and St. James students were at it. Now Xavier moves to Aruba and we have controversy with ASUM. Are all the islands filling up that Xavier couldn't find one for itself, to show what they can build from scratch? I have no problem with entrepreneurs buidling schools and stretching the limits of education. Most american medical schools are very conservative and well entrenched. Except for FSU there has been no new Allopathic school for decades. Wow over twenty five now in the Caribbean to push to that envelope of education. In that regard, most of us know that the MD is actually just a ticket to the real education. Residency, fellowship and continued medical education really make the doctor. Even in well established american medical schools, half of the MD graduates can't do many basic clinical skills, such as start IVs. It sounds unbelievable but it is true, and we are now trying to rectify that. It would be difficult for them to immediately go and be a doctor all by themselves in a little town, even though they have the MD. If a medical graduate from whereever has the basic knowledge and understanding of the different facets of medical specialities through their rotations, then it is the residency/fellowship that will make them the physician. Some skeptics keep saying that they wouldn't want a lower tier caribbean graduate to treat them. I don't know. To me it would depend on whether he/she had common sense, good skills and did well in their residency with lots of patient experience. That over a Ivy League MD/PhD graduate who did the minimal clinical work to focus on research during all the times they could, and did a residency at a research oriented hospital where the exposure to many different kinds of patients may have been less, and they were expected to help run the professors clinical trials. Does it really matter that in Europe and elsewhere some graduates go to medical school for 6 years, and some may go for 2 and three quarter years at McMaster in Canada. Who is the better doctor? I know a McMaster graduate in Toronto that I would take my closest family too. Even though he never had a science degree when he went to med school and never had much of a basic science curriculum that I could see from his study groups he was in. Wow but he is one great doctor and still sees over twenty people a day in his practice. It was not the medical school that made him a great doctor but what he did afterwards. If a caribbean school offered a curriculum modelled after McMaster, I bet there would be lots of negative chatter on this site. Like usual I've gotten off the topic of my original response. Xavier needs to find a niche for itself, and focus on a unique form of quality education. Market itself as a unique school to go to and not just another caribbean clone with problems. By brawling with other lower tier Caribbean schools it keeps it at that level. American schools are no longer required to have specific core rotations, but can blend the core experience among different courses. This is not an LCME requirement any more. Why are Caribbean schools still following this old format? Be creative and unique.

camel toe
11-03-2005, 08:01 AM
WHO update?

medstudentsSJSM
11-16-2005, 03:11 PM
Beware all new students who are interested in career in medicine. Xavier will take your money and will leave you stranded in cold air. I am a transfer student from sjsm and i wish i had never transferred, but we were scammed by these polished thievs.

medstudentsSJSM
11-16-2005, 03:16 PM
seems so true!

ahsan
11-17-2005, 09:08 AM
To all the prospective and current students attending Xavier,
I also was accepted into xavier for this but declined the offer due to further research (being new to the foreign med school thing) that made me weary of the school's admission policy as well as the school's WHO status.
1.) They asked for a telephone interview without a complete application!!!
2.) They do not have WHO recognition yet..not to say it won't happen, but this is why prospective students should wait till it does:
a.) w/o WHO recognition you can complete a MD degree but never use it
as it will not be accepted anywhere in the world.
b.) if you are thinking of attending Xavier prior to them being recognized
by WHO and transferring -DON'T!! Call any other school up and ask if
they will accept a transfer student from Xavier? Well, I'll save you some time - they won't! This is b/c they are not recognized by WHO, meaning
if you want to transfer you will start from scratch again...therefore,
don't even attend it to begin with.
c.) Last but not least most important piece of information, if you are
attending Xavier and are hoping it will get WHO recognition, it still
does not mean your MD will be of value. Why you may ask? This is
due to this nasty "grandfather clause" that you may get caught in.
A grandfather clause may state "from this so and so day forward
Xavier will be listed under WHO" This will not include those of you
who have started to obtain your MD's prior to that date therefore,
your degree will still be of no value.
3.) I do understand that this is a new school which makes it difficult to really follow up on their quality of education and residency matches in the USA, but not having established clinical placements...not even in NY is something to be very concerned about. When I called up the admissions director and asked about when is Xavier going to give us a list of clinical sites...he literally hesitated for 30 seconds...NOT A GOOD SIGN!!

All in all, I do not want anyone to get frusterated or upset regarding this information, just don't be a victim. Make sure you do your homework on any university before applying; don't blow $200,000 for a medical degree worth nothing. Your worth more than that. You can still get a quality education somewhere else, don't sell yourself short. I'm only posting this to inform others who are wanting to know more!

Best of luck to you all!



Xavier's Admission's Office is the best among all the schools I called to inquire.
I also underwent the interview process, I was very professional and the person who interviewed me answered all my questions and been very honest and upfront.

Their financial aid office is also very good.I asked them to apply for loanto learn program they did it once and called me back whereas there are other
schools who would not give a damn to it. Loan to learn program requires a school to be listed and approved by them before they fund the students. and it takes like 6 weeks for the process. when I called the financial Aid office and told him about loanto learn. He didn't even gave it a second thought and applied their. I am sure by now Xavier will have Loan to learn program also besides their other financing options.

It is very unwise to say whatever you said in your post.
They never called me for the phone interview without my incomplete application.

so before passing any judgement about anything do your homework and atleast be considerate to not to instigate any negative feeling.

Regards,

Ahsan

Chemist_11
11-18-2005, 11:21 AM
WHO accreditation is definatly a requirement of the GMC of the United Kingdom. an MD degree without WHO accred. is just considerd a sheet of paper in the eyes of the GMC.

teratos
11-18-2005, 11:23 AM
WHO doesn't accredit anyone. They list the schools. Careful with the terminology. Accreditation suggests some process of inspections etc. G

Chemist_11
11-18-2005, 11:27 AM
Stand corrected T. WHO listing is definatly required for GMC registration.

teratos
11-18-2005, 11:28 AM
Stand corrected T. WHO listing is definatly required for GMC registration.

Not trying to be a tool. It is just that saying it the other way implies something this isn't there.

Chemist_11
11-18-2005, 11:34 AM
Lol, no problems, i understand, thanks for the correction :).

medstudentsSJSM
11-18-2005, 12:06 PM
GMC group has put xavier for sale.

antonia
11-18-2005, 12:51 PM
hey, theres some flyers out in town that a med school (outside of aruba) is gonna hold some sort of a thing in the Paddock (downtown) tonight at 8. free food and drink. im gonna check it out before i go to the full moon party at Havana. wanna come?

antonia
11-18-2005, 01:05 PM
hey, i havent been on VMD for a while. good to be back. was reading through some of the stuff. for those of you who, like me, arent too happy here... theres some flyers out in town that a med school (outside of aruba) is gonna hold some sort of a thing in the Paddock (downtown) tonight at 8. looks like free food and drink. a friend and I are gonna check it out before we go to the full moon party. just to see what my options are. anybody plannig on going.

jpryor
11-18-2005, 01:58 PM
Beware all new students who are interested in career in medicine. Xavier will take your money and will leave you stranded in cold air. I am a transfer student from sjsm and i wish i had never transferred, but we were scammed by these polished thievs.

The grapevine has been very active and I'm sure sorry to hear it didn't work out the way you wanted. What recourse(s) are you considering? You can pm me if you prefer.

OLDPRO
11-18-2005, 03:28 PM
hey, theres some flyers out in town that a med school (outside of aruba) is gonna hold some sort of a thing in the Paddock (downtown) tonight at 8. free food and drink. im gonna check it out before i go to the full moon party at Havana. wanna come?

What school?

Smythe
11-18-2005, 10:26 PM
Beware all new students who are interested in career in medicine. Xavier will take your money and will leave you stranded in cold air. I am a transfer student from sjsm and i wish i had never transferred, but we were scammed by these polished thievs.
I believe it is flamming to say that there is cold air around Bonaire ( hey I made a rhyme )

As I understand it, it is quite tropical given the current forecast.

Updated: 8:00 PM AST on November 17, 2005http://icons.wunderground.com/graphics/conds/partlysunny.GIFSaturday
Scattered Clouds. High: 87° F / 31° C Wind ENE 17 mph / 28 km/h http://icons.wunderground.com/graphics/conds/nt_sunny.GIFSaturday Night
Clear. Low: 78° F / 26° C Wind ENE 20 mph / 32 km/h http://icons.wunderground.com/graphics/conds/sunny.GIFSunday
Clear. High: 82° F / 28° C Wind ENE 15 mph / 25 km/h http://icons.wunderground.com/graphics/conds/nt_sunny.GIFSunday Night
Clear. Low: 80° F / 27° C Wind ENE 17 mph / 28 km/h http://icons.wunderground.com/graphics/conds/sunny.GIFMonday
Clear. High: 82° F / 28° C Wind ENE 13 mph / 21 km/h http://icons.wunderground.com/graphics/conds/nt_sunny.GIFMonday Night
Clear. Low: 80° F / 27° C Wind ENE 13 mph / 21 km/h http://icons.wunderground.com/graphics/conds/chancerain.GIFTuesday
Chance of Rain. High: 82° F / 28° C Wind ENE 8 mph / 14 km/h http://icons.wunderground.com/graphics/conds/nt_sunny.GIFTuesday Night
Clear. Low: 80° F / 27° C Wind NE 6 mph / 10 km/h http://icons.wunderground.com/graphics/conds/sunny.GIFWednesday
Clear. High: 81° F / 27° C Wind North 2 mph / 3 km/h http://icons.wunderground.com/graphics/conds/nt_sunny.GIFWednesday Night
Clear. Low: 79° F / 26° C Wind North 6 mph / 10 km/h http://icons.wunderground.com/graphics/conds/sunny.GIFThursday
Clear. High: 81° F / 27° C Wind NNE 2 mph / 3 km/h http://icons.wunderground.com/graphics/conds/nt_sunny.GIFThursday Night
Clear. Low: 79° F / 26° C Wind North 6 mph / 10 km/h


I think it would have been more accurate to say that they are full of Hot Air, but definately not out in the cold air

(edited by teratos)

bts4202
11-19-2005, 07:57 AM
Beware all new students who are interested in career in medicine. Xavier will take your money and will leave you stranded in cold air. I am a transfer student from sjsm and i wish i had never transferred, but we were scammed by these polished thievs.



seems so true!


hahaha, it is nice that at least YOU think that what YOU SAID seems true.. ****

I dont really care one way or the other about what is bieng said here, but I just think it is too damn funny how many people on valuemd these days are having conversations with themselves, either through multiple accounts or sometimes even with the same account!

medstudentsSJSM
11-19-2005, 08:39 PM
:lolup: Current and recent faculty members of xavier have informed that atlanta has decided to sell xavier for one million dollar. First, whol would spent a million dollar to buy a dying insitution and why would someone buy it they are not even who approved. second, what will happen to the student who are said to be in rotations (the only rotations they have is that thier students get to rotate around atlata mco but not allowed to enter as of december). third, this school is fabricating false transcripts and other documents. Feel sorry those students who are going to learn the hard way.

p_in_da_wind
11-19-2005, 10:41 PM
If this is true, i really feel sorry for those students who are attending Xavier... i wish them all good luck... it is still not too late for them to turn around, get a transfer and start it all over again... Xavier may have cheated students out of their money but the students should have also done a better research before attending this school... All the clues are here on VMD and on their website... you can figure out a lot simply by talking to someone in the office.. When i talked to them over the phone, SOMETHING JUST DID NOT SOUND RIGHT.... which is why i scratched it out of my "SCHOOLS TO CONSIDER" list...

Smythe
11-20-2005, 07:57 AM
I dont really care one way or the other about what is bieng said here,




hahaha, it is nice that at least YOU think that what YOU SAID seems true..

:lolup:

.................................................. ..........:lolup:

sukhtinder
11-20-2005, 02:05 PM
frank!!! we need you in this tiem of crisis!!! the ship is sinking!!!!hellp!!

1001001 SOS

sukhtinder
11-22-2005, 07:56 PM
xavier is worth billiosn of dollars....nay....billions of pounds. it is incredibly valueable.

jpryor
11-23-2005, 09:25 AM
I am very disappointed in the quality of your drive-by snipes, suk. You are capable of so much better than this that these kinds of posts are beneath you. Are you working too hard? Not getting enough sleep?

sukhtinder
11-23-2005, 05:05 PM
I am very disappointed in the quality of your drive-by snipes, suk. You are capable of so much better than this that these kinds of posts are beneath you. Are you working too hard? Not getting enough sleep?

lol too good!

OLDPRO
11-30-2005, 11:28 AM
Whats really going on? IS there a charter? Is this school listed with WHO?

Students leaving? (that happens at all schools)

Are there loans?

Lets be fair.:rolleyes:

sukhtinder
12-09-2005, 05:38 PM
something as perfect as xavier cannot have any problems.

Xavier Admissions
12-14-2005, 12:40 PM
Xavier has a charter signed by the Arubian Govenment. We are hoping to increase the student's selection of Financial Aid programs in the upcoming months.

OLDPRO
12-15-2005, 07:27 AM
Xavier has a charter signed by the Arubian Govenment. We are hoping to increase the student's selection of Financial Aid programs in the upcoming months.

Thanks for the response. I hope this helps others.;)

empathy
12-18-2005, 12:55 PM
IF you really feel that you were scammed. You can contact these people. They might be able to help. I know nothing about this school myself. Could it be that you just had a bad experience there?

http://www.quackwatch.org/00AboutQuackwatch/mission.html

Oregon can definitely help. I made a report to them regarding ANOTHER school I had infomation about. They were very kind and helpful. They are in Oregon but they are commited to helping medical students period.

http://www.osac.state.or.us/oda/about.html


Beware all new students who are interested in career in medicine. Xavier will take your money and will leave you stranded in cold air. I am a transfer student from sjsm and i wish i had never transferred, but we were scammed by these polished thievs.

petenwe
12-18-2005, 07:38 PM
hmm
that cany

OLDPRO
12-20-2005, 04:21 AM
found this quote:



10-25-2005, 01:29 PM
http://www.valuemd.com/avatars/xavier-admissions.gif?dateline=1121873380 (http://www.valuemd.com/members/xavier-admissions.html)Xavier Admissions (http://www.valuemd.com/members/xavier-admissions.html) http://www.valuemd.com/images/statusicon/user_offline.gif vbmenu_register("postmenu_273461", true);
School Official
http://www.valuemd.com/images/heartbblu.gif
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Xavier University School of Medicine, ARUBA
Posts: 61



http://www.valuemd.com/images/icons/icon4.gif Xavier Admissions - General Response
Xavier University appreciates the concerns and comments of the current and incoming students. We feel that it is crucial to know what students believe to be true vs. what is true, and also what the general feel of the student population feels. The decision to move to Aruba opens up many doors for us, including hospital use, accreditation, and soon our WHO listing. We still have TERI Loans and we will be implementing another loan program to help our students with financing as well as existing loans. We certainly don't believe anyone can question our improvement of curriculum, making more states available for licensure to an Xavier student.

Xavier University also apologizes to visitors of this forum for the slanderous behavior of students and faculty, many of which are dissiminating from competing Universities. We believe that ValueMD is best used when not used as an attack from one school to the next. Please be advised that we DO NOT feel the need to spend hours a day having someone dedicated to making up aliases and attacking another program. The resources of these so called "highly informed" competitors (who again feel the need spend their time on "our" website,) would be best utilized on "their" website if they were so useful, right? If you feel that you have a legitament question and need a solid answer that you can keep to be documented, please contact us at [email protected] ([email protected]) or at our main number, 508-425-6338.
__________________
Xavier Admissions
Xavier University School of Medicine ([email protected])

empathy
12-21-2005, 11:50 AM
Xavier - IF, you answer EVERY question HONESTLY you won't have ANY problems on ValueMD. The only time things get crazy here is when people try to promote colleges by making false statements. Then, the ValueMD crowd goes wild! They begin pulling newspaper articles, business licenses, and reporting to consumer fraud agencies. And that is EXACTLY why I like ValueMD. It is a forum where the truth ALWAYS bubbles to the surface. There is no need to pull potential students to the side to talk to them privately if EVERYTHING you are doing is COMPLETELY above board.

Xavier Admissions
12-28-2005, 12:37 PM
We like to talk to people in person so that we may have a conversation about their future and what is best for the student. As you may or may not know, this site is supposed to be used for informational purposes, not personal content. It seems that those who accuse on here are reluctant to make that call, seeing as how we have very few who even bring up ValueMD.

AUCMD2006
12-28-2005, 02:08 PM
We like to talk to people in person so that we may have a conversation about their future and what is best for the student. As you may or may not know, this site is supposed to be used for informational purposes, not personal content. It seems that those who accuse on here are reluctant to make that call, seeing as how we have very few who even bring up ValueMD.

because you still have reltively few applicants. it is understandable that as a new school you will take anyone with a pulse, that you will try and get an edge whichever way you can, and that by talking to someone on the phone you can give a better salespitch.

what the poster was referring to are things that make a new school sell itself as the best option for every applicant. i agree that as long as you put things out there honestly such as the lack of graduates, licensed graduates, and other things that you need to build on no one will have a problem but anything that portrays the school as anything other than a for profit business, a charity for the good of mankind, or a better option than the rest of the established schools will run into trouble with the vmd crowd. and while the school is new there will not be a large vmd following but as it grows you will see the impact of this site and others.

follow the SMU path, they admit their acceptance rate is close to 90% they honestly put out the shortcomings of the school as well as not overstate the positives. i think if you sell yourself as an option that potential students should consider only after looking at the more established schools you will succeed. here are some things i would love schools to follow as a student:

1)remain clear and transparent in your curriculum. follow what is accepted widely and not be innovative or creative until you have a strong presence in the medical education arena. oh and don't give advance standing to anyone, don't let students teach classes, and have a good pre med program with guaranteed acceptance into the MD program if a certain gpa is maintained.

2) do not overinflate faculty. list them and their credentials. it is understanable that a new school will have many faculty from asia and middle east where you can get them cheap so make sure you have them take a usmle course or at least require them to watch the kaplan videos for the material they will teach so they can elaborate on what is relevant to US medicine. give them the most popular usmle review book for their class so they can make sure they cover that material in depth.

3) be truthful about rotation sites. it is exepcted that a new school will have some non acgme sites as a starting point. state which are acgme and which aren't. that you are working on getting them all to be acgme
and recommend that students check with the states they will work in to see if they require all acgme cores and or electives. even the big 3 had non acgme sites until a few years ago. if needed charge more for acgme rotations and pay more to get the required sites which do cost more.

4) be absolutely truthful about your usmle pass rates. it is expected that any school that has open acceptance with students with lower gpa's and mcats will have lower pass rates. it is nothing to hide and does not reflect on the school itself. just state it no matter what it is 40%, 50% whatever it is and make it a building point and tell students that it is a reflection of lower admission standards and you will work with them until they pass.

5) every one knows it so why not make it your mission statement. you are a new school that accepts students that most likely would not gain acceptance at other schools. you are willing to give them a chance yto prove themselves where other schools would not.

you aren't a worldclass medical school, aren't really striving to be a leader in anythinng other than profit margins, just like the others. be the first school to admit you will give anyone a shot, be completely truthful about everything and i guarantee you will suceed.

we are ultimately responsible for learning the material wether the prof is good or not so at a basic level all we want is a shot to sit for the usmle and a honest school. everything after that is gravy. hopefully all the stories that came out from the other island are not true otherwise this school is another typical carib scam run by shady people.....

just try and think about what will set you apart from the other 27 carib med schools that have opened in the last 10 years? they all claim ridiculous things just check out the iuhs site....be the first to be honest from the start

Xavier Admissions
01-09-2006, 11:58 AM
because you still have reltively few applicants. it is understandable that as a new school you will take anyone with a pulse, that you will try and get an edge whichever way you can, and that by talking to someone on the phone you can give a better salespitch.

what the poster was referring to are things that make a new school sell itself as the best option for every applicant. i agree that as long as you put things out there honestly such as the lack of graduates, licensed graduates, and other things that you need to build on no one will have a problem but anything that portrays the school as anything other than a for profit business, a charity for the good of mankind, or a better option than the rest of the established schools will run into trouble with the vmd crowd. and while the school is new there will not be a large vmd following but as it grows you will see the impact of this site and others.

follow the SMU path, they admit their acceptance rate is close to 90% they honestly put out the shortcomings of the school as well as not overstate the positives. i think if you sell yourself as an option that potential students should consider only after looking at the more established schools you will succeed. here are some things i would love schools to follow as a student:

1)remain clear and transparent in your curriculum. follow what is accepted widely and not be innovative or creative until you have a strong presence in the medical education arena. oh and don't give advance standing to anyone, don't let students teach classes, and have a good pre med program with guaranteed acceptance into the MD program if a certain gpa is maintained.

2) do not overinflate faculty. list them and their credentials. it is understanable that a new school will have many faculty from asia and middle east where you can get them cheap so make sure you have them take a usmle course or at least require them to watch the kaplan videos for the material they will teach so they can elaborate on what is relevant to US medicine. give them the most popular usmle review book for their class so they can make sure they cover that material in depth.

3) be truthful about rotation sites. it is exepcted that a new school will have some non acgme sites as a starting point. state which are acgme and which aren't. that you are working on getting them all to be acgme
and recommend that students check with the states they will work in to see if they require all acgme cores and or electives. even the big 3 had non acgme sites until a few years ago. if needed charge more for acgme rotations and pay more to get the required sites which do cost more.

4) be absolutely truthful about your usmle pass rates. it is expected that any school that has open acceptance with students with lower gpa's and mcats will have lower pass rates. it is nothing to hide and does not reflect on the school itself. just state it no matter what it is 40%, 50% whatever it is and make it a building point and tell students that it is a reflection of lower admission standards and you will work with them until they pass.

5) every one knows it so why not make it your mission statement. you are a new school that accepts students that most likely would not gain acceptance at other schools. you are willing to give them a chance yto prove themselves where other schools would not.

you aren't a worldclass medical school, aren't really striving to be a leader in anythinng other than profit margins, just like the others. be the first school to admit you will give anyone a shot, be completely truthful about everything and i guarantee you will suceed.

we are ultimately responsible for learning the material wether the prof is good or not so at a basic level all we want is a shot to sit for the usmle and a honest school. everything after that is gravy. hopefully all the stories that came out from the other island are not true otherwise this school is another typical carib scam run by shady people.....

just try and think about what will set you apart from the other 27 carib med schools that have opened in the last 10 years? they all claim ridiculous things just check out the iuhs site....be the first to be honest from the start


Initially, I am very sorry that you feel this way about Xavier. I am sorry that you, seeming to be an intelligent individual, actually believe most of this information on ValueMD. How many posts on here are from actual Xavier Students? Not many!!! From what you quoted you also are obvioulsy not a current student and so I am at a loss as to why you think we should admit to facts and scholastic ideas not attributed to Xavier. Your message only clarifies the attitude or defensive practices some other schools have towards our program. I don't believe that we have stated ANYWHERE that we are the best Caribbean Medical School, but we do state what we have and our plans in the future. If we do not have some attrribute or ideal it is easily understood by its nonexisting statement. Not that you are alone, but I once again am quite sure you haven't even had a conversation with an Xavier Admissions advisor or you would understand that we do not lie or exaggerate about ourselves, other faculty and administration, school statistics, and goals. You and others should really give us a call and find out for yourselves what we have to say instead of compiling complaints from non-students and /or other school's faculty. If we were so horrindous wouldn't we have had that "Mass Exodus" so many warned about? If we said we had things we didn't wouldn't and made lie after lie to students and applicants wouldn't one of these have actually complained about this, or better yet sued for false information? I can think of this senario which happened at a school recently. How about the number of transfers we have had since Xavier's start. Do you know how many this is, because this would be a great indicator of student's satsfaction. And now you are wanting to say "They only stay because you have Financial Aid!" Are you saying that we are the only school WITH FinAid? NO, we are not. So it's not money...... How about "Xavier is the easiest to get into!" You and I both know that there are larger and more established schools that share equivalent guidelines for entry. So it is not money or admission...... Is it the great beaches? The Casino? The Housing? The cost? The cetralized rotations? The Step(s) preperations? The actual education? XUSOM students stay because they like the school, and you would you if you gave us the opportunity.
Once again, please call 508-425-6338 if you are able to backup any of your information.

empathy
01-09-2006, 01:24 PM
Some schools have tried to turn students against ValueMD by telling them things just like what you said, "Your message only clarifies the attitude or defensive practices some other schools have towards our program. " Other schools are not out to get you. There is no conspiracy. Please stop the drama.

Rrod is a valuable member and his comments were dead on. Stop bashing him and ValueMD. Just be honest and you won't have any problems. Look at SMU for example. Everyone loves and trusts them. I ask them a question they ans. honestly - no problems.

jpryor
01-09-2006, 03:17 PM
Rrod is a valuable member and his comments were dead on. Stop bashing him and ValueMD. Just be honest and you won't have any problems. Look at SMU for example. Everyone loves and trusts them. I ask them a question they ans. honestly - no problems.

Where have you gained this alleged expertise to make comments on any school?

empathy
01-09-2006, 03:21 PM
you'd be surprised. Careful JP. Be kind.

jpryor
01-09-2006, 03:22 PM
Surprise us then.

empathy
01-09-2006, 03:24 PM
denied........

jpryor
01-09-2006, 03:36 PM
No expertise, huh? S'okay...it has been evident.

empathy
01-09-2006, 06:01 PM
but no ego.


No expertise, huh? S'okay...it has been evident.

jpryor
01-10-2006, 06:59 AM
but no ego.

Your impudency compensates well.

sukhtinder
01-12-2006, 08:13 PM
Your impudency compensates well.

my impotency doesnt though hyuck hyuck hyuck hyuck...







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