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lormak
09-06-2012, 06:03 PM
Hi

I am a UK citizen.

Am I right in thinking that if I complete a 6 year programme in Eastern Europe I can go straight to Foundation Year 2 in the UK with.full registration with GMC.

I am concerned about the job situation for FOundation Year 2 and speciality training. Seems extremely competitive. I am looking at Psych or neurology.

An alternative would be to do speciallity training in the EastEuropean country where I would have completed medical degree having first learnt.the language

Any thoughts?

Thanks.

Riften
09-06-2012, 09:51 PM
Stay in UK man if you can.


Hi

I am a UK citizen.

Am I right in thinking that if I complete a 6 year programme in Eastern Europe I can go straight to Foundation Year 2 in the UK with.full registration with GMC.

I am concerned about the job situation for FOundation Year 2 and speciality training. Seems extremely competitive. I am looking at Psych or neurology.

An alternative would be to do speciallity training in the EastEuropean country where I would have completed medical degree having first learnt.the language

Any thoughts?

Thanks.

devildoc8404
09-07-2012, 03:18 PM
I echo the sentiment expressed by Riften above.

FWIW... we have one UK citizen in our cohort, and he has told me that our pre-graduate internship is accepted by GMC as the FY1 year, so he will enter the FY2 year after graduation in January.

Residency/specialty training in E-EU is a questionable proposition, at best. For one thing, you have to pay tuition for the privilege of completing residency, and it costs as much or more than medical school tuition! For another, the quality of training and working conditions (not to mention the reliability and ethical values of attending physicians) varies from quite good to absolutely abysmal. Unless you know what you are getting in advance -- and even sometimes if you think that you do -- it can end ugly. Finally, you don't get paid for your work during residency.

My recommendation would be to stay UK or W-EU if at all possible. If you do decide to head to the E-EU for whatever reason, make sure that your selected school and program are completely accepted by the GMC in advance (they will tell you), and then proceed with your eyes wiiiiide open, prepared to bust your butt and feel frustrated a lot.

Good luck to you...

lormak
09-07-2012, 04:00 PM
Good advice. Thanks. I am reading more.and more about the competition.and lack of jobs for FY 1 and 2 in the UK of course that can change with passing years. This is a big uncertainty and there are doctors who are unemployed in the UK. I am a graduate but concerned about doing a 4 year prog because of a lack of foundation year 1 jobs. Germany or Ireland could be an alternative. Any thoughts?

devildoc8404
09-07-2012, 05:15 PM
You mean residency/specialty training in Germany/Ireland, right?

Germany is getting more competitive but is definitely an excellent option if you speak German well. They need doctors, they want good doctors, and there are many options there (especially the further east you are willing to go for training). Ireland would have been a fine possibility last year, but they have cut WAY back on their number of training positions in the last 6-9 months due to the economic poopfest, and the HSE recruiters are no longer allowed to work with foreigners in bringing them to Ireland for training. In fact, in some specialties there are no Irish opportunities for foreigners at all, unless they are funded by an outside government or agency.

Even if you could not get an FY1/2 position in the UK, but you could train in Germany, you could probably work thereafter in the UK, especially with UK citizenship. Heck, the UK has been taking all of Germany's doctors lately, anyway, because of the pay differential. Just make sure you choose a specialty with openings in the area where you want to work... which is a bit of a trick to try to determine 5-10 years in advance!

lormak
09-07-2012, 07:04 PM
Thanks Devildoc especially for the tip on East Germany. Why is the demand greater in.the East? Something to do with economic recovery since the changes in the early 1990's?

devildoc8404
09-07-2012, 07:31 PM
Yes, and simply because not as many people want to live there. The eastern region of Germany suffered a lot during the communist era and has not caught up economically with the western side of the country. German doctors generally either want to move to (or stay in) the western side of the country, or else move abroad for greater economic opportunities. This means that many eastern German cities tend to have more open positions -- even in some competitive specialties -- than might be found elsewhere.

With that said, there are some wonderful cities in the eastern side of Germany. It's not stuck in a vacuum, it's just not caught up with the western half yet... and it could be a while. Still, if you look at some of the hospitals in these bigger easter cities, they are very nice, and they are receiving a lot of EU money to bridge that gap. The nice thing for someone who speaks German and wants good training is that this demand for doctors creates an opportunity for excellent training.

Of course, you can work with almost any German medical recruiter to find positions throughout Germany, east or west, because it's all one country. But if you tell a recruiter that you are willing to consider a position in Leipzig, Cottbus, Dresden, Halle, Erfurt, etc., you will probably have a lot more interviews.

lormak
09-07-2012, 08:45 PM
That's really good to know thanks Devil Doc.
To be honest I don't mind where I work.

Do you know how the Polish 4 year MD programmes are viewed in Germany / East Germany?

devildoc8404
09-08-2012, 08:32 AM
I haven't looked into it, no. But hey, the Polish schools are granting EU medical diplomas, so I would be shocked if there was any problem at all. I would recommend contacting a few of the German medical recruiters for clarification, but my guess is that there is no trouble there. They would want to see an EU diploma (ideally) and German fluency at the B2 level (or better, for some specialties). As a UK citizen you would have no problems in that regard... it seems that citizens of some countries may raise questions with the German immigration authorities.

lormak
09-09-2012, 11:25 PM
Thanks Devildoc







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