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workinboy
11-16-2010, 08:59 AM
Hey guys. I've been searching around for a couple of days about chiropractors and the field of chiropractics and stumbled across this site and saw that there are quite a few regulars who partake in the discussions around here. With that being said, I wanted to see if I could get a few questions answered and possible look for someone to talk to and get advice from as time goes on. Anyway, I am currently a second year student at a University in North Carolina. All through high school and at the beginning of college I thought I had my heart set on med school and orthopaedics. Anyway, after thinking about everything and just getting a feel for the rest of my life, I'm not so sure about it anyway, but I do know I'd like to stay in the medical field. I've been seeing a chiropractor for my own problems for almost 6 years now and it's always a great visit.

I just wanted to get some advice/opinions on the life of a chiropractor. Do you generally work as much as MDs or DOs? Are you happy with your career as a chiropractor or do you wish you would have tried to go to medical school? What does the future of chiropractics look like? From what I've read it seems that chiropractors are beginning to become more popular these days especially with all of the healthcare reforms. And finally, how's the compensation in relation to the amount of hours worked? Feel free to PM me or reply to this post - always looking to meet people and learn more about anything, really!

Thanks again guys!

khiro
11-16-2010, 03:50 PM
workinboy

for my view on chiropractic please view my previous posts. that is my opinion on the profession; and others will differ with me and that is ok. i imagine both views are right depending on the person and his present station in life. i don't recommend chiropractic as a vocation for a young person.

on another note; what university in n.c.? years ago my dad used to coach summer clinics at duke. i had it made as a kid but didn't fully realize it. at least i can say that i have played basketball in cameron indoor stadium.

CARICOM-MED
11-16-2010, 06:21 PM
Profession is in a state of stasis :)
or Stuck because Mixers, or science based DCs... want to move with the times, be primary care, Rx medications and diagnose, but the straights are holding them back, and just wanna do manipulations and find "subluxations"....results = Stasis...
Conclusion consider broad scope mainstream professions: PA to MD
Cheers :)


Hey guys. I've been searching around for a couple of days about chiropractors and the field of chiropractics and stumbled across this site and saw that there are quite a few regulars who partake in the discussions around here. With that being said, I wanted to see if I could get a few questions answered and possible look for someone to talk to and get advice from as time goes on. Anyway, I am currently a second year student at a University in North Carolina. All through high school and at the beginning of college I thought I had my heart set on med school and orthopaedics. Anyway, after thinking about everything and just getting a feel for the rest of my life, I'm not so sure about it anyway, but I do know I'd like to stay in the medical field. I've been seeing a chiropractor for my own problems for almost 6 years now and it's always a great visit.

I just wanted to get some advice/opinions on the life of a chiropractor. Do you generally work as much as MDs or DOs? Are you happy with your career as a chiropractor or do you wish you would have tried to go to medical school? What does the future of chiropractics look like? From what I've read it seems that chiropractors are beginning to become more popular these days especially with all of the healthcare reforms. And finally, how's the compensation in relation to the amount of hours worked? Feel free to PM me or reply to this post - always looking to meet people and learn more about anything, really!

Thanks again guys!

workinboy
11-18-2010, 08:33 AM
workinboy

for my view on chiropractic please view my previous posts. that is my opinion on the profession; and others will differ with me and that is ok. i imagine both views are right depending on the person and his present station in life. i don't recommend chiropractic as a vocation for a young person.

on another note; what university in n.c.? years ago my dad used to coach summer clinics at duke. i had it made as a kid but didn't fully realize it. at least i can say that i have played basketball in cameron indoor stadium.

My apologies for the delayed response. I'm currently attending NCSU. On another note, at the beginning of college I was looking into Orthopaedic Surgery. I believe that if I were to continue on the same path I am on now, I'd have no trouble getting into one of the Nation's top med schools as I currently hold a 3.8 GPA and am involved in too many things to list. However, with that being said - I stressed my entire high school career to get to college now I'm stressing throughout college to get to med school and then once I'm there the hard part really starts. I just don't want to stress anymore. The chiropractors I currently see, there are 4 of them in the practice. Each one works only like two days a week and rotate the weekends and they are a huge practice with I bet a high amount of revenue and income for each DC. Their lifestyle seems awesome and whenever I go in to the office they are always happy and glad to see their patients. On a different note, all the doctors I've shadowed under (ortho surgeons, family drs, and orthopedists) are always stressed. the surgeon I shadow is always being called in at random hours of the night and I'm not sure if that's what I want to do. I'm just kind of stuck figuring out what I really want to do..

AgActual
11-19-2010, 09:18 AM
I can relate to you on the stress issue. I was well on my way to becoming a clinical psychologist when i realized I would be dead from stress by the age of 40. I switched out and went to chiropractic school instead. It is true that chiropractic (not "chiropractics" by the way) is one of the lowest stress health care professions around. The average chiro works about 38 hours per week, as opposed to maybe 50 or 60 a week as an MD, and has an average salary of about $120,000 a year. Really not a bad deal. The downside is that it is physically demanding which may or may not wear on you after many years.

I can certainly see where you are coming from on the issue of stress when deciding a career. That is absolutely something that you need to consider. There is only so much self-sacrificing one can do before it is no longer worth it. If you think that the pressure will be too much as a medical doctor, i see nothing wrong with exploring your options. It isn't an easy life. And there is nothing wrong with shifting your career goals either. For my first two years of college, i was hell bent on becoming a lawyer. Then i set my sights on clinical psychology then i ended up in chiropractic. I think it happens to all of us at some point.

I will answer some of your original questions a little later today. Hopefully I can give you some insight into what this field is all about.


My apologies for the delayed response. I'm currently attending NCSU. On another note, at the beginning of college I was looking into Orthopaedic Surgery. I believe that if I were to continue on the same path I am on now, I'd have no trouble getting into one of the Nation's *** *** ******s as I currently hold a 3.8 GPA and am involved in too many things to list. However, with that being said - I stressed my entire high school career to get to college now I'm stressing throughout college to get to med school and then once I'm there the hard part really starts. I just don't want to stress anymore. The chiropractors I currently see, there are 4 of them in the practice. Each one works only like two days a week and rotate the weekends and they are a huge practice with I bet a high amount of revenue and income for each DC. Their lifestyle seems awesome and whenever I go in to the office they are always happy and glad to see their patients. On a different note, all the doctors I've shadowed under (ortho surgeons, family drs, and orthopedists) are always stressed. the surgeon I shadow is always being called in at random hours of the night and I'm not sure if that's what I want to do. I'm just kind of stuck figuring out what I really want to do..

khiro
11-19-2010, 10:04 AM
first day of class; 160 people and you know no one. the dean walks in and writes CHIROPRACTICS on the white board. he turns to the students and asks "what is wrong with this word?" no one answers; partly b/c we didn't know; and partly b/c we were intimidated. he continues to ask, getting more and more agitated b/c of the silence. red faced he yells what is the problem with this word???? someone in the back of the room yells, IT STARTS WITH A "K". the dean asked for it and he got it.

STRESS; agactual is correct in pointing out the problem with stress. every job has it. however, we can direct and live our lives to avoid it or at least minimize it. it is a wise person who does this. some people thrive on stress while others like me don't care too much for it. i know of an orthopedist with multiple offices and he schedules 80+ patient encounters over a 4 hour block. he rarely goes beyond 3 minutes per pt. although he does excellent work i won't refer to him b/c there are other orthos who do good work as well and they know their pts names. but i highly doubt this ortho cares if i refer to him or not.

i treat an older man who used to sell insurance; now he works for the school district. high stress to low stress. he still goes to work even though he could retire b/c he enjoys his job b/c there is low to no stress. went from collecting money from a lot of people to someone giving him a check. but there is (IMO) NO use in getting a job with no stress if the pay is not there or if it is not what you want to do or if your talents are not being used. it is extremely hard to be successful in life if you incorrectly use your talents.

i know that being young sorta knocks that stress issue; but for most it does become an issue later in life. get a job that you love or at the least can tolerate that pays you good. and then concentrate on removing those items that generate stress. Agactual can give you some good advice on the here and now of chiro education as he is in chiro college.

AgActual
11-20-2010, 04:57 PM
o you generally work as much as MDs or DOs?

Chiros and medical doctors are still a bit distrustful of each other but the strained relationship has gotten better since the 1980's. Many DC's are able to establish a professional relationship with some medical doctors and other health care professionals in their area, for referrals and whatnot. However, most DCs don't partner up with MDs or DOs, as in running a clinic together. In the words of one of my chiropractor professors "any medical doctor over the age of 40 will hate you." That pretty much sums it up right there.


Are you happy with your career as a chiropractor or do you wish you would have tried to go to medical school?

I do know a few DCs that have expressed some regret about not going to med school instead. The main reason is that chiropractic is more limited in scope the medicine and after many years of practice, some chiropractors with they could branch out a bit and do new things. Usually they still seem to enjoy performing manual therapies but they wish there was a greater variety of conditions they could treat. I know a few they have gone back to school and became osteopaths.


What does the future of chiropractics look like?

I think you are going to see a continued division in the field. About half of the schools in the U.S. now are focusing more on broad based chiropractic care, meaning they want chiros to be primary care physicians. The other half still want chiropractic to stick with the older philosophy of treating "subluxations".

You would probably be far more interested former, in which case you would be basically be a mix between a physical therapist, a nutritionist, and a nurse practitioner( minus the knowledge of pharmaceuticals). However, in reality, most people will never come to you for their general health needs and you will likely spend most of your time treating musculoskeletal conditions and handing out nutritional advice.


From what I've read it seems that chiropractors are beginning to become more popular these days especially with all of the healthcare reforms

The health care reform law that passed this year does have some pro-chiropractic provisions in it. The biggest one is that it will soon be illegal for insurance companies to discriminate against health care providers, which means that an insurance company can't deny claims if you are treating conditions that you are legally allowed to treat.

As for becoming more popular. Not really. The percentage of people seeing chiropractors has held consistent around 10% for the past few decades. However, nutrition is becoming more popular, which is something that chiros have been moving into for the past few years. That might boost the numbers a little bit.

But even if the percentage of people seeing chiropractors is holding steady, the number of chiropractors in this country is dropping since there are more retirements than people entering the field. So younger chiropractors coming on the scene should start seeing more business as this field becomes a little more depopulated.


And finally, how's the compensation in relation to the amount of hours worked?

I mentioned this yesterday but it is decent. The cost of chiropractic school is on par with medical school, dental school, podiatry school, etc. The pay out of school is about $40,000 a year, which is not all that dissimilar to any other health care profession, and it shoots up rapidly, to about $120,000ish after about 5 years. The bottom 10% make about $70,000 a year and the top 10% make about $250,000 a year.

The pay is very similar to that of a family doc but being a chiropractor is a 9-5, monday-friday job.

Here is the pay distribution of chiropractors in North Carolina.

http://img508.imageshack.us/img508/9894/chiro.png

workinboy
11-25-2010, 07:55 PM
Chiros and medical doctors are still a bit distrustful of each other but the strained relationship has gotten better since the 1980's. Many DC's are able to establish a professional relationship with some medical doctors and other health care professionals in their area, for referrals and whatnot. However, most DCs don't partner up with MDs or DOs, as in running a clinic together. In the words of one of my chiropractor professors "any medical doctor over the age of 40 will hate you." That pretty much sums it up right there.


Ag and Khiro, thanks for taking out time to answers some of my questions. Chiropractic is definitely something I'm going to be looking into. Like I've mentioned before being in college has made me realize that everything isn't about money. All through high school I thought I'd need a high paying job and lots of money to be happy. That couple with the fact that I'm not trying to be in school for half my life and all the stress and hours that comes with being an MD or DO. I don't know. I guess the next step is reading about the healthcare reform and some of the changes that may be coming to chiropractic, then go from there..

AgActual
11-25-2010, 09:39 PM
Anytime. And if you need any advice on schools to look into come on by. Just about everyone here is pretty well versed in which schools are trustworthy and which ones you should avoid like the plague.


Ag and Khiro, thanks for taking out time to answers some of my questions. Chiropractic is definitely something I'm going to be looking into. Like I've mentioned before being in college has made me realize that everything isn't about money. All through high school I thought I'd need a high paying job and lots of money to be happy. That couple with the fact that I'm not trying to be in school for half my life and all the stress and hours that comes with being an MD or DO. I don't know. I guess the next step is reading about the healthcare reform and some of the changes that may be coming to chiropractic, then go from there..

workinboy
11-25-2010, 09:42 PM
Anytime. And if you need any advice on schools to look into come on by. Just about everyone here is pretty well versed in which schools are trustworthy and which ones you should avoid like the plague.

thanks again. yeah, i saw that when i was reading up on stuff. is there basically two schools of thought? Subluxation v. Primary Care? Which schools should I avoid? I've been looking into schools recently as well. How does NYCC compare (only ask because i've got family in that area). Life Chiropractic is always visiting my campus for information sessions as well, but I've heard to avoid them..

AgActual
11-25-2010, 10:19 PM
is there basically two schools of thought? Subluxation v. Primary Care?More or less. The subluxation schools have a strong belief that nervous system interference caused by a dysfunctional vertebral column results in all sorts of diseases, like cancer, diabetes, the flu, ADHD, and really whatever condition you can think of and those schools believe a chiropractors main job is to find and treat that nerve interference.

The primary care schools (usually called "mixer schools") focus far more on MSK treatments, nutrition, and diagnosis/treatment of common, minor medical problems with alternative medicine. The mixer schools all believe in subluxations to some extent but if you go to one of the progressive schools, they really only pay lip service to the concept. Some of these schools moved on from that old theory years ago.


Which schools should I avoid? I've been looking into schools recently as well. How does NYCC compare (only ask because i've got family in that area). Life Chiropractic is always visiting my campus for information sessions as well, but I've heard to avoid them.. Yeah, avoid Life. They are usually considered to be the worst chiropractic college in the U.S.. That school causes a lot of problem for this field. A little south of that is Palmer's Florida campus, i wouldn't go there either. Sherman college is in South Carolina. That is a definite one to avoid. I wouldn't be suprised if they are shut down by the CCE with in the next few years.

NYCC is a really good school. If I had ended up there, I would have been happy with it. Their campus and facilities are also supposed to be amazing. Other schools in the area are the University of Bridgeport, which is in Bridgeport, Connecticut, and D'Youville College, which is in Buffalo, New York, are really good schools too. Maybe a bit of a stretch but sort of in the upper new york area is Canadian Memorial Chiropractic College, which is in Toronto. It is supposed to be the second best chiropractic college in North America after National University. I think their graduates can practice in the U.S..

Those are really the only schools in that area. The only other college on the east coast that i would look at is National University of Health Sciences' Florida campus.


That is about it for the area you have been talking about. Of course there are other colleges around the country but the next closest ones are in Chicago and Minneapolis, which it doesn't sound like you are all that interested in right now.

CARICOM-MED
11-26-2010, 02:56 PM
All of these are accredited, however the focus is VERY different:

DC Schools to avoid: (Subluxation Based-"Straight DC")

International Chiropractors Association (http://www.chiropractic.org/index.php?p=education)
Sherman
Palmer X3
Parker
Life X2
Cleveland X2
[Palmer has 3 campuses, Cleveland & Life have 2 EACH]


DC Schools to Consider: (Primary Care Focus- "Mixed DC")
NUHS
Bridgeport U (BU)
Western States (WSCC)
Logan
NorthWestern (NWUHS)
New York (NYCC)
CMCC (Canada)

k4i2d0
11-26-2010, 02:57 PM
sorry for wrong post

AgActual
11-26-2010, 09:51 PM
Just a slight adjustment to the list but overall pretty good.

All of these are accredited, however the focus is VERY different:

DC Schools to avoid: (Subluxation Based-"Straight DC")

International Chiropractors Association (http://www.chiropractic.org/index.php?p=education)

Sherman
Palmer X3
Parker
Life X2
Cleveland X2
Logan (I don't trust them)


[Palmer has 3 campuses, Cleveland & Life have 2 EACH]


DC Schools to Consider: (Primary Care Focus- "Mixed DC")

NUHS
Bridgeport U (BU)
Western States (WSCC)
NorthWestern (NWUHS)
New York (NYCC)
CMCC (Canada)
Southern California
D'Youville

Drgeosprint
11-28-2010, 07:07 PM
AgActual Oh for for pity's sake. Seriously, do you know anything about the schools you are talking about. Since I went to one of your "straight" schools (25 years ago) even then they were teaching a core curriculum that was definitely considered medical.
Yes, Sherman, Reggie Gold's and Texas were the regressive elements of the profession. Life, both west and Atlanta, logan, Parker, Palmer (a bit more conservative) were more than adequate. Chicago was the most med like. I seriously doubt you know any of these schools. I attend many cont. ed classes through various venues and find outstanding Doc's and their level of advanced "medical knowledge" quite good. I have worked ER's, private clinics in Europe (Md's/DDs etc) advanced internal medical emphasis (cancer etc.) My training was a great foundation. The curriculum in chiropractic schools is quite consistent if they are accredited. No school can teach you everything you need to know out of the box. Either MD or Chiro. You sir, are creating a disservice to anyone who is actually seeking help to determine their path. Mea culpa for the earlier version. A bit of dander was involved.

Drgeosprint
11-28-2010, 07:10 PM
You, UHSADOC, I would love to meet you in a clinical setting. Your ignorance is overshadowing your hubris.







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