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View Full Version : You Care About Your Future Get Out Of Xavier Aruba Or Bonair



xlxl
01-25-2008, 10:44 PM
user can't play nice

Dr. Prince
01-26-2008, 08:41 AM
Talking about Aruba, yes they are accredited by WHO, IMED, and they have charter from Aruba Gov. I know Xavier student who write USMLE. IF you do not something don't talk about it.
Go and do your reseach again.

Dr. Prince
01-26-2008, 08:43 AM
For your info go to www.IMED.ECFMG.org (http://www.IMED.ECFMG.org) and you will see Xavier

DOC.p
01-26-2008, 08:49 AM
to be fair, it's not the Department of Education in NY, it's the Board of Medical Licensing that does the site visits

jasano
01-26-2008, 09:01 AM
Talking about Aruba, yes they are accredited by WHO, IMED, and they have charter from Aruba Gov. I know Xavier student who write USMLE. IF you do not something don't talk about it.
Go and do your reseach again.

You're right, and Xavier students have gone on to be residents. Let's face facts though, Xavier needs a lot of work, and certainly does behave deceptively - oh the loans will be in on Monday, err well Tuesday, well Friday at the latest... Well maybe next Monday... Visa issues and sudden deportations plague the school as well, but perhaps that's just an Aruba thing. Do you realize that a cadaver was deported recently from the school? Maybe its papers weren't signed...

Plus, off those who write the USMLE, 10/25 pass?

Xavier has a long way to go to be a premier Caribbean school. Right now, and as others have indicated, it should be a choice of last resort. I've got $8000.00 in and 0 out. So like any smart gambler, I've come to the realization that it's time to leave the table. Besides, I need a paddle to cross my kitchen and dining area right now. Nice... that was supposed to be fixed weeks ago. Ah life on the island...

XLXL is right about NewYork, where it's very difficult to get accreditation, so if NewYork is your destination, then Xavier shouldn't be a stop along the way. If you're Canadian and have dreams of practicing in Canada, then the Caribbean is a poor choice all around.

Sorry, but I call them as I sees them.

jameslynton
01-26-2008, 06:05 PM
... If you're Canadian and have dreams of practicing in Canada, then the Caribbean is a poor choice all around.
Sorry, but I call them as I sees them.Actually, Saba, AUC, SGU, Ross, St Matt's and AUA all have Canadians doing well in their programs. Do have to have the MCAT taken for these schools for the most part. As for your living conditions, sorry, Aruba has some nice places - The friends of Xavier who rent to Xavier students are not on the nice list.

jasano
01-27-2008, 06:46 AM
Actually, Saba, AUC, SGU, Ross, St Matt's and AUA all have Canadians doing well in their programs. Do have to have the MCAT taken for these schools for the most part. As for your living conditions, sorry, Aruba has some nice places - The friends of Xavier who rent to Xavier students are not on the nice list.

Wrong on both counts I'm afraid. Caribbean schools offer little for Canadians who want to return to Canada - Canada is virtually a closed door to those who haven't done their training there. Moreover, good luck getting that training because no Caribbean schools offer cores in Canada and Canada does not offer more than a handful of residencies to non-Canadians. Take the stats for any given year in Canada, and you will find a number of foreign trained doctors, who've passed all the steps and are still waiting for residency - many have been waiting upwards of 2 or 3 years for unpaid residency spots... you'll also find a rising tide of patients who are unable to get a family doctor.

On Aruba, Oh man, I have heard so many horror stories on this island it's unbelievable. Landlords telling students to pack up today and head out the door this afternoon - 24 minutes notice anyone? Others have been threatened with physical violence.

Much of the housing available to students is expensive (overpriced) and much of it is in great need of repair - my kitchen dining area is flooded daily, my sink upstairs does not drain, the windows seal poorly, and in some cases we're missing them altogether - meaning that mosquitos have easy access and the A/C becomes a costly option. Trust me, this is one of the better places.

You're right about one thing though, you'll find better housing on your own than you will through the school. It's a major culture shock for many students coming to Aruba who soon discover that they have no furniture (though they were promised this), no electricity and no water. The nice places are in the travel brochures, and you won't being staying at any of those kiddies.

Theft is also a major problem on the island, (once again despite what the travel brochures say), so keep your doors locked at all times and your laptop on or near your lap.

canadianforlife
01-27-2008, 08:31 AM
Actually for your information, Canada is not that closed door at all from Caribbean schools especially those from SGU, SABA, MUA-Nevis etc. The school has to have accreditation from IMED and WHO, write your Medical council evaluating exam part 1 and 2, and in provinces such as Manitoba,Saskatchewan, Nova Scotia,then apply to CARMS which is the Canadian matching program. Its possible to get in at first round before theres a shortage there. In provinces like Ontario much harder to get your residency coming from a Caribbean schools but its still done.However, theres more preference rather then the Caribbean if your say from Ireland, England, and Australia. Just thought I would clarify that.

jasano
01-27-2008, 09:51 AM
Actually for your information, Canada is not that closed door at all from Caribbean schools especially those from SGU, SABA, MUA-Nevis etc. The school has to have accreditation from IMED and WHO, write your Medical council evaluating exam part 1 and 2, and in provinces such as Manitoba,Saskatchewan, Nova Scotia,then apply to CARMS which is the Canadian matching program. Its possible to get in at first round before theres a shortage there. In provinces like Ontario much harder to get your residency coming from a Caribbean schools but its still done.However, theres more preference rather then the Caribbean if your say from Ireland, England, and Australia. Just thought I would clarify that.

Why Is Canada Shutting Out Doctors?
While millions of Canadians canít find a doctor, thousands of foreign physicians canít get a licence to practise BY CLAUDIA CORNWALL

Why Is Canada Shutting Out Doctors? (http://www.readersdigest.ca/mag/2004/08/doctors.html)

jameslynton
01-27-2008, 10:16 AM
In the last few years students at Saba and SGU have gotten residence positions in Canada - Right out of school - don't believe all that you read in certain papers or sources. I know of several cases where once they finished residence in the US, they were allowed to practice back Canada, as that they were Canadian or from the Brit commonwealth. It is more problematic for MD's who are from the country and did the school there. Reader's Digest is not know as a great source of anything more than hearsay information.

canadianforlife
01-27-2008, 12:00 PM
Why Is Canada Shutting Out Doctors?
While millions of Canadians canít find a doctor, thousands of foreign physicians canít get a licence to practise BY CLAUDIA CORNWALL

Why Is Canada Shutting Out Doctors? (http://www.readersdigest.ca/mag/2004/08/doctors.html)

Just for your information, that article was written quite a while back. Readers digest like James Nylon has posted out is not very reliable. Those doctors the author mentioned are actually foreign medical graduates meaning they were born there and they did there entire medical training at there country . In my case if i was to go outside of Canada I would be considered an IMG( International Medical Graduates) because I was born in Canada and finished my undergrad in Canada giving me the chances I mentioned before.
SABA University - www.saba.edu - international medical university college (http://www.saba.edu/residency_match.php) Saba Matching in 2007 at
least 5 Canadian
SABA University - www.saba.edu - international medical university college (http://www.saba.edu/residency.php)
This there alumni few Canadians there.
Shall I go further in proving my point
CaRMS - (R-1) - Eligibility - Provincial Restrictions (http://www.carms.ca/eng/r1_eligibility_prov_e.shtml) this is to prove what I was talking about before. You may have your point about Xavier I don't know much about it but i think I have made my point clear about Canada.

jasano
01-27-2008, 07:00 PM
Just for your information, that article was written quite a while back. Readers digest like James Nylon has posted out is not very reliable. Those doctors the author mentioned are actually foreign medical graduates meaning they were born there and they did there entire medical training at there country . In my case if i was to go outside of Canada I would be considered an IMG( International Medical Graduates) because I was born in Canada and finished my undergrad in Canada giving me the chances I mentioned before.
SABA University - www.saba.edu - international medical university college (http://www.saba.edu/residency_match.php) Saba Matching in 2007 at
least 5 Canadian
SABA University - www.saba.edu - international medical university college (http://www.saba.edu/residency.php)
This there alumni few Canadians there.
Shall I go further in proving my point
CaRMS - (R-1) - Eligibility - Provincial Restrictions (http://www.carms.ca/eng/r1_eligibility_prov_e.shtml) this is to prove what I was talking about before. You may have your point about Xavier I don't know much about it but i think I have made my point clear about Canada.

Yes, and well I think it's just great when people win the lottery too, but let's be realistic, Canada has closed it's doors to Canadians attending foreign medical schools. Some people may still squeak by, but by and large, returning to Canada will represent a tremendous challenge to say the least. Sorry to interject realism, and in so doing, burst your illusionary bubble, but take a look at this:

(Oh, and for the record, I think that Reader's Digest, a nationally syndicated magazine, could be considered a 'reliable' source of information.)

Caribbean Medical Schools - Online Guide - Offshore Medical Schools, Foreign Medical Schools, International Medical Schools (http://www.caribbeanmedicine.com/openletter.htm)

Some Exerpts:

"I am going to get a residency in Canada"
It is a fact that of all the IMG's that come to Canada, 90-95% will not obtain a residency. The few that do, do so, after either years and years of trying, or, because they know people in high places who 'pull strings' for them.

Just visit www.carms.ca and see how few IMG's get a residency in Canadian match every year. There are currently 12,000 (twelve thousand) IMG's in Canada, actively seeking a residency position. In Ontario alone, there are currently over 4000 (four thousand) foreign doctors with no job and no residency.

Then you have all this talk about being able to get a residency in Canada 'outside the match'. Where? How? Don't just hear that and think that your set, you must have facts! The only ones that will be able to take advantage of this are those with some serious 'inside' connections. Their rumors, and hearsay are bogus, and we all know it. I definitely won't plan out my medical career based on the 'doors will open up' theory. Because quite frankly in Canada they never will, definitely not for graduates of foreign medical schools.

Across Canada there are thousands and thousands of desperate foreign trained doctors. Some of them are outright Canadian Citizens! Of those select few that actually complete all the requirements needed just to apply, only 10% will obtain a residency position (it has varied between 4% and 16% over the past 12 years). Also, those residency positions are the worst, left over ones, that NO Canadian medical graduate wanted.

Update on the 2007 Canadian (CaRMS) Residency Match
2007 was the worst match rate in 10 years (1998-2007) for International Medical Graduates (IMG's) in Canada.
Are you ready for the statistic?
Only 6 (six) percent of all IMG's matched to residency position in Canada in the second iteration of the CaRMS match.
This is the worst result in 10 years. Things will only get worse with the large number of Canadians going abroad for medical school and returning to Canada after graduation.
If you add the stats from the first iteration for IMG's the total stat becomes 11.4% as a match rate for ALL IMG's in Canada for both the first and second iterations combined.

Keep in mind that an IMG is not just a foreigner who comes to Canada with a medical degree. IMG can also mean a Canadian citizen who goes to foreign medical school.
Stats obtained from the second iteration statistics here:

http://www.carms.ca/eng/operations_R1stat_2007_e.shtml (http://www.carms.ca/eng/operations_R1stat_2007_e.shtml) (Scroll down to the bottom of the page).
All the stats are here: http://www.carms.ca/eng/operations_R1reports_07_e.shtml (http://www.carms.ca/eng/operations_R1reports_07_e.shtml)

I think I have made my point clear about Canada.

dt
01-27-2008, 08:35 PM
Good links to CARMS...

at http://www.carms.ca/pdfs/2007MatchResults/Match_Results_IMG_en.pdf

only 69 out of 1125 IMGs matched in Canada in 2007! so sad...

jasano
01-28-2008, 03:51 AM
Good links to CARMS...

at http://www.carms.ca/pdfs/2007MatchResults/Match_Results_IMG_en.pdf

only 69 out of 1125 IMGs matched in Canada in 2007! so sad...

69 out of 1125!? Oh ya, those are good odds...

69/1125 x 100% = 6.13%

WPW
01-28-2008, 11:10 AM
you have to keep in mind when thinking about going back to Canada is that Canada is a much smaller country then the states in population comparsion. We only have like 9 medicial schools and not that many spots! i've heard of people matching, they have had to wait. Best way to do it is do your residency in the states, and specialize in the states become board certified and then go back to canada. Going back to canada is not IMPOSSIBLE but HIGHLY IMPROBABLE!

Jasano i cant belive your not enjoying aruba, had the best 16months of my life there! Sucks being in Atlanta, wish I could go back! Best of Luck to you.

jasano
01-29-2008, 08:37 AM
Well, a large part of my discontent came from having mosquitos buzzing in my ears all night, combined with dogs barking, and even a rooster crowing in the early am. Sleep was simply not possible, and so the minor problems I experienced were amplified many fold. At any rate, I may give Xavier a shot for the medical program - that is to say, if Xavier decides to give me one. Premed in Aruba, however, is too much of a gamble.
Do your premed elsewhere!

WPW
01-29-2008, 11:27 AM
u should never do PREMED in any carib school always attempt back home and then go.

xlntxs
01-31-2008, 09:16 AM
On Aruba, Oh man, I have heard so many horror stories on this island it's unbelievable. Landlords telling students to pack up today and head out the door this afternoon - 24 minutes notice anyone? Others have been threatened with physical violence.

Much of the housing available to students is expensive (overpriced) and much of it is in great need of repair - my kitchen dining area is flooded daily, my sink upstairs does not drain, the windows seal poorly, and in some cases we're missing them altogether - meaning that mosquitos have easy access and the A/C becomes a costly option. Trust me, this is one of the better places.

You're right about one thing though, you'll find better housing on your own than you will through the school. It's a major culture shock for many students coming to Aruba who soon discover that they have no furniture (though they were promised this), no electricity and no water. The nice places are in the travel brochures, and you won't being staying at any of those kiddies.

Theft is also a major problem on the island, (once again despite what the travel brochures say), so keep your doors locked at all times and your laptop on or near your lap.
to take a few extreme examples and project them as the norm is actually quite ridiculous of you. i for one, as is the case with a good majority in my opinion, have had no problems with housing as you suggest. yes school appointed accommodations are expensive, but let's put it all in perspective. i live at punto di oro right now where my rent is a bit pricey per month, but includes all furnishings, all utilities with a very generous limit, full satellite cable tv, a business DSL internet connection with jacks installed, is very clean and well maintained with once a week maid service which saves me a good day of cleaning. the other great thing is that we have 24 hr security.

so all in all i don't think my paying an extra $100-150 per mth is all that much of a sacrifice for some of the luxuries i'm afforded here. it's no surprise that about 4/5 of my complex are xavier students NOT in their first semester.

it's like most things in life, u get what u pay for. if you can't afford $700-850/mth for living minus food, then yes this option may not be viable for you. i cut it close with my budget, but i'd much rather have the peace of mind while concentrating on school, rather than having to constantly clean or watch out for my things.

security and theft are an issue on this island, but then again, where in the world is it not? we come from the U.S. or Canada where people get shot and killed over less, and we complain that there's theft here? i don't see the logic in that.

all in all, i feel for you that your experience here was a negative one. but at the same time your experiences are in no way the norm here on this island. from my perspective actually, you've had it worse than anyone else by far, even from past semesters. and from my knowledge, you are the only individual who's left the school thus far. so let's just call it like it is :)

jasano
01-31-2008, 12:43 PM
to take a few extreme examples and project them as the norm is actually quite ridiculous of you. i for one, as is the case with a good majority in my opinion, have had no problems with housing as you suggest. yes school appointed accommodations are expensive, but let's put it all in perspective. i live at punto di oro right now where my rent is a bit pricey per month, but includes all furnishings, all utilities with a very generous limit, full satellite cable tv, a business DSL internet connection with jacks installed, is very clean and well maintained with once a week maid service which saves me a good day of cleaning. the other great thing is that we have 24 hr security.

so all in all i don't think my paying an extra $100-150 per mth is all that much of a sacrifice for some of the luxuries i'm afforded here. it's no surprise that about 4/5 of my complex are xavier students NOT in their first semester.

it's like most things in life, u get what u pay for. if you can't afford $700-850/mth for living minus food, then yes this option may not be viable for you. i cut it close with my budget, but i'd much rather have the peace of mind while concentrating on school, rather than having to constantly clean or watch out for my things.

security and theft are an issue on this island, but then again, where in the world is it not? we come from the U.S. or Canada where people get shot and killed over less, and we complain that there's theft here? i don't see the logic in that.

all in all, i feel for you that your experience here was a negative one. but at the same time your experiences are in no way the norm here on this island. from my perspective actually, you've had it worse than anyone else by far, even from past semesters. and from my knowledge, you are the only individual who's left the school thus far. so let's just call it like it is :)

Okay, let's call it like it is, as you say. We could start with a little more honesty on your part. I know for a fact that my roomate left just prior to my own departure, so that makes two students, not one - and that's without counting the number who were deported.

I never did claim that Xavier is the worst school on earth, or that it should be torn down brick by brick, because these things wouldn't be true. I'm a strong believer in principles like honesty, and I have been wholly honest in everything I've said.

Excercise caution when taking advice from those whose self-interests come before your own. In otherwords, I have no ties to the school. I do not feel threatened by those who criticize it, (or any school I attended or may attend), because I believe that criticism is a healthy path towards progress. (Unlike xlntsx here)

It is best that you make your decision to attend or not attend with all the facts available. Know that Xavier has no labs in its premed science courses and that this may impact upon your future aspirations. Know that housing is a major issue for MOST students and that those like the above writer, are, despite his protests, firmly in the minority. Things will get better for those who stick it out in most cases, although you may have to look around quite a bit to find affordable, liveable housing. A great MANY students found their lodgings were originally unfurnished, often without electricity and or plumbing.

If I had known how poor was the housing situation, I may not have gone down to Aruba. On the otherhand, I might have gone down way ahead of time and arranged housing on my own and found myself a happier student, more comitted to Xavier - nobody needs these kinds of headaches when they're trying to study. Anyone who pretends that housing isn't an issue for Xavier Aruba is being patently dishonest
. (note usage of extra large period)

IMG Reality
02-03-2008, 01:46 AM
I don't mean to be offensive or anything, but jasono you should have never attempted to do premed at a Caribbean school in the first place. I'm not sure what the requirements for licensure in Canada are, but in the US you have to do your premed courses from an accredited US school (in many states at least 60 credits). I don't know if there are any students from any Carib school that did premed there and were licensed in the US , but I could be wrong though. Most Carib schools have these programs as an easy way into their MD program and to make more $. It is not surprising that there are lack of faculty for the premed program. This is to anyone thinking about premed in the Carib and one day practicing in the US or Canada.. do premed back at home and then look for other options as a last resort. This point has been covered many times and still people don't take the advice.

ams
02-05-2008, 10:30 PM
WOW

how come this xlxl guy keeps getting blocked...i never to get read his stuff.

TXMD2B
02-06-2008, 12:14 AM
Why so much hatred toward Xavier today? Do your research so there are not surprises.

sukhtinder
02-24-2008, 04:21 PM
xavier is awesome in my opinion. i miss frankenstone.

MDXRS22
02-24-2008, 04:49 PM
Frank, the unforgettable buddy :)

Where is he now?

Frank, stop by and say hello please:)







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