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Kermun
08-12-2007, 03:26 PM
hey, i got accepted into all saints medical school, but im not sure if its the school for me. From what ive read in the forums it seems like it might be a scam? If there is anybody attending the school, it would be greatly appreciated if you could tell me how the education is. If you actually learn, or if you have to teach yourself. Also, i was wondering about qualitiy of the clinical rotaions. Any information would be greatly appreciated. thnx!!

Asclepios
08-13-2007, 04:36 PM
School is good - better and better each semester - teachers are very helpful and very knowledgeable. I definitely get taught to but I also teach myself which I think is necessary in medical school. The last thing I want is to be taught everything by spoonfeeding. I don't know about rotations but maybe one of our students that are in rotations will have time to reply to that question. The school is definitely no scam - we are a small school and going through the usual growing pains but I know for a fact the the government and the administration is completely behind us. We have the Medical Council of Dominica come and visit regulary and they are the same council that recognizes Ross U. I am not saying we are perfect - far from it - but in the 4 semesters I have been here I get more and more confident in my abilities and in my school. If you have any other questions please feel free to ask - I attend the Dominica campus.

AUCMD2006
08-13-2007, 05:03 PM
hey, i got accepted into all saints medical school, but im not sure if its the school for me. From what ive read in the forums it seems like it might be a scam? If there is anybody attending the school, it would be greatly appreciated if you could tell me how the education is. If you actually learn, or if you have to teach yourself. Also, i was wondering about qualitiy of the clinical rotaions. Any information would be greatly appreciated. thnx!!


there are usually 3 or 4 tiers for foreign schools

tier I

Australia, israel, ireland-all domicile schools but don't cater to the usmle and can be more expensive than carib schools
UWI-school in jamaica that is a 'real' med school meaning they don't exist and survive only on US med students. if you didn't get into an ivy league US school you will not get in there

tier II

a.SGU, Ross, AUC-have staffords, more than 15,000 practicing docs, have all the state approvals that can be had including california. been around for almost 30 years etc etc
b. Saba-doesn't have staffords but has california making it a very good option

tier II from here on it gets shadier knowing which tier to place the schools into

a.SMU, AUA, MUA Nevis they are newer but have shown good progress and are constantly placing grads in residency and more importantly have shown to be relatively stable

b.Spartan-has been around a LONG time, places grads in residency hasd good stability but down side is that administration has pretty much kept the school status quo from the 80's they lost staffords and did not get them back

tier III

St James is probably the only one that has shown progress

tier IV

all the rest-if you get to this point, looking at yor app and strenghting it to apply to another school unless you have absolutely no other option

note-the above is only my own make up based on school stability, loan options, particng grads, state approvals etc you have to look up your own criteria. this list also includes experience over the last few years with caribbean medical "education" basically:

-what the schools tells you means nothing
-whatever papers the government of that island issue mean nothing
-whatever plans for expansion are set for the future mean less than
nothing
-a schools status as non profit means that non of the profit will be seen anywhere else other than bonus checks for the board of trustees and whatever island officials sold them the charter
-there is NO shortcut, no internet courses no advance credit etc worth the risk of being banned from practice in 99% of the US

the only things that you can count on semi objectivily are

-how long the school has been around
-are the facilities adequate (this shows re-investment of the tuition in something other than board member dividends)
-how many actual residents that they have graduated are in private practice. ask them then verify the info since in most states you can look for practicing docs by name, school, etc all our info is prublic
-how many of their students make it through the program

i am sure there are more thinsg but all this should get you started

Asclepios
08-13-2007, 07:52 PM
I'm sorry - I never said my school was the best - I like your rankings - How can a school build and get new students if they aren't given a chance - and that is one that the individual has to make. There are many schools that started in the same place as us - I am sure that there was lots of speculation around AUC when it first began - Ross started in a hotel room at Castaways hotel and now look at it. You are ridiculous to think that the Government doesn't have anything to do with the success of a medical school - one of our students went to St. Chris and the Government of England wasn't behind them and look what happened - if your Government wasn't behind your school it wouldn't exist - you wouldn't have IMED or any states.
Obviously, you choose to go to a school for numerous reasons and I would recommend anyone thinking of coming to our school to come and visit it and not listen to anyone who has never been here and only knows what he/she has heard from rumors.
Our campus has changed dramatically through the 4 semesters I have been here - we now use cadavers, we have a new dean (used to be the dean at SABA) - we have a new campus in a renovated health center in the middle of the capital city of Roseau - we go to the hospital here in semester 5 - we are breaking ground on a new campus this fall - we have teachers that we have recruited from American universities - students rotating with Ross, AUC, SGU students. As I have said before - our school is not perfect and I actually said far from it - but we are IMED listed, we can practice in approx 35 states and all of Canada (more states coming as they visit our school - New York is visiting soon), we are working on getting the shelf exams from the NMBE. Not perfect but definite progress.
We do not hold and will not hold internet courses at our school as it violates most states rules for being licensed.

My best suggestion would be to go to fly down and do some island hopping if that is feasable (pretty cheap island to island) and look at the different campuses, meet the administration and then decide. We have alot of students transfering into our rotations because the cost is so much less but you can rotate at some of the same hospitals as some of the big schools like ROSS and SGU.
I think it is great that people on this site want to educate you from making a mistake - and I think that is very noble but unfortunately people just bash certain schools without ever seeing them or talking to their students - every new school has to start somewhere.

pratik
08-20-2007, 10:15 PM
kermun which school have u applied for Aruba or Dominica??? i have been in this aruba campus for the past 20 months now and the school has gone through a lot of changes..ups n downs...its no SCAM!!!!education here is gr8 for the price you are paying.professors are gr8. they teach you what you need to know and ya you have to learn yourself which is gud because then you know how much of the material taught in class has been useful.

Magen-MD
08-21-2007, 02:02 AM
The following concepts:History/Track record/Quality do not mean the same thing at all and should not be confused. Although mashing them up into one attractive mistry goosh is tempting. It is equally misleading to those that read such gooshes of confusion. Unfortunately, the so called classifications of Caribbean University is nothing but individuals' opinions that if taken for granted or as matter of fact, the opinions may become reality "as of propanda officer of Aldof Hitler" who said, "A lie frequently repeated gains ground". This forum is not a place for misleading campaigns. It is meant to be a home of well investigated intellectual information sharing. Not political propaganda or Institutional propaganda.

For instance, Dominica was a home for 30 years of only one medical school, Ross University. Which, historically speaking, had less that 7 students in the first year of its establishment. 30 yrs later, another university is born in Dominica, creating a different history for itself, in this case historically speaking too, ASUSM in born. And has had more than 110 students within the first 9 months of its establishment. And try to marry the two....The point is both old and new universities have ad their beginings. And if the old universities have reached this far and training thousands of MDs, all it means is that they have been there longer. Period. Nothing else. And starting with a few students and as few as 5 students. Gradually 30 years later, graduating more then 5,000 physicians. What more with a university that has hundreds of students to begin with, how many will they have trained in 30 years from now or even within 10 years from now? If those of them, historically speaking which originate from inauspicious background can reach such high numbers what more with those that have an even impressive beginnings? Isn't it ironical to call those with better beginnings just because they are NEW, as 'scams'. All this is history/track records in making and quality is another.

Then there is quality: All students in medical schools are attracted to quality teaching and respectable standards of education. Similarly, universities that admit them look for quality students who are well rounded and serious. Because the success of these students becomes the success of the university in the long run. Therefore to doubt standards and quality of other medical schools as a way of casting doubt on them as a means of competing with those that are new but with better beginnings, is absolutely futile and a act of desperation. This same logic by extension, applies across the board.

My advice to all new applicants is:

Take hid of scare tactics and fear mongers, if at all there is such a thing as fear monger. If you are smart enough to apply to med. school, you are smart enough to identify objective and well investigated information sharing. Don't buy into restrictive scare tactics.

jameslynton
08-21-2007, 08:24 AM
Scare tactics - I think not - they have no grads - no record. This school is a high risk.

AUCMD2006
08-21-2007, 12:45 PM
1)St Chris Govt suport- ST chirs was never revognized as a med school by the UK, they were allways recognized as a business and the only license they had for any presence on brittish soil was a business license. the reason they got in troublke was because they were using a charter from a country in africa, and holding classes out of their charter in england. that is a totally different issue.

2)govt sponsorship of anything in the third world, and as someone from there i know, all depends on who you pay and keep on the payroll. st marteen govt could care less about the school or its students but as long as they get money from car rentals, building leases etc they will support the school...you should have seen the uproar and threats when the school announced it would be 'self contained' meaning make its own water and power the later on when it built its own dorms..

3)who gives a flying fudgecycle stick where and how ross, sgu, and auc started? that was 30 years ago. very different climate for IMGs back then because no one checked anything in the states...therte were chrios and dentists that got medical degrees in the mail from russian universities in the late 80's that where practicing medicine

we have the internet and all sorts fo information now that make it a very different time to attend a new med school. if i was looking for med schools back in 1978 auc, ross, nor sgu would have been on my choice list because they were unproven. i often wonder if these 3 made it how many more went under? the ones we know of are st luke, medical college of london, kigezi, ocean university, st chris 1998 version, possibly current St chris, mua belize, that school in mexico, one in panama and those are just in the last 4 years.... and if you read through some of their fora you will see a pattern to some of your messgaes...

-campus will be built
-we had a ground breaking yesterday for our 100,000 acre underwater campus
-amazing faculty coming in
-2000 students enrolled next semester
-the school has grown
-they plan on (fill in the blank( next semester)
-NY is coming soon
-NY is coming next semester
-they started the application for california
-we have excellent rotations in ivy league hospitals
-fill in whatever empty promise you want

bottom line : DO NOT GO TO A SCHOOL BASED ON WHAT IS PLANNED! go to a school expecting that what you have when you get there is all that will be there in 4 years. again i am not bashing by any means, you should go to the best school you can, for me it wasn't the US because i didn't get in and i ended up in the caribbean and i tried my besat to make my criteria list as subjective as possible from the begining i mean things like lenght of operation, how many grads and loan options are not very subjective are they?

i am jusat tired of the same crap that is told over and over and over:

-you are "now" working with cadavers...big deal, so what and a big yawn, this should have been available form semester 1 if the school had been planned out and strongly financially backed from semester 1
-campus groundbreaking again a big congrats for something that should be there from semester 1

ok enough venting, yes all schools have to start somewhere my only point is and will always be: why be a guinea pig with your 200k when you don't have to? i mean the admission stanards at ross and auc aren't exactly out of reach, then smu, aua pretty much let anyone in so there are plenty of options....even at these 'better options' people have been pulled from residency and been denied licensure in some states so why oh why oh why risk things if you have options


on the other hand if all you have are the bottom new new schools as options, then go for it knowing all the risks. a school does not determine what kind of doctor you will be just where you will be so if the option is a new school or the fotomart then i say go for it







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