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Thread: O administration may shut down 5 percent of for-profit programs under new rules!

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    O administration may shut down 5 percent of for-profit programs under new rules!

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    I wonder what affect this will have on US offshore MD schools? It funny the amount of changes quickly taking place lately finanical aid, and no more pre matches. Makes me wonder what surprise is next? Any thoughts on this?


    The Department of Education released its significantly softened new "gainful employment" rule for for-profit colleges yesterday, which threatens to end career programs that saddle students with insurmountable debt and slim career prospects.
    Career programs offered by schools such as the University of Phoenix--the nation's largest for-profit school--will no longer be eligible for federal student aid if they do not hit certain benchmarks indicating they are not leveraging students into unsustainable debt. The career programs must prove that at least 35 percent of their former students are repaying their loans; that the annual loan payment of the average graduate is less than 30 percent of his or her discretionary income; or that the graduate's annual loan payment is not more than 12 percent of his or her total salary. If the programs fail to meet these benchmarks three years out of four, they would no longer be qualify for federal grants. Enforcement of the new rules won't begin until 2015.
    About 5 percent of for-profit programs will eventually be closed down under the new rule, according to Department of Education estimates, and 18 percent will fail at some point but then improve before facing sanctions. Among nonprofit private and public career programs, which outnumber for-profit career programs, only 2 percent are expected to lose federal eligibility for student aid.
    The Education Department's earlier version of the rule was tougher, requiring the schools to meet the standards every year and using past debt repayment data to determine whether to close a program or not. The for-profit industry pushed back aggressively against the department's proposed "gainful employment" rule and its other regulations, which prevent colleges from misrepresenting their graduate employment rates and from paying admissions officers based on how many new students they sign up. The industry has spent millions lobbying Congress to try to defund the new regulations, and is also challenging them in court.

    Education Secretary Arne Duncan said on a call with reporters that the booming for-profit industry needs to be regulated because it's largely financed by taxpayer money through federal education grants. Government reports found that some for-profit colleges aggressively target low-income and even homeless people, signing them up for federal student aid and in some cases encouraging them to lie on their application forms to qualify for more federal money. Taxpayer-funded federal education grants make up as much as 90 percent of total revenue at some for-profit schools, and much of that public money goes back into the schools' advertising campaigns.
    In announcing the new rule, Secretary Duncan was stressed that it only targets some "bad actors" in the industry, and that many higher-performing career programs will not be affected. He said he hopes schools will clean their own house, and that he thinks "very few programs will actually be closed."
    The for-profit industry has boomed over the past 10 years. The number of bachelors degrees given out by for-profit colleges skyrocketed by 418 percent since 2000, according to data from the National Center for Education Statistics. While for-profit students only account for about 12 percent of all college students, they take up a quarter of all federal grants and represent 43 percent of all defaults, according to data from the Department of Education. Their four-year programs cost significantly more than public institutions but have a much lower six-year graduation rate of only 22 percent.
    Long-time opponents of the for-profit industry say they're disappointed the final rule was made more flexible.
    "More needs to be done to prevent the waste of taxpayer dollars and protect students, including veterans, from programs that swindle them rather than prepare them to succeed in the workforce." said Pauline Abernathy, the vice president of the nonprofit Institute for College Access and Success. She said in a statement that the final rule is "substantially weaker" than the draft version.
    But the O administration says the new rule will encourage the schools to improve to ensure that they don't lose potential students.
    "Obviously schools are going to compete on reputations," said National Economic Council Director Gene Sperling on a conference call. "While it's three strikes over four years or you're out, we think schools will have a very strong incentive not to face a single strike because of the harm that would invoke. We provide a very strong incentive for schools to raise the quality of their programs so they don't get the warning strikes."
    Higher education lobbyist Terry Hartle, who represents mostly nonprofit schools, tells The Lookout he thinks even though the rule is softened, many in the for-profit industry do not believe the department has the authority to regulate them and will challenge the rule in court.
    "This is simply an issue that will now head to the other two branches of government," he said. He added that he doubts the department really knows that the new rule will only close 5 percent of the for-profit programs. "Nobody really knows whether this affects 1/10th of the gainful employment programs or 20 percent of the gainful employment programs," he said.
    The Association of Private Sector Colleges and Universities said in a statement the group is concerned that the department "is still using the same ill-advised metric approach to this matter and is clearly outside of its statutory authority."

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    hmmmm lets see here! "many higher-performing career programs will not be affected"

    well maybe off shore medical schools are not that important even though there is a shortage of general practitioners.

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    Quote Originally Posted by epi View Post
    I wonder what affect this will have on US offshore MD schools? It funny the amount of changes quickly taking place lately finanical aid, and no more pre matches. Makes me wonder what surprise is next? Any thoughts on this?
    You're ignorant of this issue.
    Last edited by GQ_Doc; 06-03-2011 at 11:36 PM.
    siheg and MD_DREAMER like this.

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    Ouch! GQ_Doc you sound like my mom lol! I didnt mean to sound negative or to worry a 4th semester student about his future career path. I was trying to open a conversation about all these crazy changes lately and the affect of them. But I can see how this post might ruffle some feathers the wrong way and I apoligize if that is the case. It was not my intention at all. After rereading the article it sounds like it is more about the fly by night schools in the states and probably will have no repercussions on any Caribbean Medical schools.Lastly well we aren't all geniuses like you; rolling eyes!

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    Quote Originally Posted by epi View Post
    New poster here not AUC accepted yet. But curious how does financial aid work when you do clinicals. I know they have a cost of attendance at SXM but does that same grand total amoount transfer when you leave to do clinicals? Confused because the cost of living and housing is different everywhere. So do you get the same financial aid amount while doing clinicals in New York as you would get if doing them in Michigan? Is it all just based off of what the maximum you are eligible to recieve on SXM? wondering how it works in clinical years 3 and 4? thanks for imputs!

    Quote Originally Posted by epi View Post
    Ouch! GQ_Doc you sound like my mom lol! I didnt mean to sound negative or to worry a 4th semester student about his future career path. I was trying to open a conversation about all these crazy changes lately and the affect of them. But I can see how this post might ruffle some feathers the wrong way and I apoligize if that is the case. It was not my intention at all. After rereading the article it sounds like it is more about the fly by night schools in the states and probably will have no repercussions on any Caribbean Medical schools.Lastly well we aren't all geniuses like you; rolling eyes!
    How is it you seem to "know" what semester GQ_Doc is if you haven't been admitted to AUC just yet?

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    Oh come on Eileen, I dont know him I am a new member here and surprised how unfriendly everyone appears to be. Maybe its the island fever thing kicking in or something. I just had a lucky guess as to what semester he is in. Anyway all of this is off topic for some reason. I guess nobody is interested in my post at all sadly! If I could delete it I would I did not intend to stir up the barn here LOL!

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    Quote Originally Posted by epi View Post
    I wonder what affect this will have on US offshore MD schools? It funny the amount of changes quickly taking place lately finanical aid, and no more pre matches. Makes me wonder what surprise is next? Any thoughts on this?


    The Department of Education released its significantly softened new "gainful employment" rule for for-profit colleges yesterday, which threatens to end career programs that saddle students with insurmountable debt and slim career prospects.
    "
    I don't think AUC qualifies under that description. People from here become physicians and their career prospects are anything but slim.
    MD_DREAMER likes this.
    American University of the Caribbean School of Medicine Graduate

    Basic Sciences [X] Step 1 [X] Step 2 CS [X] Step 2 CK [X] Cores [X] Electives [X] Match [X] M.D. Diploma [X] Step 3 [X] IM Residency [X] Medical license [X] Internal medicine boards ABIM [X] Board certified practicing Hospitalist [Hidden Content ]

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    epi confirmed for troll

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    keep dreaming MD_dreamer but if dont start studying, instead of wasting time plus making acccusations on here that are wrong you will end up like most in NM land of enchantment working at a Lota burger the rest of your life in ABQ!

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    Education Secretary Arne Duncan said on a call with reporters that the booming for-profit industry needs to be regulated because it's largely financed by taxpayer money through federal education grants. Government reports found that some for-profit colleges aggressively target low-income and even homeless people, signing them up for federal student aid and in some cases encouraging them to lie on their application forms to qualify for more federal money. Taxpayer-funded federal education grants make up as much as 90 percent of total revenue at some for-profit schools, and much of that public money goes back into the schools' advertising campaigns.
    The Education Secretary does have a point about the massive waste of taxpayer dollars going towards education. There needs to be stricter accountability for students using Federal Funding only for education and necessary living expenses.

    This being said, I don't think it is only the "for-profit" institutions that need to be audited. I saw plenty of waste at my public university. You'll notice that the article places the bulk of the blame on the institutions, and none on the individuals who are actually making the decision to take out these funds. Is it fair to overlook personal irresponsibility in these matters?

    When listening to the words of Secretary D, you get the picture of evil, money-hungry robber-barons filling their classrooms full of meth addicts and the homeless (because these people, according to the DOE Secretary, obviously are unfit to educate) simply to get their grubby paws on some funding. When you contrast this private-sector evil with the pure-hearted, altruistic, almost-christlike nature of everyone who is called to teach at a public university, it is no wonder that this article would spur you to action IMMEDIATELY!!

    The fact that the O administration is singling out private schools alone (without mentioning the public schools & personal responsibility of the student) leads me to believe that this is just another attempt to expand the role of government control into the private sector. They are taking a legitimate concern & tackling it in the wrong way, and for the wrong reasons.
    Last edited by Slaol; 06-09-2011 at 05:36 AM.
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