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  1. #1
    losackmd is offline Member
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    been INFRACTED/offended and need advice!

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    honored that the forum member i was just kidding with actually PM'd me and asked me not to quit. That is IMHO someone with integrity grace maturity and understanding. Sometimes a joke is a joke is a joke.
    There is a difference between defaming and flaming and poking fun.
    If who ever infracted me is really serious about it, ill take this as my final infraction and go on my way. Really i am highly offended! I have tried to help with advice and my experience. I graduated UCE in 1980. I believe i am the oldest lets say Veteran of this forum and have from time to time lets say offered up helpful things to say. I dont have to do this. I have lets say more important things to do. I dont see other old timers here.
    If this person deems i deserve this insulting rediculous infraction let him live life by the book. A great physician does not! SO MUCH Of being a good doc is having a good heart spirit and humanness. WHo ever you are you i think owe me an apology, some thanks and maybe you shouldnt be in your position. i wonder how others think. What a disgrace!

  2. #2
    ERNEST714's Avatar
    ERNEST714 is offline School Official
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    Glenn........agree with you in every aspect. It is said...if you want to know the real character of a person give him power....the power to pick and choose an infraction especially hiding behind the cloak of anonymity.
    Trying to help others profit from your/our experience and to be subjected to inane insults is a bit much. If I am being insulted I would at least like to know your credentials to do so.
    My personal opinion is the infraction should be removed and an apology issued.
    ERNEST C. HOLBROOK, M.D. FACS

  3. #3
    Doc's Avatar
    Doc
    Doc is offline Administrator 8260 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by losackmd
    been INFRACTED/offended and need advice!
    I had given you advice, but you obviously chose not to take it.

    If what you say is true, where your "poking fun" of another user was merely a non-malicious joke and that user now understands this and is not offended by your comments, then a simple explanation of this to the moderator who issued the infraction would probably rectify the issue.

    But just so it's clear, the user you targeted as "poking fun" did NOT originally see it as being in good fun judging by his/her reply at the time. So if the user and moderator both read it in a different way than you're claiming were your intentions, maybe it wasn't written very clearly and could have been easily misunderstood (which can often be the case in online discussions since intonation, expressions, etc, are often lacking as compared to verbal discussions).

    That being the case, it appears to be nothing more than a simple misunderstanding. Again, explaining this politely to the moderator in question rather than demanding an apology from him/her for doing his/her job "by the book", might be a better route to take.

    At any rate, the proper action at this point is for you to appeal the infraction via the proper channels. For the record, posting it up on the forum is NOT one of those channels.

    So there's my advice, but it's up to you whether or not you'd like to follow it.

    p.s. ERNEST, I understand your desire to provide support for this user. However, you don't have all the facts of the story. Suggesting a reversal without considering the facts is not prudent.
    Doc
    Site Administrator

  4. #4
    ERNEST714's Avatar
    ERNEST714 is offline School Official
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    Reply

    My personal opinion

    I did not make claim to have investigated these allegations.....I merely offered a PERSONAL OPINION.

    NOT A JUDGEMENT
    ERNEST C. HOLBROOK, M.D. FACS

  5. #5
    losackmd is offline Member
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    ya know there is something called RESPECT for people who come here to HELP NOT TO learn and get their questions answered. Maybe im from the old school.
    Maybe im think headed. Maybe a bit childish or even wrong, a bit arrogant, perhaps i feel a bit entitled. I have not deserved this INFRACTION. I am probably the only veteran from 1976, who comes here to offer opinions and help. I am not at this point in time very happy with the channels I have to go thru to pease whomever to undo what should not have been done in the first place. Maybe i am not very pleased with the way you address this misunderstanding
    and my concerns DOC site administrator. I thought i was helpful here someone who offered useful information on my own time. Unpaid and with very little thanks. You or your
    authoriteis should treat physicians who have things to teach with more respect. They are the ones who will teach you to become professionals. Ill take my 30 years experience and go elsewhere for a while, maybe till i cool down. Advice? youre giving me Advice?
    if this is how you handle things, good luck in your future career, and i hope all your patients do exactly as you say all the time and if not maybe you should give them an infraction. I dont have the time to ask for forgiveness when i am here helping others.
    btw patients and people and colleagues and your elders and teachers have feelings. We are not machines! I resent your tone and your advice!

  6. #6
    ERNEST714's Avatar
    ERNEST714 is offline School Official
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    Addendum to previous post.

    I would like to ask a question of "DOC Administrator" and that is:
    With what credentials/authority do you speak?
    I mean anyone can use a "name" or pseudonym on the internet. Are you a real doctor? Specialty training?
    I can not help but wonder....everyone who is inclined or interested can look up my c.v. on the Unibe Website (as many have). But we know nothing of you....even in your limited posted profile.
    The combined experience of Losack and myself amounts to 75 years. We have been around the proverbial block and share our experience and advice freely.
    Again, I ask you....what are your credentials?

    ERNEST C. HOLBROOK, M.D. FACS
    FACS= FELLOW, AMERICAN COLLEGE OF SURGEONS
    ERNEST C. HOLBROOK, M.D. FACS

  7. #7
    Moderator is offline Moderator 527 points
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    You mean like did he get moderator credentialing from the Internet Administration School?

    Ernest, think of it this way: If a student received disciplinary action by your school and wanted to appeal, would recommend that they demand an apology? Perhaps you would prefer that they seek redress through the proper channels? If not, its good to for students to know that if they have a problem with a grade or decision at UNIBE they merely have to publicly demand an apology.

  8. #8
    ERNEST714's Avatar
    ERNEST714 is offline School Official
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    Reply to Mr. Moderator

    Quote Originally Posted by Moderator View Post
    You mean like did he get moderator credentialing from the Internet Administration School?

    Ernest, think of it this way: If a student received disciplinary action by your school and wanted to appeal, would recommend that they demand an apology? Perhaps you would prefer that they seek redress through the proper channels? If not, its good to for students to know that if they have a problem with a grade or decision at UNIBE they merely have to publicly demand an apology.
    MR. MODERATOR;916427
    You know very well what I mean....is DOC ADMINISTRATOR a physician?
    You don't need to play word games.

    And by the way, since I don't know you, you may refer to me as DR. Ernest since I earned the right to the title a long time ago!

    In answer to your question.....which seems a bit confusing. If a student has received disciplinary action and wishes an appeal....of course they go thru the proper channels AND IF THEY ARE VINDICATED IN THE PROCESS, I WOULD NOT ONLY EXPECT BUT DEMAND AN APOLOGY FROM THE PERSON OR PERSONS WHO DID THE WRONG.

    In addition, if it happens to be a disciplinary action, everyone knows who is on the Discipline Committee....it is not like the church confessional....you know who you are addressing. Not so with Valuemd, where one hides behind prefunctory titles like Administrator, Moderator, etc.

    I saw the infraction citation for LosackMD and it did not have a signature of an identifiable person. In my country, the accused has a right to know his accuser. I would also take my complaints public rather than talk to an unknown person or persons.

    I am neither afraid nor embarrassed to show my name and credentials on this board; why should you and the rest be so reluctant? I think the readers have a right to know from whence cometh the advice and comments from such an august body as the Moderators and Administrators. I also believe the readers have a right to be anonymous in asking questions.

    Where I grew up......the person in the wrong offered a public apology regardless of their rank or station in life (that they might presume to have), this was simply considered good manners.

    And for your information....I have apologized to students when I thought or it was demonstrated, I was in the wrong.....I have also bodily thrown a student out of my class who threatened me and demanded and received an apology from him.
    being a physician or a professor or a Dean does not excuse one from being polite and having good manners and acknowledging when one is in error
    Last edited by ERNEST714; 09-12-2008 at 10:59 PM. Reason: adding infformation
    ERNEST C. HOLBROOK, M.D. FACS

  9. #9
    losackmd is offline Member
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    MODERATOR
    how dare YOU insinuate that i am a student! how dare you use this metaphor?

    you know you dont deserve to have physicians like me here giving their time for free and without reservation to help others.

    i speak totally for myself here when i say you are rude disrespectful and ungrateful!

  10. #10
    desi@UNIBE's Avatar
    desi@UNIBE is offline Junior Member 510 points
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    I've read though this whole thread completely and would like to express what i feel....

    Dr Losack and Dr Holbrook,
    I personally truly appreciate all your inputs, advices, suggestions and most importantly, your precious time to all newbie aspirants like me who have big dreams to pursue Medicine and get subsequent certification in US to practice Medicine. I'm sure there are many such people like me here in these forums who value what you share from your life experiences. Please continue to extend your support and valuable advices through your posts....

    with many thanks, desi@UNIBE
    Last edited by desi@UNIBE; 09-13-2008 at 05:25 PM.

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