Licensure, clinicals, residency - Page 5

VCJ · #41 (**permalink**) 04-19-2005, 08:12 AM

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Originally Posted by VCJ

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Almost all states allow IMG's to be licensed (permenent, full license) after their PGY-III year. Many, if not most, will allow permenent licensure after PGY-II year. In the case of TN, IMG"s are eligible after 3 years. Residency programs want their residents to be fully licensed ASAP for many reasons -- signing their own script is just the beginning. A fully licensed resident also means revenue for the hospital because the hospital can bill for his or her services.

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surgery is 5 years, but as img's we are eligible for licensure typically in 3 years, although some states allow it after 2 of postgrad. the reason most residents need the license as soon as possible is that it allows them to sign scripts, etc...without cosigs from attendings. makes life a lot easier for everyone to have a full license as soon as possible, even if you are still a resident.

Neil

So that does mean we can wait till 2006, when our grads from the chartered college will be in PGY-3 next yr? help? so where is the discrepency?

Oh, and I also feel that transfer did have a problem, but no one has yet come out and claimed it to be St. Chris... I mean if I had a problem due to the college, I would be the first one contacting sites like this and the admin to express it. I think most will agree with this reasoning...

P, I didnt explain myself well
i was talking about this... because as I see it this makes sense because of the charter being landed in 2000 and counting the years down, but you and company persist in saying we have license problems with grads already when there isnt any evidence... in your own words show us some concrete evidence? As for me, right now, waiting till next yr seems normal because that is when our grads will be in PGY-2/3...

And no one is gonna sit on their ... and not say anything if they get licensure problems after goin thru this mych and owing $140000 or more doin it... if it had already been a yr for some students there would have been a major outcry... Take it on urself, would you not have spoken out in public already, when others (like urself)are supposedly claiming the licensure problems on ur behalf?

AUCMD2006 · #42 (**permalink**) 04-19-2005, 11:05 AM

the charter was 2000, the college started taking studends in 1998 that is where the problem is. they knowingly took students as an unchartered school and now all those are out on their own. what happened to the massive legal fund Sc had set aside for licensure issues?

FLK · #43 (**permalink**) 04-19-2005, 02:29 PM

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Originally Posted by stchrisrep

Well, things just don't slip through the cracks.

really?

http://www.ama-assn.org/amednews/200...3/prsa0823.htm

bts4202 · #44 (**permalink**) 04-20-2005, 09:24 AM

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Originally Posted by FLK

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Originally Posted by stchrisrep

Well, things just don't slip through the cracks.

really?

http://www.ama-assn.org/amednews/200...3/prsa0823.htm

Major difference: the phoney doctors do not have permenent licenses granted to them by the state.

FLK · #45 (**permalink**) 04-20-2005, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bts4202

Quote:

Originally Posted by FLK

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Originally Posted by stchrisrep

Well, things just don't slip through the cracks.

really?

http://www.ama-assn.org/amednews/200...3/prsa0823.htm

Major difference: the phoney doctors do not have permenent licenses granted to them by the state.

well if the fakes can get a job, there might be hope for you guys yet

Picard · #46 (**permalink**) 04-20-2005, 04:15 PM

VCJ,
Here's the issue. There are SC graduates running around out there who are 4 or 5 years after graduation, regardless of transfer status, which I think is not the main issue of their licensing problems.
Transfer students in 1998 must have graduated with the school charter because they couldn't have gotten their ECFMG cert's. So, I don't see a big difference between 1998 transfers and 2000 transfers.
Also, it's safe to say that these early transfer students came from schools that are more established than SC. So, the "weaker" of their two schools was/is SC and any licensing problems is likely to have arise from their SC attendence rather than their previous school.
Some would argue that SC has improved since early 2000's, since their move to Luton. That may be true cosmatically (nicer buildings, more faculties... etc). But in the larger picture of licensure, the school looks no different now than in 2000 -- still no external approval from any US jurisdiction that evaluates offshore schools, still operates in a country where they are not chartered... So no, I don't buy the argument that SC is somehow "different" now than 2000. As far as licensing boards are concerned, SC is the same now as before.... until SC gets external approval or moves back to Senegal.
The simple fact is, there are SC grads out there who should have been licensed 1-3 years ago. And I'm sure SC admins know about what's happening, and are just not telling you. When graduates have licensing problems, the first place they go to is back to their school... so your admin knows what's happening with people like Max. If you as SC students don't know, I would be worried why the school is not being honest and forthcoming.

P

bts4202 · #47 (**permalink**) 04-20-2005, 05:40 PM

read what i said on the other thread. No one has been denied a permenent license in any state in the US that I know of.

stchrisrep · #48 (**permalink**) 04-20-2005, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Picard

As for Kizegi's licensed grads -- show us a link... ...People kept talking about Kizegi grad's license in NJ... no one has shown us a link
P

Read the archives and search yourself.

http://www.fsmb.org/members.htm

http://www.valuemd.com/medicine-1196...hlight=#119642

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Dear *******,

I encourage you to email and speak to our students and graduates, http://www.kigezi.edu/student_performance.html to ask them questions about their experiences.

Our licensed graduates are Dr. ***** ****** in New Jersey and Dr. ******** ******* in Oregon. You are welcome to do a search on the AMA site to find out more about them. We currently have other students who are in the licensure process in other states as well.

The students who choose our programme do so because we offer an international experience that differs from other foriegn medical schools. Our students are required to go to Uganda to learn tropical medicine and our students have been around the globe for both preceptorships and rotations, http://www.kigezi.edu/student_performance.html shows the students' various international experiences. I definitely encourage you to do research into every programme for which you are applying and be sure that you choose a school that best suits your particular needs.

Kind regards,
******* **********
Head of Admissions
_________________
Kigezi International School of Medicine
admissions@kigezi.edu
www.kigezi.edu

VCJ · #49 (**permalink**) 04-21-2005, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Picard

VCJ,
Here's the issue. There are SC graduates running around out there who are 4 or 5 years after graduation, regardless of transfer status, which I think is not the main issue of their licensing problems.
Transfer students in 1998 must have graduated with the school charter because they couldn't have gotten their ECFMG cert's. So, I don't see a big difference between 1998 transfers and 2000 transfers.

well, show me the evidence of grads from '98, '00 or from '01... the earliest I have heard of a grad. ceremony was in 2002, but even those must have had a problem because of our charter starting in 2000.

Quote:

Some would argue that SC has improved since early 2000's, since their move to Luton. That may be true cosmatically (nicer buildings, more faculties... etc). But in the larger picture of licensure, the school looks no different now than in 2000 -- still no external approval from any US jurisdiction that evaluates offshore schools, still operates in a country where they are not chartered...

This is not the Caribbean islands (money doesnt triple, if improvements are made u spend double the money)... and we are in process of getting approval with some states and we have many students in many well known hospitals and university programs in US where they can even do cores, unlike many caribbean colleges.

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So no, I don't buy the argument that SC is somehow "different" now than 2000.

No one cares if u buy it... u are in Calif. right?

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The simple fact is, there are SC grads out there who should have been licensed 1-3 years ago.

its ur delusion... we explained this using ur own words on this thread or the other one active right now.

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And I'm sure SC admins know about what's happening, and are just not telling you. When graduates have licensing problems, the first place they go to is back to their school...
P

Alright Picard, if u had been in their situation and had no chance of getting licensured right now as u claim, would u not do the sensible thing and warn future prospects and go to this website or some other like this one (which r well known to IMGs)... Most would because they owe c@#$loads of money and would feel it to be a duty to warn others...Good example is kigezi forum just 3 mths after something went wrong... i recommend u check it out... (not getting licensed is up there with the college closing down, so people would have come out by now)

As on a separate point, I think u need to get more work, Picard, because as it seems now from the amt. of time u waste, either the nurses and residents hate u because u dont do any work or u dont have a enough pts.
I have 3 attendings in my direct family and they dont have time like u do and neither does any other attending I know. Maybe it was the board score!

Picard · #50 (**permalink**) 04-21-2005, 10:27 PM

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Our licensed graduates are Dr. Ahmed Shehata in New Jersey and Dr. Deborah Wolfson in Oregon. You are welcome to do a search on the AMA site to find out more about them. We currently have other students who are in the licensure process in other states as well.

Funny how Dr. Shehata's "initial license date is listed as 1975, yet graduated from Kizegi in 1998? Could it be that Dr. Shehata actually graduated from another medical school before? And was licensed under the previous medical school before going to Kizegi?

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read what i said on the other thread. No one has been denied a permenent license in any state in the US that I know of.

So, BTS, are you a paid representative of SC? Are you speaking as a SC school authority/official now? Are you finally admitting to your role here? If not, then what in the world does it matter what you "know of"? If you are simply a student at SC with no special connections/powers/privileges/inside information (basically a puppet of SC admin), then how do you know any more than any other SC students about your graduates since SC has a practice of keeping information from students? So, are you saying you know what happened to Max's TN, FL licensing application which supposedly was initiated before 6/2004?

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well, show me the evidence of grads from '98, '00 or from '01... the earliest I have heard of a grad. ceremony was in 2002, but even those must have had a problem because of our charter starting in 2000.

http://gsm.utmck.edu/surgery/current_residents.cfm
Scroll down to last name beginning with "O"
He is a PGY-4 resident who took a year off to do "research" (Meaning he would have been a PGY-5 resident 2 months away from finishing surgery residency if he hadn't taken a year off doing "research". This puts him 5 years post-graduate. This puts his graduation date at 2000 from SC, which means he transferred into SC in 1998. He must have graduated after SC obtained a charter ,otherwise he wouldn't have gotten his ECFMG cert. Since TN allows IMG licensure after PGY-3 year, he should have been eligible in 2003. He talked about applying for licensure in June 2004. It doesn't take this long. Many surgery programs will not let you do a Chief Resident year (required for graduation from surgery residency) without medical license. I wonder what happened to Max?

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This is not the Caribbean islands (money doesnt triple, if improvements are made u spend double the money)... and we are in process of getting approval with some states and we have many students in many well known hospitals and university programs in US where they can even do cores, unlike many caribbean colleges.

Key point here is SC still has NO external approval, SC charter is still in Senegal -- the two key issues in licensure. So, trying to say SC is different from 2000 to 2005 is irrelevant. In the eyes of licensing boards, SC is no different in 2005 compared with 2000. So, your Caribbean comparison is moot. Established schools from anywhere do not face these issues and have thousands of licensed grads. They don't face these issues.

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No one cares if u buy it... u are in Calif. right?

You are right, who cares if I buy it or not. Problem with SC is, it appears licensing boards are not buying it either... no licensed grad proves this.

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Alright Picard, if u had been in their situation and had no chance of getting licensured right now as u claim, would u not do the sensible thing and warn future prospects and go to this website or some other like this one (which r well known to IMGs)... Most would because they owe c@#$loads of money and would feel it to be a duty to warn others...Good example is kigezi forum just 3 mths after something went wrong... i recommend u check it out... (not getting licensed is up there with the college closing down, so people would have come out by now)

Umm, let see, could it be because they still may need SC's help in the future trying to get licensed ANYWHERE? So they don't want to burn their bridges and bad mouth SC here? Heck, not too long ago, SC considered students who post negatively here a violation of their honor code...

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As on a separate point, I think u need to get more work, Picard, because as it seems now from the amt. of time u waste, either the nurses and residents hate u because u dont do any work or u dont have a enough pts.
I have 3 attendings in my direct family and they dont have time like u do and neither does any other attending I know. Maybe it was the board score!

Obviously you have no concept of what different specialties hours are. I'm sure your relatives all spend their entire day, 24/7 caring for patients. No time for personal activities, no time to eat lunch, work 120 hours a week... etc. You have no clue what you are talking about. I guess you think teratos, FLK, and Stephw, all of whom post alot more than I do, are not real doctors either. Ahhh, imaginations of a basic science medical student.

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