Anyone cheating should be expelled. G

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AUC Class of '99
Bored certified
I may be a jerk, but I'm a Jedi jerk like my father.

Some say I look like Buzz Lightyear....
(They're right)

DISCLAIMER: I have no financial stake in ValueMD, or any medical school.

I hate to break it to you, but the majority of cheaters don't get caught, and the ones that do rarely get a severe enough punishment to discourage them from repeating. And even if they get held up by roadblocks like a standardized exam, there are still too many CEOs and Congressmen who rose to the top unethically.
The New York Times did a study 2 years ago about the recent rise in cheating in colleges and found that it is fueled by the environment more than ever. They found that cheating was consistently ignored by professors and administration to boost graduation rates, sports eligability, and internship placements. You're bound to get more cheating in competitive fields such as business because people will do whatever it takes to get ahead. And that may even be an admirable quality in an environment that lacks ethics (just look at Gordon Gekko), but cheating has no place in the medical profession.

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Ross U. '10
Rutgers U. '05

here's my take on this whole grade situation... I'm currently a clinical student about the take step 2. When I was a student on the island, i didn't do extremely well, but somehow there were "those students" who seemed to not really study but for some reason kept getting some of the highest marks.. maybe they were really just really really smart, who knows... anyways, after miami and taking step 1, I really haven't seen or heard from most of those students and those who I have seen are mostly just beginning their clinical work ofcourse because they all had to take time off from taking step 1 due to "family/financial situations" (if you know what I mean)... so yes, in the end, the steps really do even out the playing field. In my opinion, grades on the island are useless and so are clinical grades. When I was on the island, there was so much cheating going on... and during clinicals, it's really so subjective that it really doesn't matter much either -- I mean, you get an A in many rotations if you attend everyday (that really doesn't grade you on your knowledge)... again, step 2 will even out the playing field in that sense.

SOOOOOoo bottom line, study for yourself and make sure you do well on step 1 and 2 because in the end, that really is all that matters. I know it's hard to look the other way when others are getting the easy route, but I can say with much confidence that those will be the students who you'll never see after step 1 or who you'll see beginning clinicals when you're about to finish like me.

cheaters never win, says Mom

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I'm like Internationally-known

Yeah, well there were folks cheating on many exams, they are the same ones that voice the loudest how great they are when they get a good grade. They did go in front of the honor council and they were only given a passing warning. Then the honor council felt that they should tell the class that they were NOW going to uphold the standard that they were empowered to do from the start. hmmm It may never equal out where the cheaters have to pay for their mistake, but it would be nice to see it really work where they do have to pay. I just hope it is not at the expense of a patient. I just know that I would not want them seeing my patients or standing in the OR with me.

Just my 2 cents

Just to say a thing about the Honor Council. I have served on it for the past two semester and am going to serve again in my third semester. It isn't that we are NOW going to uphold the standard of professionalism and integrity we have been. It may be also that you haven't heard anything because everything must be kept confidential. We cannot speak of specific cases so you have to wait for the rumors to start to hear anything. We have been VERY busy this semester spending hours and hours at a time with cases. Anyway I wanted to take this opportuntiy to say that unfortunately not many people are willing to come forward with testimony to those they have seen cheated. We have seen cases this semester and over a half a dozen students. Without getting into specifics, we are working hard to uphold professionalism and take cheating VERY seriously. It is not fun policing your own but that is what the Honor Council is here for - to keep the integrity of Ross and its students for now, our future rotations and beyond when we start our careers.

If you know of those that have been cheating it is in the handbook that you have the duty to report it. That is the hardest part for most. They see it talk about it but never come to us to let us handle it. Many are afraid of hurting someone's future career. Well, just think of it this way - would you want someone like that to be your co-worker? Cheating doesn't just end at exams, but gets worse to "Oh, I will just write my friend a perscriptions for this" and "Oh, I will just redo my chart here so I am not liable for my mistake". It will happen. Nip it in the bud now and come to your Honor Council reps, please. We are very open and take pride in the trust that the students have put in us.

Again, we are working hard for you, even if you don't hear much we are. Please come to us if there are issues. We all want a school to be proud of, right? Okay, back to Shelf studying - woopie!

Take care all!

Jess (soon to be S3 - that's nuts)

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During the time you served, how many students were expelled?

I've always wondered... where are you guys when you hear/see all these people cheating? I've never even encountered one person who spoke openly of things on the exam - whether it's to someone in person or over the phone. I have to admit, though, that I try to stay as far the hell away from the library as possible since for some UNGODLY reason, I always end up finding empty seats around those bastards who won't shut up.

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mi r med st00dunt

Wow-- It goes on in some level at MERP too! Nothing else much to say. Very interesting thread. There were rumors that.. forget it. Man-- gossiping is so much fun.

dont be a freakin' rata... someone cheating only hurts them, doenst hurt you.

lol man if you had that "i'll turn them in attitude" where i grew up, u'd suuuuurely learn that even though its super honest to do so, u wouldnt DARE.