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Thread: 2017 Residency Match

  1. #1
    Craigslist is offline Senior Member 6121 points
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    2017 Residency Match

    So excited and scared this year is my year.

    Carib IMG
    Step 1: 25x (1st)
    Step 2 ck: pending 14th
    Step 2 cs: Pass (1st)
    LOR: 1 FM PD, 1 Chair IM, 1 IM
    Visa: US Citizen

    Applying: IM
    Applications: 178 (about 150 IM, 28 FM)
    Naijaman24 and Paleo2015 like this.

  2. #11
    anno is offline Newbie 511 points
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    what kind of "job with the government"?

  3. #12
    thxleave is offline Elite Member 7200 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by anno View Post
    what kind of "job with the government"?
    i am responsible for underwriting claims through medicare, and auditing pharmacy benefit managers expense report

  4. #13
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    Naijaman24 is offline Junior Member 522 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by thxleave View Post
    I promise myself that I would reapply if I didn't get a job within 3 months of not matching that pays well enough to qualify for student loan forgiveness. I took out the maximum at SGU, so my student loans is around 450k. Compound interest with that in 10 years will be a MILLION DOLLARS.

    My job with the government makes it so after 10 years of paying 10% of my AGI I get everything forgiven tax FREE. So if I divide a million dollars by 10 years...... I am technically making extra 100k a year TAX FREE by working for the government. The 10% of AGI is based off of income after PRE-TAX investments, which includes my contribution to pension. So I am paying like around $150-$200 a month for 10 years only. Did I mention that if I retire at 62, I get around 80% of my salary TILL I die with free health insurance, plus long term care insurance?

    Boss already submitting in paper work in attempts to get me promoted. So did the math. My cushy analyst job beats being a FM doctor working 60-80 hours a week, while hospital administrators tell me how to do my job. 8AM-5PM everyday baby with 1 hour lunches.
    Congrats on the Govt. job.
    Resident Physician
    Ross University SOM 2016
    Step 1 - pass
    Step 2 - pass - CS & CK
    Step 3 - Pending

  5. #14
    Naijaman24's Avatar
    Naijaman24 is offline Junior Member 522 points
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    2016 Ross Grad

    Henry Ford Allegiance Health IM - Acknowledgement
    DeTar FM - Interview
    Abrazo FM - Interview
    devildoc8404 likes this.
    Resident Physician
    Ross University SOM 2016
    Step 1 - pass
    Step 2 - pass - CS & CK
    Step 3 - Pending

  6. #15
    thxleave is offline Elite Member 7200 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by Naijaman24 View Post
    Congrats on the Govt. job.
    thanks! originally i thought i needed them more then they me, but you be surprised on how often the government writes a blank check all because there is medical terminology on the expense report.

  7. #16
    CMD
    CMD is offline Junior Member 512 points
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    thxleave, it's great you've found what you like. But what about your reason to go to med school in the first place? now that you've decided to do something unrelated to patient care.
    Financially, you are in fact at a disadvantage although you opt for an easy way out of your loan. Your current salary is no where even close to half of what you're gonna earn as a physician as evidenced by your low monthly loan repayments.
    Although you work harder as a physician, you have much more financial freedom to enjoy more expensive life style (not necessarily better) and invest in other business ventures. In fact, physician salary (working 40-hour week) for primary care is going up, now close to mid 200's in California and above 250's for hospitalists who can easily make 300k with a few extra shifts. The retirement compensation will be higher as the physician benefits and 401k allocation are maxed out.
    I understand that there are some restrictions and demands from medical groups/insurance companies for us to practice certain ways, but for the most parts, we practice based on guidelines and evidence based medicine. What kind of job that you can be completely free of being told what to do? unless you have your own business.
    However, your decision should be based on what makes you happy, it's the ultimate thing we all try to achieve.
    GL
    Last edited by CMD; 10-22-2016 at 09:53 AM.

  8. #17
    thxleave is offline Elite Member 7200 points
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    Quote Originally Posted by CMD View Post
    thxleave, it's great you've found what you like. But what about your reason to go to med school in the first place? now that you've decided to do something unrelated to patient care.
    Financially, you are in fact at a disadvantage although you opt for an easy way out of your loan. Your current salary is no where even close to half of what you're gonna earn as a physician as evidenced by your low monthly loan repayments.
    Although you work harder as a physician, you have much more financial freedom to enjoy more expensive life style (not necessarily better) and invest in other business ventures. In fact, physician salary (working 40-hour week) for primary care is going up, now close to mid 200's in California and above 250's for hospitalists who can easily make 300k with a few extra shifts. The retirement compensation will be higher as the physician benefits and 401k allocation are maxed out.
    I understand that there are some restrictions and demands from medical groups/insurance companies for us to practice certain ways, but for the most parts, we practice based on guidelines and evidence based medicine. What kind of job that you can be completely free of being told what to do? unless you have your own business.
    However, your decision should be based on what makes you happy, it's the ultimate thing we all try to achieve.
    GL
    1) What is a guy going to do with a Biology degree in 2011 around the housing crash? Economy was horrible. Couldn't even get a job that paid at least $13 per hour. Pharmacy was becoming the next law school, pumping out people in drones. No regrets about SGU. I took out all federal loans, but now I am able to get a job I love. I wouldn't have gotten this job if it weren't for my MD. I am probably going to pay 25-30k total for my medical endeavors. Which is the amount I would of paid for my undergrad student loans anyways (which I didn't, and now it's consolidated with my med loans).

    2) Forget patient care. Those county hospitals, make me lost all compassion in medicine. I still volunteer to help others. But I get to help volunteer where I feel fufilled.

    3) My salary is alright for what it is, similar to a resident salary starting off. It's the government. But I get my guarantee raises, and I'll jump bracket (government term, you can't get higher positions until you start at lowest position) to live comfortable. Met JDs/MBAs/PharmDs and other MDs that actually started similar salary to me, and they jumped quick. So it is what it is. Government is inefficient that way, but that's how unions are. Good enough to get my 3 bed 2 bath, with decent quality of living.

    4) I know some people are physicians in California. Ones I know are making 180k outpatient. 250k inpatient. But the workload is still intense. My days are pretty chill. I'm not going to go into depth about my job duties, but it's relaxing enough. My lunch break involves Zumba in our built in gym.

    5) I'll make 1/3rd probably of what a physician will make in my life, but I'll do 1/20th amount of work. Not to say I don't work. But I don't feel drained at the end of the day, or consumed in the weekend.

    6) I personally think doctors are getting underpaid. You make 200k as a FM doctor with 40 hour work week seeing patients (you have additional 10-15 hours to document them). That's after 8 years of schooling, 3 years of residency. A nurse in San Fran makes 90k. Why should I work so hard, and have mid-level get almost as much money for way less responsibilities? If salary was closer to 400k at flat 40 hours a week, then yeah I'll be tempted to reapply.

    7) Just tired of medicine. The constant verbal abuse suffered during rotations, and residency is enough to say forget it. Those rude attendings can just pay for my $1 million dollar worth of student loans forgiveness after 10 years. Value of my pension is probably 1 million also if I retire at 62. You get 401k and everything, but the returns on that is at 4% compound interest. Let's be real, those 7-10% days are gone. We live in a near negative interest rate world. Mine is guarantee retirement cash with health benefits better then medicare.

    8) If I am sick, I just call in sick.

    9) Guidelines? I work in the insurance branch of the government. I know enough about Step Therapies, and Prior Authorization and how it can interfere with what doctor want. Guess who helps with creating those?

    10) I am kinda on my own. It's the government. Aslong as you finish your job perfectly, the boss leaves you alone. I may have office drama sometimes, but those are nothing compared to hospital life. Sometimes I don't see my boss for a whole week. He knows I am doing my work, since I get assigned through the computer, and I just finish them. No need to be micromanaged.

    It doesn't make sense. But it doesn't make sense why I should sacrifice my 20's and early 30's to establish myself. Just to make barely double of what a PA/Nurse make, while they only do 4-6 years of training (their courseload is way lighter). It doesn't make sense why doctors aren't respected as much anymore, and people believe mid-levels should get same prescription rights. It doesn't make sense why attendings are allowed to verbally abuse students on the floors, and get away from it. 80 hour work week for 3 years doesn't make sense. I was also already averaging 60-80 hours as a medical student, and I wasn't even paid while getting pimped for things out of my control. The average of Step 1/Step 2CK keeps going up, while more materials are being covered. Stress in medicine is increasing with compensation not meeting high enough for that demand. I am done with medicine. Forget it guys. I am OUT.

    I may not own a mansion or drive a luxury car. But at least I don't have to squeeze blood from stone for those items. I'll be happy driving my ford focus, and living in my more modest home. I am grateful for St. George's University as it ultimately help me get this job. It isn't the best paying, and I'm not necessarily saving lies, but it is competitive enough where it was down to me, a health policy lawyer with years of experience. I won out with my MD. So here I am, living my dreams. It sounds crazy, I know.... But pursuing medicine in this environment of hyper-competition and rise of mid-levels is crazier.
    Last edited by thxleave; 10-22-2016 at 07:42 PM. Reason: I retire at 62, not 55

  9. #18
    CMD
    CMD is offline Junior Member 512 points
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    I kinda can see how things are working for the government. I worked for the federal gov for a few years before med school and it bored me to death with not much of progression career wise. And I didn't want to see myself in the same position in ten, twenty years.
    You can hear or read so much negativity about practicing medicine in the US, but in reality it's still better than other profession, money wise and you actually have a choice of how hard you want to work. If you are concerned about lifestyle and ok with living modestly, you can do part time primary care or hospital medicine, which still brings you more money than other professions. You can work for VA (heard to be easy) or county (slow pace) to get your loan forgiven, and still get paid decently (180-200K).
    I already have a job for next year when I'm done with my IM training. I will work 15-16 days a month and make >260k, projected 300k in 3 years by working avg 40 hour week (hospital medicine).
    I know being a med student sucks as you are the bottom of the rounding groups. But things get better in residency in terms of stress. First year is the hardest as you learn to be a clinician while having to do a lot of leg work. When you are in second and third year, you are becoming a clinician, having more confidence in your patient care and the stress level actually gets better as a result.
    I just hope you have done your research before letting such a good opportunity to become a doctor go. You are at the door and only need 2 more years to become a license practitioner. At this point, you have a Caribbean MD but are not a doctor. All these blogs/news about how bad things are in medicine can be misleading. Those who wrote them are bitter about their jobs but it does not apply to everyone.

  10. #19
    devildoc8404's Avatar
    devildoc8404 is offline Ultimate Member 12692 points
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    Medicine is great and (generally) well-compensated, but face it -- clinical medicine is not for everybody, and it doesn't love you back. And it is certainly NOT the best way to make money (based on amount of time and effort spent getting started in the gig, and number of hours required once you are done). I have friends who are B-school grads who already make well over a quarter of a million dollars a year, and invested a fraction of the time and effort that it takes to become a doc... and they work normal hours, in most cases.

    Seriously, I am in my research year of residency right now, and it is often quite tempting to just disappear into the research track entirely and tell the clinical folks to get bent (my last 18 months before the research year were pretty much hell). Full disclosure: I am a married guy with two little girls, and this year I get to have dinner with my family. For me, there is no price tag on that.

    Heading back into the clinical portion of residency next year, I can already tell that things will get horrible again in a hurry, and I do not get this time with my kids back. It raises a lot of questions for me, that much is certain. Three more years of clinical runaround and surgical hours? Holy crap.

    Yeah, my specialty pays well (ave. 300-400k depending) but I am not remotely interested in following the footsteps of guys like my former department head -- rich as hell, drives a Maserati, has all the trappings of "success," and has completely lost his marriage and family in the shuffle and is an arrogant... (searching for a civil descriptor... searching, searching... um...) "individual." Screw that. Not interested. Is it like that for everyone in this specialty? No, of course not, but it far-and-away the norm based on what I have seen, and I have not yet come across a mentor who is living the life I have envisioned for myself in medicine. Which sucks, and is rather deflating...

    At any rate, my point (wait, did I have one? Oh yeah...) was that everybody makes their own decisions, and I really don't think thxleave made this jump on a whim. There are docs working in all kinds of positions. For me? I want to be BC in something no matter what I end up doing, but my original goal of "urologist or bust" has taken a real hit when faced with the sharp spotlight of medical, personal, and familial reality. Time will tell how it plays out.

    "When I haven't any
    blue... I use red
    ."
    - Pablo Picasso

    BA - Oregon MS - BYU MD - MU-Sofia
    Urology Resident; Clinical Research Fellow



  11. #20
    ctang is offline Junior Member 514 points
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    "I promise myself that I would reapply if I didn't get a job within 3 months of not matching that pays well enough to qualify for student loan forgiveness. I took out the maximum at SGU, so my student loans is around 450k. Compound interest with that in 10 years will be a MILLION DOLLARS.

    My job with the government makes it so after 10 years of paying 10% of my AGI I get everything forgiven tax FREE. ....."

    thxleave,
    I hope this is not be main reason you chose to not reapply for the match. All government financial regulation like this, including social security, can be changed by congress in the future. But unlike social security which has the most powerful voter constituency in America and changing SS is still widely discussed, the "rich doctor's" student loan forgiveness program has little voter support. It was an O initiative that the Republican congress is not likely to continue backing once the huge costs become apparent. this is a program not just for IMG's but for all medical students. And nearly all hospitals are non-profit so most doctors qualify. You can do the calculations of the cost as 10 years come up.

    I want it to continue as much as you because my daughter's loans will be facing the same uncertainty in the coming years. Even though next year, she will be entering her fellowship at one of the top hospitals in the country, she still worries how she will be able to pay her loans if the loan forgiveness condition is rescinded.

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