Stop the Nonsense

[jpryor]

It would be reasonable to ask yourself why some people placing posts on these forums spend an inordinate amount of time and effort to continue agitating the issue of foreign medical schools. If not now, it is reasonable to assume that there will be a secondary gain motive, as the histrionics and vitriol belie any altruistic or ignoble motive. It is equally probable they are nothing more than poseurs.

You may be new to foreign medical schools but foreign medical schools are not new to the U.S. healthcare system. Contrary to the rhetoric of a few, graduates of these schools are valued and welcomed as practitioners. There is no debate that the quality of any medical education obtained from outside the U.S. has been, and will continue to be, verified and validated through independent testing. There is no debate that there are initial licensing restrictions in place in some states. What you, being new to this, appear to be alarmed about is the initial licensing restrictions.

Consider this, you become a licensed M.D. upon graduating medical school—meaning before you start your clinical training as interns and residents. Once you complete your residency and pass your specialty Boards, there are no restrictions, by any state, on your license. Once Board Certified, which is the goal of every practitioner, you can practice in the state of your choosing. It has always been that way and it always will be.

The best advice you can heed is to do your own research from CREDIBLE resources.

[Miklos]

Originally Posted by jpryor

It would be reasonable to ask yourself why some people placing posts on these forums spend an inordinate amount of time and effort to continue agitating the issue of foreign medical schools. If not now, it is reasonable to assume that there will be a secondary gain motive, as the histrionics and vitriol belie any altruistic or ignoble motive. It is equally probable they are nothing more than poseurs.

You may be new to foreign medical schools but foreign medical schools are not new to the U.S. healthcare system. Contrary to the rhetoric of a few, graduates of these schools are valued and welcomed as practitioners. There is no debate that the quality of any medical education obtained from outside the U.S. has been, and will continue to be, verified and validated through independent testing. There is no debate that there are initial licensing restrictions in place in some states. What you, being new to this, appear to be alarmed about is the initial licensing restrictions.

Consider this, you become a licensed M.D. upon graduating medical school—meaning before you start your clinical training as interns and residents. Once you complete your residency and pass your specialty Boards, there are no restrictions, by any state, on your license. Once Board Certified, which is the goal of every practitioner, you can practice in the state of your choosing. It has always been that way and it always will be.

The best advice you can heed is to do your own research from CREDIBLE resources.

This, in the case of California, is false. If your med school/program is not approved, you cannot be licensed EVEN after board certification.

(The regulation is written in such a way that there is NO LOOPHOLE.)

See Pat Park's post at http://www.valuemd.com/viewtopic.php?t=988

If you do not believe me, check with the Medical Board of California www.medbd.ca.gov

[neilc]

simply not true...you do not get to move state to state upon completion. some states will allow this, some will not. check around, and ask the boards.

also, it is not possible to get licensed before internship/residency...you get a provisional license during and become fully licensed 1-3 years later...

[azskeptic]

Originally Posted by Miklos

This, in the case of California, is false. If your med school/program is not approved, you cannot be licensed EVEN after board certification.

(The regulation is written in such a way that there is NO LOOPHOLE.)

See Pat Park's post at http://www.valuemd.com/viewtopic.php?t=988

If you do not believe me, check with the Medical Board of California www.medbd.ca.gov

and even further, go to UHSA, IUHS, OCEANIA,etc. and you'll find lots of doors closed to you......one has to be careful of WHERE they are educated.....the countryside is littered with folks with MD's that will never be able to license...they drive our taxis, adjust our backs (quite a few DC's went to a Russian fraud school),etc.

az skeptic

[agnostic]

Originally Posted by jpryor

It would be reasonable to ask yourself why some people placing posts on these forums spend an inordinate amount of time and effort to continue agitating the issue of foreign medical schools. If not now, it is reasonable to assume that there will be a secondary gain motive, as the histrionics and vitriol belie any altruistic or ignoble motive. It is equally probable they are nothing more than poseurs.

You may be new to foreign medical schools but foreign medical schools are not new to the U.S. healthcare system. Contrary to the rhetoric of a few, graduates of these schools are valued and welcomed as practitioners. There is no debate that the quality of any medical education obtained from outside the U.S. has been, and will continue to be, verified and validated through independent testing. There is no debate that there are initial licensing restrictions in place in some states. What you, being new to this, appear to be alarmed about is the initial licensing restrictions.

Consider this, you become a licensed M.D. upon graduating medical school—meaning before you start your clinical training as interns and residents. Once you complete your residency and pass your specialty Boards, there are no restrictions, by any state, on your license. Once Board Certified, which is the goal of every practitioner, you can practice in the state of your choosing. It has always been that way and it always will be.

The best advice you can heed is to do your own research from CREDIBLE resources.

Jpryor,

I share your heartfelt wish and hope more and more med students will take your advice.

Perhaps your post will serve to convince bit by bit our favourite Consumer Advocate that as true friend and protector of the myopically mystified and catatonically confused - does that best sum up med students? - he really does know diddly-squat about offshore medical schools.

However, fair is fair; let us all give him our best one-handed clap for partisanship and zealotry.

Perhaps in return, he might give the rest of us a little credit that one day when we're big, we will catch up and bask in the shadow of his Kim-Il-Sung-type status as the Favored Enlightened One who tells us the 'good' and 'bad' in offshore medical education.

[Japhethi]

Originally Posted by jpryor

......reasonable to assume that there will be a secondary gain motive, as the histrionics and vitriol belie any altruistic or ignoble motive. It is equally probable they are nothing more than poseurs.


There is no debate that the quality of any medical education obtained from outside the U.S. has been, and will continue to be, verified and validated through independent testing. There is no debate that there are initial licensing restrictions in place in some states. What you, being new to this, appear to be alarmed about is the initial licensing restrictions.

....Once you complete your residency and pass your specialty Boards, there are no restrictions, by any state, on your license. Once Board Certified, which is the goal of every practitioner, you can practice in the state of your choosing. It has always been that way and it always will be.

The best advice you can heed is to do your own research from CREDIBLE resources.

While I support your vigorous optimism, it is plainly WRONG of you to state that a board certification grants you unrestricted license to practice medicine. Actually, board certification and license as surgeon and physician have very little with each other to do. Resiprocity is becoming less and less common for many states and definately not an automatic procedure. Endorsements, yes, automatic unrestriced reciprocity for Caribbean grads, nope..

You can be licensed without being board-certified, which 1 in 5 practicing physicians are.

Your nonsense crap about "histrionics" and other non-relevant issues just confirm that Azskeptic have hit hard on a sore spot. I don't think anyone from serious schools like AUC, Ro$$, St. Georges, Saba/MUA, Statia to mention a few have anything to fear form azskeptics scrutiny. Rather, on the contrary, the more scrutiny upon Caribbean medical schools, the harder it will be to open new ones, something I think would not be a bad idea..

Fine to debate, but could you homeschool proponents; Please refrain from all kind of personal attacks and dirt-talking all the time?

[lswiltshire]

Actually Pryor and Agnostic, I am verey glad for the warnings by AZskeptic. He helped me stay clear of IUHS and UHSA especially. I hope that his posts helps others too.

Schools should comply with state regualations. Keep up your good worl AZskeptic

[teratos]

I agree with you entire post, except the part about no doors being closed. If your school is not california approved, you can never practice there. Even if you are board certified in every specialty and cure HIV. Pretty dumb, really.

[azskeptic]

Originally Posted by SonsofJafeth

While I support your vigorous optimism, it is plainly WRONG of you to state that a board certification grants you unrestricted license to practice medicine. Actually, board certification and license as surgeon and physician have very little with each other to do. Resiprocity is becoming less and less common for many states and definately not an automatic procedure. Endoresments, yes, automatic unrestriced reciprociyt for Caribbena grads, nope..

You can be licensed without being board-certified, which 1 in 5 practicing physicians are.

Your nonsense crap about "histrionics" and other non-relevant issues just confirm that Azskeptic have hit hard on a sore spot. I don't think anyone from serious schools like AUC, Ro$$, St. Georges, Saba/MUA, Statia to mention a few have anything to fear form azskeptics scrutiny. Rather, on the contrary, the more scrutiny upon Caribbean medical schools, the harder it will be to open new ones, something I think would not be a bad idea..

Fine to debate, but could you homeschool proponents; Please refrain from all kind of personal attacks and dirt-talking all the time?

love the term 'homeschool proponents'...that is it in a nutshell for IUHS/UHSA........I find the personal attacks interesting...I've been threatened physically by one of the 'homeschool proponents' but I enjoy the spirited talk. It shows that people are thinking. Schools that are following the rules (as you list and I would include St. James/St. Mathews) are not the ones that need to be scrutinized....the schools that are doing half-steps can expect that people like me will be asking questions...I can understand the fear that some folks have who are in schools that are having troubles.

[stephew]

you think spritied talk means folks are thinking? When you reread some posts, don't you think it means exactly the opposite?