Georgetown's Take on Foreign Med Schools

[azskeptic]

http://www.georgetown.edu/college/premed/foreign.htm

Foreign Medical Schools

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In some instances it may be easier to gain admission to foreign medical schools than to U.S. Medical schools. There are difficulties also, in such a venture: cost, language and cultural barriers, licensure to practice in the U.S. If you plan to attend a foreign school, you should anticipate finishing your education there. Some students have been able to transfer back to American schools. (See Medical School Admissions Requirements, Chapter 8). The number of such transfers is small and fluctuates unpredictably. An indication of the hostility that AAMC has for foreign trained medical students is that they have denied access to part I of the National Medical Boards for American students studying abroad and have set up a separate exam (Medical Science Knowledge Profile) in order to avoid comparison with American trained students.
Most foreign medical schools will not take Americans (just as American schools do not accept many aliens). There are a few in recent years which have sizeable numbers of American students. Some are listed below with comments and addresses where further information may be obtained.

Australia
Comparable in competition and cost to U.S. schools. They expect MCAT scores in the initial screening. Contact the cultural affairs office at the embassy.

Austria
German language is required. There is very limited experience of Americans completing studies and successfully returning to practice in the U.S.

Austrian Information Center
31 East 69th Street
New York, New York 10021

Belgium
Many of the texts are in English whereas the lectures are in French or Flemish. Quality is good but only a small number of Americans get in. Advanced degrees may help.

Belgian Consulate General
50 Rockefeller Plaza
New York, New York 10020


Caribbean
See web sites for information about St. Georges on Grenada and Ross University on Dominica.


Central and South America
A number of countries and private medical schools recruit American students. Some few have relatively stable histories and tradition (e.g., Chile). Some are extremely unstable enterprises with inadequate facilities. Several were investigated by the U.S. Postal Service for fraud in their recruitment procedures. Look at foreign schools very carefully, ask advice of a disinterested party like your pre-med advisor. Take the following into consideration in your first evaluation:

1. Does the school advertise in the media? Beware if only a telephone number is listed and if the ad promises any type of recognition from within the U.S.A.

2. Has it been founded since 1970? (most of the worst are recent.)

3. Is it located in a country of fewer than five million people? Is this country underdeveloped, i.e., unable to finance a reputable medical school?

4. Are the application/interview fees high?

5. Is a full year of tuition payment required in advance of actual enrollment? Is this payment non-refundable? Large?

6. Is the school proprietary or unsponsored by a reputable university listed in standard directories?

7. Does it use hospital facilities of fewer than 500-600 beds for clinical teaching? Beware of promises to "arrange" clinical studies at hospitals in the U.S.A. Speak with administrators of the U.S. hospitals where such clinical studies are held and see how they evaluate them.

8. Is the class of students enrolled unlimited in numbers? How many graduates emerged in each of the past two or three years?

9. Who are the faculty? How many are really full-time? Be skeptical of a long list of faculty from the U.S.A.; these may have signed on for a short (paid), mid-winter vacation, or may be listed without permission.

10. What kind of basic science teaching facilities are used: What laboratory equipment is available and in use?

(Questions courtesy of AAMC Advisor.)


France
The French system allows for relatively easy admission to the first year of medical school after which an extensive examination screens out all but a small percentage for the second year. There are few private universities (e.g., Mediterranean Program, Marseille, or Faculties Catholiques de Lille) who seem interested in recruiting Americans. This author is unable to evaluate their quality.

Ireland
Costs are similar to U.S. schools. A few Americans get in each year. Family connections may help.

Royal College of Surgeons
Dublin, Ireland

Italy
Recent indications are that Italy will continue to enroll some aliens in Italian medical schools. Italy has been the single largest source of medical education for Americans in Europe. Two schools are in Rome and Bologna. Contact the Italian consulate. Tuition is free or low. Do not pay high application fees to privateers.

Mexico
There are two schools, Monterey and Guadalajara, which have traditionally accepted American students. The status of Monterey is in flux with respect to acceptance of American students. Consult the Mexican consulate in Washington for an update.

Guadalajara has been soliciting U.S. students. They say they want a 3.0 and above 8 on the MCATs but have been taking students with lower numerical averages. They even provide Spanish courses prior to the start of the school year. They expect a one year internship and one year medical - social work after graduation in Mexico but make it possible to try to transfer back to U.S. schools after 3 years.

Although clinical opportunities are thin, the school seems stable. Recruiting officers in the U.S. generally are available in Washington or New York, or you may write directly to:

Facultad de medicine de la Universidad
Autonoma de Guadalajara
Tolsa 238 Guadalajara
Jalisco, Mexico

Philippines
Lectures in English. Clinical experience is very shallow. There are about six schools of mixed quality and stability. All welcome tuition in U.S. dollars. Americans would be better off staying in Manila to minimize general adjustment problems. Contact the Philippine Consulate.

Poland
Karol Marcinkowski, Poznan, instruction in English.

Placement Services
You can pay large sums to gain admission to foreign schools. Some of these services are hookers. Judge them by the size of the fees. One such "service" charged $3,000 to get you into an Italian or French school. You could have done all the work yourself for the price of the postage only! Note that Italian schools charge little or no tuition. French schools are very difficult. Few Americans survive past the first year in them.
Evaluating Foreign Programs is difficult. The situation varies with current events. One source is the A.M.A. record of those foreign medical graduates who pass the board examination. You should be able to exact this information from the National Board of Medical Examiners (NBME). See chapter 8 in recent issues of Medical School Admissions Requirements for details and a bibliography.
Do not hesitate to ask the premed advisor for information about foreign schools. Although this writer does not promote foreign schools and regards a foreign medical education as extremely risky for most Americans who would consider it, nevertheless, I will be glad to share my file of data with you--you just might have to sit through my list of warnings and cautions.


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last updated Thursday, December 4, 2003

[bts4202]

Originally Posted by azskeptic

http://www.georgetown.edu/college/premed/foreign.htm

Foreign Medical Schools

Italy
Recent indications are that Italy will continue to enroll some aliens in Italian medical schools. Italy has been the single largest source of medical education for Americans in Europe. Two schools are in Rome and Bologna. Contact the Italian consulate. Tuition is free or low. Do not pay high application fees to privateers.

last updated Thursday, December 4, 2003

What?? I wish I knew this info a couple years ago!! I love Rome!!

Seriously, anyone interested in foreign med school, look into these schools first before any caribb or caribb style school. You have to learn italian, but it would be soooooo worth it. I don't know anything about these schools, but just living in Rome for 4-6 years or so is enough to win my endorsement.

UNIVERSITA CATTOLICA DEL SACRO CUORE
http://www.unicatt.it/ucsc_EV.asp

UNIVERSITA DI ROMA TOR VERGATA
http://www2.uniroma2.it/inglese/index.html

[stephew]

I have to add my bit here: Rome many years ago (25+) was a good place to go as a US img. Not at all now. There isn't a good residency placement rate over all for US IMGs coming back from Italy. Go to rome for a holiday but to suggest its an easy pick over many caribbean schools is really off base these days. The last American I met who went to Rome was the guy about 7 years ago who was running my step one review course; he was back in the US for some years and still hadn't got himself a residency. Don't make the mistake of assuming its easy to get back into the US just because you go to what is a good European (or other) school. The issues is always pass rates, licensing and residency placement.

[bts4202]

I was exaggerating, I know. I just love rome.

[Picard]

An indication of the hostility that AAMC has for foreign trained medical students is that they have denied access to part I of the National Medical Boards for American students studying abroad and have set up a separate exam (Medical Science Knowledge Profile) in order to avoid comparison with American trained students.

What are they talking about? Step I is Step I, doesn't matter whether you register it through NBME (US students) or ECFMG (international students.)

P

[Miklos]

Austria
German language is required. There is very limited experience of Americans completing studies and successfully returning to practice in the U.S.

This is the Georgetown pre-med advisor? I am not impressed with the quality of the information. A ton of Americans have gone to Austria, especially Vienna in the past to get their medical degrees and have successfully returned. Then Austria became more expensive and the admissions policy changed. Essentially, you need to be able to be accepted at a med school in your native country in order to gain admission. Additionally, they require the Goethe certification for language or its equivalent, which means near native German knowledge. These two factors have made Vienna much less attractive to US students, though a fair number of students from less developed countries gain admission through a separate program.

France
The French system allows for relatively easy admission to the first year of medical school after which an extensive examination screens out all but a small percentage for the second year. There are few private universities (e.g., Mediterranean Program, Marseille, or Faculties Catholiques de Lille) who seem interested in recruiting Americans. This author is unable to evaluate their quality.

Well, this is much more accurate. Essentially, everyone is admitted and only a small percentage makes the 2nd year. (And another round of elimination for the 3rd year.) Competition is brutal and sets student against student. A friend of mine described how if you dropped your pen during an exam, your 'fellow' students would kick it away from you to hinder you. If you left your notes unattended for more than a minute or two, you would be sure to have them stolen. LIBERTE, EGALITE, FRATERNITE! Additionally, xenophobia is a problem. Americans are despised. Unless you are French or braindead, French med schools are best avoided.

Ireland
Costs are similar to U.S. schools. A few Americans get in each year. Family connections may help.

I disagree. A ton of North Americans go to Ireland. Getting in and paying for it are another matter.

Italy
Recent indications are that Italy will continue to enroll some aliens in Italian medical schools. Italy has been the single largest source of medical education for Americans in Europe. Two schools are in Rome and Bologna. Contact the Italian consulate. Tuition is free or low. Do not pay high application fees to privateers.

Stephew is correct.

Placement Services
You can pay large sums to gain admission to foreign schools. Some of these services are hookers. Judge them by the size of the fees. One such "service" charged $3,000 to get you into an Italian or French school. You could have done all the work yourself for the price of the postage only! Note that Italian schools charge little or no tuition. French schools are very difficult. Few Americans survive past the first year in them.
Evaluating Foreign Programs is difficult. The situation varies with current events. One source is the A.M.A. record of those foreign medical graduates who pass the board examination.

No disagreement here.