Help!!- U of Zagreb - new English Med program

[curious-sun]

Hi everyone,

I am a newbie . I posted this message privately to Msucby and just found out how to post a public message. Hence, sending some questions to everyone else.

I am a 34 year old gal ( non-trad) from Malaysia. I used to lecture in Business, IT & Engineering colleges for 7 years and am currently managing an offshore office of an American IT company for several years. I completed GCE O level science subjects. I have a bachelor degree in IT from Australia and a Masters Degree in IT(Computer Science) from Malaysia. So, I do not have A-levels or 12 years of schooling as per the USA system. Also never took MCAT - and I dont want to spend my time doing A levels or MCAT at the moment.

I have been searching high and low for an English medical program that incorporates fundamental science subjects ( like pre-U / A-levels) in their track. I looked at many schools in the Carribean, EU, Africa, Russia & South America. My finances are a little tight.

I found out that the University of Zagreb in Croatia started an English medical track in 2003. UZMS' 6 year program incorporates basic science fundamentals and they do waive their entrance test requirements, depending on one's current qualifications.

My intent is to do my residency and practice in the States. So, I called up Miss Pat Park at the California Medical Board (CMB), just to find out if UZMS' English Medical program is accredited by them. Currently, only the Croatian program is accredited but their English program is not.

I have some questions which I hope someone can help me with.

1) Is there anyone ( especially an American ) at UZMS doing the 4year / 6year program? I need your honest feedback to this program.

2) Do you happen to know which organization in the US I can call up to find out the states that accept UZMS English med degree?

3) Can anyone tell me what processes a university should undertake in order for their English med program to be accredited in the US?

4a) How are the presentation materials delivered at UZMS?
i.e. does UZMS compile materials translated directly from Croatian language to English? Do they have web-based teaching / exams for some subjects? Do Profs just read off from powerpoint slides or really explain from the slides?

b) How is UZMS' library stock of medical books in English?

c) How is the quality of teaching?

d) Does UZMS use problem based learning methods to teach? or does one just have to memorize blindly?

e) Are exams given as viva voce (orals) only ?

f) Are the subjects graded as pass or fail ? Or indicated as A,B,C,etc?

g) Do they allow students in their clinical years ( 4th - 6th year ) to really work with patients and not just take down patient history?


5) Does UK recognize the UZMS English med program? ( Pat Park said that if a degree is not accredited by the California Medical Board, even if the student passes USMLE, the student will not be able to land a residency slot in California )


Apologies for all these questions. I am really concerned about some negative notes I read in the forums about countries that run English medical programs parallel to their native language medical program.

I know that there are 2 sides to a coin. However, I seem to read a lot of postings regarding cheating by students who dont study and still pass because some lecturer sold the exam questions to them, some universities making the foreign students repeat subjects in order to get more tuition fees from them, most Profs not being available to attend to students' questions or come to class, foreign students left in the dark on what to study for exams, little or NO guidance on how to apply medical knowledge to clinical settings. My cousin in NY went to a school in Hungary and found this to be true. Also, another person when to a "prestigious" Uni in Prague which has its English med program accredited by the Calif Med Board and found this to be true as well!! So much for accreditions!!

Dont get me wrong. I know that NO SCHOOL IS PERFECT and I am willing to put in my share (and more) of hard work and rough it out. I can accomodate myself to the changes of being in a foreign land. I even took up some Russian and German, in case I have to do a medical track in that language. ( I know it is quite difficult in Germany, since one has to be extremely proficient in German and be a citizen ).

I dont mind learning up a new language, living in a small place, hot / freezing climates, no entertainment life, etc.

However, I am cautious in where I put the next 6 years of my life ( I will be 41 by then!! ). The teaching quality in the University is my main concern.

I know how it was in college for me. Not all lecturers were great. Some were below average and I had to study their subjects mainly on my own. However, these were subjects like accounting, history, programming - unlike medicine where one has to have some guidance and hands-on experience with patients. At least if 70% of the Profs/tutors teach & guide properly, it would help at lot ( or maybe that's too much to ask? hmmm.. )

Anyway, from my own teaching experiences in college, I did my very best to teach my students and really really guided them in my subjects. So, I hope you know where I am coming from and not clasify me as a fussy pot .

Also, at 34 years of age with not much money, I really need to do some proper groundwork on the actual happenings and quality in the English med programs of a university.

So, please everyone - NO BASHINGs.. Just need some feedback.

Thanks!!!

[shrey]

hey curious sun...i don't know much about UZMS but I do know that it is not CA reognised. There are only 4-5 schools that are CA recognised and those are the ones in Central Europe (czech republic, poland, hungary)....I'm currently planning on joining the Charles First faculty of Medicine in Prague,Czech Republic and it's a very good university and is also recognised by the CA board (which entitles you to practise in all the 50 US states)....so good luck in chooseing in choosing a medical school....

[curious-sun]

Hi Shrey,

Thanks for replying. I checked out Charles Uni as well. Yes, their Czech language program is good. But there are some issues with the English language program. Read forums on Charles Uni to get a better idea.

The good thing is that it is certainly CA recognized and in all the states in the US, which makes it worth it. I was actually thinking of going to Charles Uni, despite reading about the cheating, corruption, no proper guidance in some classes, etc. I was still willing to rough it out. Unfortunately, the agent in Malaysia told me that I need to have 12 years schooling, even for the 6 year program and even with my Masters Degree!! Apparently, the faculty members come to Malaysia every May do conduct entrance tests for the potential students here. So, there goes my luck with Charles University in Praha!!

I was reading MSUCBY's notes on UZMS. She is a British citizen who is studying in the English medical program in Zagreb. Though Croatia is not in EU yet, she says she is taking a gamble. She really wrote more positive things about UZMS English medium program than most foreign medical schools I have read about!! UZMS seems promising but I was hoping to hear from other members as well.

Please take a look at these sites :

Medical studies

University of Zagreb Medical School enrollment in its 2007/2008 MD Program in English!

Medical Studies in English

I know UZMS it is not CA recognized YET but they do seem to have some good WORKING relationships with some American Hospitals and Universities. MSUCBY said that a Prof Jezek from UZMS is an honest person. So, I was thinking of calling him up to find out if UZMS is planning to submit forms necessary for CA approval. Anyway, I will keep all posted about my call details.

For everyone else, I really appreciate and welcome your thoughts ( no bashings please!!)

[Mister]

Curious Sun any luck? I am also looking for a good school to go to I heard that Charles Uni/Zagreb?debrecen were fairly good schools but I still have my concerns please let me know what you have learned and if there is anyone with experience please help me .....Thanks so much...