Should I do a Masters Degree to upgrade my admission chances?? Please Help!

[IwannabeMD]

Hey everyone! If anyone can offer an insight it will be deeply appreciated..

I am graduating with Bsc. in Neuroscience at the University of Toronto, Canada. During my entire 4 years of undergrad I worked fulltime to support my family, and suffered major depression (am still battling it, but with much strength).

My overall cumulative and science GPA will be approximately a pathetic 2.5 . I did manage to do decent in the final year and apparently I am good enough to get admitted to a Masters Program here at Toronto. I will take my MCATS next April and studying very hard for it. I have TONS of hospital volunteer work (Mental health hospital, dialysis unit etc.) and community volunteering experiences ( HIV/AIDS prevention committees)

My question is: I really want to go to SABA since its accepted at most US states AND none of the Canadian med schools will accept me. Since I dont meet SABA's 3.0 undergrad GPA requirement, should I do a Masters degree (in Neuroscience), and then apply to SABA , thus improving my chances of admission there ?

A "broken-record" statement here : "Its been my dream to be a MD". but life's difficult circumstances prevented my potential to shine.....

Any help/advice shall be deeply appreciated.

Thanks and Great luck !

[mdjd]

I don't know whether an MS will help or not, and I realize your GPA is 2.5, but FWIW I just received SABA's application packet and it states the minimum GPA applicants are expected to have is 2.75 (not 3.0).

[Experienced]

Email or phone Bernice at the US office in Gardner and ask her. She's a REALLY nice person and she's the registrar. She will answer you forthrightly...
registrar@saba.edu

Good luck! UT's a great school and there are quite a few UT grads here.

[2cr8tive]

Hi, I'm in a similar (not exact) situation. I've a 3 overal GPA (stronger in science) and got accepted in a masters program in vancouver. I've heard people with 3.2 that didn't get into SABA. so I emailed them. the registrar lady (who's by the way very nice) said the average GPA is 3. she also added that good grades in masters degree is definatly helpful. but it doesn't hurt to apply. you can also check out other schools such as MUA (less recognized by still good universities). let us know what happens

[Experienced]

After reading 2cr8tive's good reply, it also occured to me: why not take the MCAT? It seems to me that doing so would a) give a better predictor to the admissions committee as to your potential than a masters degree, and b) would give you a pretty good idea whether your dream to be a doc is a realistic one. Btw, my guess is that very soon Saba will make the MCAT mandatory for applicants. I've heard that many of the faculty are distressed by the low quality of some recent students and strongly endorse an MCAT requirement.

[Compassion MD]

Hi guys..

If you really want to go to SABA... and only SABA... then I say def. apply this year instead of doing master degree. Because you never know if you will get in or not til you apply. However, do apply for master program too incase if you don't get into SABA. Hope you see my point. And yes, MS degree does help only if you do good to excellent... so yea., apply and good luck.

[butters]

apply this year and see what happens.

if u don't get in, go for your master's and then reapply.

if you really have the drive, u will do it! Best of luck!

[miasma]

apply this year and see what happens.

if u don't get in, go for your master's and then reapply.

if you really have the drive, u will do it! Best of luck!
yeah, do this...you never know until you apply. good luck.

[amyames]

it's not the masters that is really that important....it's taking higher level science classes and doing well in them. I had lower than a 3.0 undergrad GPA, but I did do a year of post-bacc work and had a 3.0 in the post-bacc, and now I am in a masters program. They told me the fact that I did well in higher level bio classes let them know I could handle the coursework.

it's not that they think someone with a 2.5 won't make a good doctor, they just want to make sure you can handle the hardcourse work that medical school entails. My advice to you would be to take some upper science classes such as histology, genetics, immunology, or pathophysiology, and get A's in these classes, and then apply to SABA. taking one semester of upper level coursework isn't going to take as time out as a masters would, and if you do well in these courses, you'll be more confident that you handle medical school.


I also agree with some of the other posters...take the MCAT as well. So, I'd take a semester of post-bacc and the MCAT, and then apply to SABA<

whatever you decide, good luck. just remember that I got into SABA mainly because of my upper level science grades....

[retina_geek]

I graduated from Queen's University shortly before starting Saba in Sept '01 w/ a paltry 2.8 GPA (and even w/ this, things worked out pretty well :D)... I wouldn't worry about your GPA so much. Like anything in medicine, letters of recommendation are everything.

I also believe that the admissions committee would look at a Canadian applicant much more favorably than our US counterparts. When I was on Saba, nearly every Canadian in our class was at the top of our class... Trust me when I say those of us from McGill, Queen's, U of T and UBC are much more competitive than those from random US state schools...

Good luck.

[2cr8tive]

retina geek, Do you know if they are calculating the GPA's differently (Canadian vs American)? I know some schools add a bit to the Canadian's GPA. any information is greatly appriciated.

[miasma]

[quote=retina_geek]Trust me when I say those of us from McGill, Queen's, U of T and UBC are much more competitive than those from random US state schools...
quote]
how about coming from the university of alberta? :D

[2cr8tive]

competitive. all big canadian universities are competitive. here in UBC, the average can not be over 66%! so to get an A you really must be on top of things. you do the calculation.

[butters]

I graduated from Queen's University shortly before starting Saba in Sept '01 w/ a paltry 2.8 GPA (and even w/ this, things worked out pretty well :D)... I wouldn't worry about your GPA so much. Like anything in medicine, letters of recommendation are everything.

I also believe that the admissions committee would look at a Canadian applicant much more favorably than our US counterparts. When I was on Saba, nearly every Canadian in our class was at the top of our class... Trust me when I say those of us from McGill, Queen's, U of T and UBC are much more competitive than those from random US state schools...

Good luck.


random u.s. state schools? such as?

most of the state school systems are pretty competitive here as well...look at the university of california, university of michigan, university of texas, etc., etc. systems.

most of us from u.s. state schools are pretty competitive as well.

[retina_geek]

Canadian undergraduate programs (yes, U of Alberta counts) are exceedingly competitive. No doubt, some state schools like UNC, Michigan and VA are excellent as well. It's that those programs, along with the IVY league programs make up only 5-10% of the schools in the country. At least when I went to Saba, most of my fellow classmates from the US went to schools that I would put nowhere near the aforementioned ones. And the quality of the school makes a huge difference in one's ability to handle the work and responsibility of medical school.

[doctor_dream]

Wow retina_geek,

You're gonna start a hugh quarrel here if you say that (most are American students)...although, I do admit that you are right. I am from UofT and there was an article published in Globe&Mail couple of years ago comparing Harvard and UofT grading scheme and they said that a "C" in UofT is equivalent to "A" in Harvard. I am very wary of that situation becuase i don't know how true it is....b/c obviously i have never attended Harvard, but UofT is tough for sure.

Anyway, it is true according to my sibling who has attended both canadian and American universities...Canadian are way tougher than American universities.

Anyway, i don't know how i contributed to this thread, but just wanted to share some info with all those canadians out there.

[Hoirch]

Hey , I was in the same boat as you. My first year gpa was about a 1.5 due to some circumstances. I worked my butt off for the next 3 years and graduated with a 3.7 overall gpa with an honours in virology. I passed my mcats but no canadian school would take me b/c of my first year marks. I did not want to go back and do the first year over again so I applied to Saba and I got in. I would have liked to practice in Canada, butI'm not going to wait another 3-4 years to start my MD. Just apply now and you never know, it's all aout the interview anyway.

[bigkap87]

hmmm... That's a pretty bold statement Retina. I would like to see a comparison of MCAT scores from Canadian and American Universities. Since MCAT is the only common thread between the two and exam on a level playing field. Not sure if this has been done, but I would bet MCAT scores would be similar.

[butters]

hmmm... That's a pretty bold statement Retina. I would like to see a comparison of MCAT scores from Canadian and American Universities. Since MCAT is the only common thread between the two and exam on a level playing field. Not sure if this has been done, but I would bet MCAT scores would be similar.

i would have to agree and actually add that the canadian students at my school actually had lower mcat scores than most of their u.s. counterparts.

i dunno...until there's some sort of study done, it's hard to speculate.

[Experienced]

Well, this calls for Experience. In all the classes I've followed while on Saba, the Canadian students set the curve without exception. And those from UofT are at the very top. Doesn't mean there aren't some Americans up there, too, but on the average, the Canadian students seem brighter, more dedicated, and a lot more mature than their classmates south of the border. Sorry, Americans, but living in another country is going to be a real eye opener for many of you.

[retina_geek]

hmmm... That's a pretty bold statement Retina. I would like to see a comparison of MCAT scores from Canadian and American Universities. Since MCAT is the only common thread between the two and exam on a level playing field. Not sure if this has been done, but I would bet MCAT scores would be similar.

word on the street is that approximately 40% of applicants to US schools are admitted with less than 10% admitted north of the border. cut-off mcat at my old school was 35 the year i went to saba.

[Gavanshir]

random u.s. state schools? such as?

most of the state school systems are pretty competitive here as well...look at the university of california, university of michigan, university of texas, etc., etc. systems.

most of us from u.s. state schools are pretty competitive as well.

No you are not, we win again.

[bigkap87]

word on the street is that approximately 40% of applicants to US schools are admitted with less than 10% admitted north of the border. cut-off mcat at my old school was 35 the year i went to saba.

The mere fact that there are less medical schools and seats in Canada vs. the USA has no bearing on the quality of students produced in each country. This may explain why Canadian Saba students are of higher quality. But you cannot generalize and say Canadian students are more intelligent, and better trained than American students.

[Experienced]

The mere fact that there are less medical schools and seats in Canada vs. the USA has no bearing on the quality of students produced in each country. This may explain why Canadian Saba students are of higher quality. But you cannot generalize and say Canadian students are more intelligent, and better trained than American students.
But you CAN say that the Canadian students that Saba accepts are smarter and harder working as a group, which appears to be the case.

[retina_geek]

i think some of you all are taking this a little too literally. all i attempted to mention was that the quality of the students rejected from canadian schools is better than those not offered admission from us schools. hard working and smarter are independent (hopefully) of this.

[bigkap87]

Experienced you wouldn't happen to be Canadian? ;)

[Experienced]

Experienced you wouldn't happen to be Canadian? ;)Would that matter? Would it change the facts? :cool:

[DonnieMD2B]

We all know there are many (if not most in some humble opinions) are accepted when they shouldn't be. Leaving many who should be accepted... rejected. That's life. We focus on numbers. Height, Weight, Age, Grades, MCAT scores, Stock Market.... (not to mention others)

Anyway, if we all try hard and put forth the necessary effort without any interruptions (for those who face hardships) we will all be called the same thing in the end. Doctor. American, Canadian, Indian, Alien...Who cares. Why does everyone have to be so competitive. There should be more camaraderie in the world.

[miasma]

Why does everyone have to be so competitive. There should be more camaraderie in the world.
true dat.:D

[eljefe]

I graduated from Queen's University shortly before starting Saba in Sept '01 w/ a paltry 2.8 GPA (and even w/ this, things worked out pretty well :D)... I wouldn't worry about your GPA so much. Like anything in medicine, letters of recommendation are everything.

I also believe that the admissions committee would look at a Canadian applicant much more favorably than our US counterparts. When I was on Saba, nearly every Canadian in our class was at the top of our class... Trust me when I say those of us from McGill, Queen's, U of T and UBC are much more competitive than those from random US state schools...

Good luck.Thanks a lot, that makes me feel good....coming from USA.

[eljefe]

Canadians vs. americans again, here come again. Why does this sound so familiar? Oh forgot, I have had lived this before, although I have to give lots of credit to my studying partners from Canada. At least the ones I studied with were helpful and smart....Can we all just get along and help each other in our common goal....