View Full Version : St. Christopher's NOT aprroved by Canada?
thesurgeon1
09-22-2005, 02:30 PM
I just got off the phone with MCC (medical council of canada), and they told me that the college is NOT approved in Canada.
:( sucks i actually wanted to go there
OLDPRO
09-22-2005, 02:52 PM
I just got off the phone with MCC (medical council of canada), and they told me that the college is NOT approved in Canada.
:( sucks i actually wanted to go there
That is not true, We have a lot of Canadians here.They get Canadian loans. St. Chris is a foriegn Medical school with Canada. You got bad infromation!
Licensure in Canada
Graduates of St. Christopher’s College of Medicine may practice medicine in Canada. In order for graduates to qualify for the Licentiate of the Medical Council of Canada (LMCC), a graduate must have passing scores on the Qualifying Examination Part I (QE Part I) and the Qualifying Examination Part II (QE Part II). International medical graduates are also required to have a passing score on the MCC Evaluating Examination (MCCEE) as one of the eligibility criteria for the Qualifying Examination Part I. For more information regarding licensure in Canada, please visit the Medical Council of Canada's website.
Medical Council of Canada
PO Box 8234 Stn T
Ottawa ON Canada K1G 3H7
Telephone: (613) 521-6012
Fax: (613) 521-9417
Website: http://www.mcc.ca/ (http://www.mcc.ca/)
Look I do not work for the school, I'm just a student, this is what I know.
Canada does not regulate foriegn Medical Schools.
A_funsho
09-22-2005, 03:13 PM
Wow!!!!!!!!!!
Bursted homie!:eek:
OLDPRO
09-22-2005, 03:14 PM
I'm at a loss, why would you ask about approval? You go to a WHO listed Foreign medical school, that makes you eligible for Canadian Lic.
If what you said is true then No Doctors from anywhere in the world would be allowed to practice in Canada, including the USA trained Canadians?
azskeptic
09-22-2005, 04:40 PM
I'm at a loss, why would you ask about approval? You go to a WHO listed Foreign medical school, that makes you eligible for Canadian Lic.
If what you said is true then No Doctors from anywhere in the world would be allowed to practice in Canada, including the USA trained Canadians?
another way to do this. Ask this office if your school will be recognized to allow you to come back to Canada if you do a residency in the US
http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/hppb/healthcare/pubs/requirements2005/cat_a_proce.html
I heard from students that AZ is a recruiter for the owner of MUA, Dr. F. Of course he will never admit it.
azskeptic
09-22-2005, 09:43 PM
I heard from students that AZ is a recruiter for the owner of MUA, Dr. F. Of course he will never admit it. anyone who told you that will also sell you quality used cars from New Orleans. I have NEVER talked to any administrator from MUA in any capacity but I see they have students who are licensed. This is the kind of allegation that seems to come from a school recruiter itself...ha ha....amazing. I call whoever told you that a bold faced liar and in fact will donate $10,000 per student to your favorite charity if you can show me working in ANY capacity for MUA-Nevis. In fact you have my permission to call MUA and see if they even know who I am? I doubt it. I don't know them. Come to think of it show me ANY medical school I am working for so I can remind them to pay me...I don't work for any medical schools and have never charged any student for any advice. I am a volunteer here
oldquack
09-22-2005, 10:17 PM
The comment on New Orleans was uncalled for, I think you should retract that.
On the otherhand I also am amazed that anyone would think of AZ as a recruiter for any non american school, it is very funny.
Receiving any consideration whether paid or in kind would result in a contract, which would leave one open for liability if such advice was found to be wanting - Now that would not be a wise course of action- would it AZ!
The exams of Medical Council of Canada are similar to something like USMLE/ECFMG. Passing the exams is one of many steps to get license to practice. I believe that the medical boards of the individual provinces and territories have the final say.
ol' man
09-23-2005, 01:09 AM
Come to think of it show me ANY medical school I am working for so I can remind them to pay me...I don't work for any medical schools and have never charged any student for any advice. I am a volunteer here
I thought you were the dean at Skipper's? Checks not coming through there? lol
azskeptic
09-23-2005, 03:57 AM
I thought you were the dean at Skipper's? Checks not coming through there? lol well, there is that....ha ha
bts4202
09-23-2005, 02:21 PM
Come on people, AZ may be a lot of things, but I doubt he is a paid recruiter for MUA.
To answer the questions about canada:
They have a very very exclusionary system for any non-canadian grads (including true british and american). St. Chris and all other foriegn schools are NOT approved. We must jump through various hoops, including taking the exams dt alluded to, personal interviews, and other things. It is not easy and it is the reason why most canadians who emigrate for medical school plan to move to the US to practice once they are finished. That being said, I do of about a half a dozne st chris grads who are currently doing residencies in different areas of canada.
My suggestion is that if you really want to practice in canada, the only way to be sure of success would be to attend a canadian medical school.
Good luck and I am sorry
anyone who told you that will also sell you quality used cars from New Orleans. I have NEVER talked to any administrator from MUA in any capacity but I see they have students who are licensed. This is the kind of allegation that seems to come from a school recruiter itself...ha ha....amazing. I call whoever told you that a bold faced liar and in fact will donate $10,000 per student to your favorite charity if you can show me working in ANY capacity for MUA-Nevis. In fact you have my permission to call MUA and see if they even know who I am? I doubt it. I don't know them. Come to think of it show me ANY medical school I am working for so I can remind them to pay me...I don't work for any medical schools and have never charged any student for any advice. I am a volunteer here
Former ** students and some teachers stated that you made a visit to London. Your goal was to evaluate the facilities at SCCOM but you never came to the campus. They also stated that you rented a room at the hotel for a conference, during the conference you never asked about SCCOM but offered to help students transfer into MUA. They said you had connections there and can guarantee enrollment.
P.S. I'm sure MUA would admit that you're a paid recruiter...... FYI we have licensed grads also......
azskeptic
09-25-2005, 05:38 AM
Former ** students and some teachers stated that you made a visit to London. Your goal was to evaluate the facilities at SCCOM but you never came to the campus. They also stated that you rented a room at the hotel for a conference, during the conference you never asked about SCCOM but offered to help students transfer into MUA. They said you had connections there and can guarantee enrollment.
P.S. I'm sure MUA would admit that you're a paid recruiter...... FYI we have licensed grads also...... One of the problems you have is your facts.
I know no one at MUA-Nevis and never have talked to them. BUt the students were asking my advice as to which schools they could transfer to if SCCOM falls apart. I gave a speech about checking credentials of schools,etc. By the way I never mentioned MUA I am sure because at that time I didn't know much about it.
You are absolutely lost on your allegation. I did not come out to Luton on that trip;so what? I am a businessman who comes to London every few months.
Take your conspiracy mode if it makes you feel good but my questions about SC are well documented here and it isn't related to me making money off of it. Suppose Picard/Neil C,DT, and other people who question non-UK chartered schools being in the UK are all paid by a school also?
bts4202
09-25-2005, 08:40 AM
Former ** students and some teachers stated that you made a visit to London. Your goal was to evaluate the facilities at SCCOM but you never came to the campus. They also stated that you rented a room at the hotel for a conference, during the conference you never asked about SCCOM but offered to help students transfer into MUA. They said you had connections there and can guarantee enrollment.
P.S. I'm sure MUA would admit that you're a paid recruiter...... FYI we have licensed grads also......
That is a pretty interesting. I do know a couple people who were planning to go to his talk to try and gain some more insight into his motives, so it is not outside of the realm of possibility that people would diseminate what he said.
swimguy23
09-25-2005, 08:51 AM
The comment on New Orleans was uncalled for, I think you should retract that.
why? its not insensitive.....many cars were destroyed. He didnt insult anyone. If hearing about new orleans at all offends you maybe you should seek treatment
azskeptic
09-25-2005, 09:30 AM
That is a pretty interesting. I do know a couple people who were planning to go to his talk to try and gain some more insight into his motives, so it is not outside of the realm of possibility that people would diseminate what he said. Well, if you want I can give you online here my notes from the talk. I answered questions from the students who told me that rumors were floating around that the school might close and theywanted my opinion of schools that might take SC's credits. To be honest at the time I knew of NO schools that would accept transfer credits from SC or Kigezi. COme to think of it, have ANY schools accepted SC students as transfer students and accepted the credits since then?
OLDPRO
09-25-2005, 09:37 AM
Well, if you want I can give you online here my notes from the talk. I answered questions from the students who told me that rumors were floating around that the school might close and theywanted my opinion of schools that might take SC's credits. To be honest at the time I knew of NO schools that would accept transfer credits from SC or Kigezi. COme to think of it, have ANY schools accepted SC students as transfer students and accepted the credits since then?
AZ, I don't why you post questions on things you know, You've been a part of other posts in the past about transfers from SC. Students have been able to transfer to other offshore Medschools in the Carrib and a few to stateside medical schools. I do not see this as important to our disscussion though. It doesn't help anyone really. Transfering Medical Schools is not a good thing to do anyway.
Cheers.
azskeptic
09-25-2005, 09:52 AM
AZ, I don't why you post questions on things you know, You've been a part of other posts in the past about transfers from SC. Students have been able to transfer to other offshore Medschools in the Carrib and a few to stateside medical schools. I do not see this as important to our disscussion though. It doesn't help anyone really. Transfering Medical Schools is not a good thing to do anyway.
Cheers. I am not aware of people transfering and taking their credits with them: I am aware of people transfering but at what cost of their previous study?. I agree transfering is not a good idea. One's transcript will be highly suspicious.
St. Chris should contact the people at this website and get the error corrected in this ad about your school being a UK school
http://www.hyperstudy.com/collegeanduniversitylinks.asp
bts4202
09-25-2005, 10:07 AM
I am not aware of people transfering and taking their credits with them: I am aware of people transfering but at what cost of their previous study?. I agree transfering is not a good idea. One's transcript will be highly suspicious.
I know of several students transfering to US schools and keeping their credit as has been mentioned on here many times. If US schools will accept our credit, then I could care less if AUC does.
BTW, several caribb schools accept our credits, the cali approved ones do not however.
Well, if you want I can give you online here my notes from the talk. I answered questions from the students who told me that rumors were floating around that the school might close and theywanted my opinion of schools that might take SC's credits. To be honest at the time I knew of NO schools that would accept transfer credits from SC or Kigezi. COme to think of it, have ANY schools accepted SC students as transfer students and accepted the credits since then?
The students that spoke with you were there to evaluate your goals or purpose. They all came away with the conclusion that you were there to recruit for MUA. They stated you solicited them to transfer to MUA, your creditability was ruined on campus after they returned. They all had the same story claiming you said "I can guarantee your enrollment at MUA", one student said you offered her an application from MUA. Seems pretty strange to me that you would travel to London and not visit the school especially if that was your purpose. This can be documented by speaking with one of the Pathology instructors and I believe the Pharm instructor was present also and added his 2 cents.
Bottom line AZ = recruiter.......
azskeptic
09-25-2005, 11:10 AM
The students that spoke with you were there to evaluate your goals or purpose. They all came away with the conclusion that you were there to recruit for MUA. They stated you solicited them to transfer to MUA, your creditability was ruined on campus after they returned. They all had the same story claiming you said "I can guarantee your enrollment at MUA", one student said you offered her an application from MUA. Seems pretty strange to me that you would travel to London and not visit the school especially if that was your purpose. This can be documented by speaking with one of the Pathology instructors and I believe the Pharm instructor was present also and added his 2 cents.
Bottom line AZ = recruiter.......Actually I was there visiting some medical schools while wired for a news special that is being done on diploma mills. I will call ANYONE who told you that story a liar to their face. Never happened and pure fantasy. I was NOT there to visit Luton. application? unbelievable. Path/pharm instructors are obviously passing a rumor on. Never happened.
azskeptic
09-25-2005, 11:16 AM
I know of several students transfering to US schools and keeping their credit as has been mentioned on here many times. If US schools will accept our credit, then I could care less if AUC does.
BTW, several caribb schools accept our credits, the cali approved ones do not however. Those who transfer into a US university who went originally to an unapproved school can not license in California incidentally. Even if you transfer to Harvard or Yale Med Schools.
OLDPRO
09-25-2005, 11:22 AM
Those who transfer into a US university who went originally to an unapproved school can not license in California incidentally. Even if you transfer to Harvard or Yale Med Schools.
Look I would agree with you on that, but in the past others have done it.
It looks like we do not make the policies as much as we would like to.
I'm not saying go to a Cali unapproved school transfer credits to an approved school and you will be Lic in Cali, but it has happened before.
This Cali stuff is OT a little though. We have never said you can get Lic in Cali.
OLDPRO
09-25-2005, 11:25 AM
I am not aware of people transfering and taking their credits with them: I am aware of people transfering but at what cost of their previous study?. I agree transfering is not a good idea. One's transcript will be highly suspicious.
St. Chris should contact the people at this website and get the error corrected in this ad about your school being a UK school
http://www.hyperstudy.com/collegeanduniversitylinks.asp
Yea the description is missleading, It is not "A UK University". I can mention it to them but I'm a student there don't know how much they will listen.
bts4202
09-25-2005, 11:28 AM
Those who transfer into a US university who went originally to an unapproved school can not license in California incidentally. Even if you transfer to Harvard or Yale Med Schools.
yeah, no current student of st chris or anyone using st chris credits can be licnesed in cali.. ever... that has been well documented... no surprise. But you asked if anyone accepts st chris credits and several US medical schools have said they will happily accept their credeits. So have some caribb schools for that matter.
The students that spoke with you were there to evaluate your goals or purpose. They all came away with the conclusion that you were there to recruit for MUA. They stated you solicited them to transfer to MUA, your creditability was ruined on campus after they returned. They all had the same story claiming you said "I can guarantee your enrollment at MUA", one student said you offered her an application from MUA. Seems pretty strange to me that you would travel to London and not visit the school especially if that was your purpose. This can be documented by speaking with one of the Pathology instructors and I believe the Pharm instructor was present also and added his 2 cents.
were the students and faculty wired like AZ says he was? I would enjoy reading the transcripts fo those conversations!
yeah, no current student of st chris or anyone using st chris credits can be licnesed in cali.. ever... that has been well documented... no surprise. But you asked if anyone accepts st chris credits and several US medical schools have said they will happily accept their credeits. So have some caribb schools for that matter.
were the students and faculty wired like AZ says he was? I would enjoy reading the transcripts fo those conversations!
Why would anyone wear a wire????? do you think I could borrow it for my meeting with Krishna??????
bts4202
09-25-2005, 11:56 AM
Why would anyone wear a wire????? do you think I could borrow it for my meeting with Krishna??????
hahaha, yeah, well I agree, who the heck would wear a wire?
azskeptic
09-25-2005, 12:17 PM
hahaha, yeah, well I agree, who the heck would wear a wire? Wait for the show and you'll see why I had a wire on at the diploma mill schools.
I am going to speak about this experience and offshore schools at a major event in the spring with thousands of attendees as their invited guest. I'll be sure all know about it when it is up and posted on the net.
Wait for the show and you'll see why I had a wire on at the diploma mill schools.
I am going to speak about this experience and offshore schools at a major event in the spring with thousands of attendees as their invited guest. I'll be sure all know about it when it is up and posted on the net.
Why would you wear a wire, wouldn't your word be good enough? if you are who you say you are??????
By the way don't you sell eggs or something? what credentials or experience do you have to evaluate a medical program????????
azskeptic
09-25-2005, 03:01 PM
Why would you wear a wire, wouldn't your word be good enough? if you are who you say you are??????
By the way don't you sell eggs or something? what credentials or experience do you have to evaluate a medical program???????? There are shows that use wires like this. Basically it is to show what some med schools are telling prospective parents of children considering going to an offshore school. They block out the faces of the Deans of the school but it will be televised.
I don't evaluate medical schools. That is the problem....who does? My volunteer work is to change that. Offshore schools, like US schools, should be evaluated by the same standards.
I am in the egg business and also an author (first book being released in October) but in the absence of a program someone needs to volunteer and I'm it at this point., Hopefully with my work will come some govt. oversite which seems to be happening. I have spoke in front of all of the administrators of state medical boards, am the Moderator of the State licensing forum on valuemd, and talk with state boards frequently at their request.
How did you end up in a non-UK chartered medical school in the UK, while we are sharing backgrounds.
bts4202
09-25-2005, 03:17 PM
am the Moderator of the State licensing forum on valuemd,
hahahahahaha, oh wow, you are def qualified.. our bad.
OLDPRO
09-25-2005, 03:19 PM
There are shows that use wires like this. Basically it is to show what some med schools are telling prospective parents of children considering going to an offshore school. They block out the faces of the Deans of the school but it will be televised.
I don't evaluate medical schools. That is the problem....who does? My volunteer work is to change that. Offshore schools, like US schools, should be evaluated by the same standards.
I am in the egg business and also an author (first book being released in October) but in the absence of a program someone needs to volunteer and I'm it at this point., Hopefully with my work will come some govt. oversite which seems to be happening. I have spoke in front of all of the administrators of state medical boards, am the Moderator of the State licensing forum on valuemd, and talk with state boards frequently at their request.
How did you end up in a non-UK chartered medical school in the UK, while we are sharing backgrounds.
I whole heartly dissagree with you, Medical Schools outside of the USA are attracting students because of the over regulation mess, yes mess of the system in the USA. What right does the US have to tell the rest of the world how to run a medical school? What makes the standards better in the US? We still have Doctors who went to US medical schools who are sued due to malpractice and we have Doctors who are not that good at what they do who are US trained. There are also Doctors in the US who are in the top of their fields who went to other medical schools outside the US.
There is a way to know if someone is qualified out of Medschool, it is called the USLME. Everyone takes it. Also Residency in the US.
(Perhaps Some of us should get together after we are Doctors and put together a paper on this to give to the Federation of state medical boards., If AZ can do it with little expertise our voice should be loud and clear!)
azskeptic
09-25-2005, 03:23 PM
I whole heartly dissagree with you, Medical Schools outside of the USA are attracting students because of the over regulation mess, yes mess of the system in the USA. What right does the US have to tell the rest of the world how to run a medical school? What makes the standards better in the US? We still have Doctors who went to US medical schools who are sued due to malpractice and we have Doctors who are not that good at what they do who are US trained. There are also Doctors in the US who are in the top of their fields who went to other medical schools outside the US.
There is a way to know if someone is qualified out of Medschool, it is called the USLME. Everyone takes it. Also Residency in the US. But the laws in most states require equivalency of education in addition to you passing the exams. US only has a right to set standards for doctors coming here....if one wants to practice elsewhere obviously they must meet the local standards there.
azskeptic
OLDPRO
09-25-2005, 03:33 PM
But the laws in most states require equivalency of education in addition to you passing the exams. US only has a right to set standards for doctors coming here....if one wants to practice elsewhere obviously they must meet the local standards there.
azskeptic
Yes equivalent, but who decides what is equivalent? St. Chris has a US style curriculum. We cannot have cadavers on the school grounds so we have Anatomy lab in London. Is that it? Wow the students travel to London to go to class. Is there some kinda crazy rule of how far the classes can be? Officials fly over to Luton to oversee the school. Officials fly all over the state (TX, CALI, ect.) to oversee the Medical schools. Hmm seems the same. Students attend at least 80% of class time hmm good rule.
So what are you fighting for? Our school is equivalent. Our grads have been lic and sit for step 1 to 3. They get residency. Why do you fight against a good school? Why come here and start something all the time? WHy make phone calls and write letters? There are so many other schools with tremendous problems out there. St. Chris has worked hard to evolve into the good school it now is.
The US and the World is about to face the biggest shortage of Doctors ever seen. What will you do when your neighbors and loved ones can't get the health care they need cause you helped to stop more people from becoming
Doctors? Believe me the old will outnumber the young.
It's happing now.
Good luck.
azskeptic
09-25-2005, 03:42 PM
That's not what you stated, you wrote there should be some kinda of regulation on offshore schools. There is by the country of charter.
So what are you fighting for? Our school is equivalent. Our grads have been lic and sit for step 1 to 3. They get residency. Why do you fight against a good school? Why come here and start something all the time? WHy make phone calls and write letters? There are so many other schools with tremendous problems out there. St. Chris has worked hard to evolve into the good school it now is.
The US and the World is about to face the biggest shortage of Doctors ever seen. What will you do when your neighbors and loved ones can't get the health care they need cause you helped to stop more people from becoming
Doctors? Believe me the old will outnumber the young.
It's happing now.
Good luck.
1. Your school is not chartered in the UK and is there without govt. supervision of your educational process. The UK says it doesn't have power over you since you are not registered as a medical school under their law but rather under the Senegal laws.
2. Read the NJ article which raised big questions about St. CHris's legitimacy.
3. Is your school equivalent? I don't know. Suppose we'll find out when the NY inspection is through. WHat have you heard? Have they been to Senegal yet? Thats the point...in the absence of govt. oversight questions are asked.
St. CHris isn't the only school I have raised questions about. I raised questions about Kigezi (now gone), St. Luke (now gone), UHSA, IUHS, schools in St. Lucia, Montserrat.
We need doctors indeed in the US; properly trained doctors who are equivalent to US/Canadian trained medical school graduates.
azskeptic
OLDPRO
09-25-2005, 03:49 PM
1. Your school is not chartered in the UK and is there without govt. supervision of your educational process. The UK says it doesn't have power over you since you are not registered as a medical school under their law but rather under the Senegal laws.
2. Read the NJ article which raised big questions about St. CHris's legitimacy.
3. Is your school equivalent? I don't know. Suppose we'll find out when the NY inspection is through. WHat have you heard? Have they been to Senegal yet? Thats the point...in the absence of govt. oversight questions are asked.
St. CHris isn't the only school I have raised questions about. I raised questions about Kigezi (now gone), St. Luke (now gone), UHSA, IUHS, schools in St. Lucia, Montserrat.
We need doctors indeed in the US; properly trained doctors who are equivalent to US/Canadian trained medical school graduates.
azskeptic
You just got to post this for, I don't know how many times now. You should debate this in your own forum I think.
Senegal comes here 4 times a year at least. I've been at the school for over 9 months now and they have been here 3 times. How many Times do the schools in the US get visited by US officials?
I do not want to disscuss the article from NJ, the school was trying to do something positive but due to some "jumping of the gun" that is what happened. It would have been okay if it was after NY approval. NJ would follow I would think. So, yes a mistake IMO.
Nebakanezer
09-26-2005, 01:10 AM
I am a businessman who comes to London every few months. You are a businessman? What are you in the business of? I thought you were on disability? If you are capable of participating in business, doesn't this preclude you from claiming disability?
On a side note, can anyone imagine AZ doing investigative work in person? HAHAHA, I haven't laughed this hard in a long time. It's not like AZ is an inconspicuous person. If anyone couldn't pick AZ out of a crowd, they'd have to be blind!
azskeptic
09-26-2005, 04:13 AM
You are a businessman? What are you in the business of? I thought you were on disability? If you are capable of participating in business, doesn't this preclude you from claiming disability?
On a side note, can anyone imagine AZ doing investigative work in person? HAHAHA, I haven't laughed this hard in a long time. It's not like AZ is an inconspicuous person. If anyone couldn't pick AZ out of a crowd, they'd have to be blind! WHile I am not disabled(legal definition)and am a successful businessman, what difference would it make if I was? When you see the television show that was shot, you'll see how smart medical school people can be.
Again, another SC rumor not true. SC appears to be a rumor mill that doesn't have very good information. What's up with that? If you are going to take it to the personal level you probably should do more research because it makes you look like you have size/age biases. Guaranteed to take you a long way in your future profession of taking care of your elders as a physician.
azskeptic
09-26-2005, 04:23 AM
http://www.passusa.org/index-3.html
Medical Student/Resident Improvement Program
PASS provides a unique student or resident physician personality assessment process. This process determines physician personality characteristics that lead to problems in the medical workplace. This service is priced affordably and sensitive to the medical teaching institution's needs; the results are available quickly. PASS also provides customized individualized comprehensive analysis of either medical students or residents at the client's request.
1. Your school is not chartered in the UK and is there without govt. supervision of your educational process. The UK says it doesn't have power over you since you are not registered as a medical school under their law but rather under the Senegal laws.
2. Read the NJ article which raised big questions about St. CHris's legitimacy.
3. Is your school equivalent? I don't know. Suppose we'll find out when the NY inspection is through. WHat have you heard? Have they been to Senegal yet? Thats the point...in the absence of govt. oversight questions are asked.
St. CHris isn't the only school I have raised questions about. I raised questions about Kigezi (now gone), St. Luke (now gone), UHSA, IUHS, schools in St. Lucia, Montserrat.
Are you saying that Caribbean governments oversee the Caribbean programs. I'm not sure any of these islands even have a department of education??????
I have one for AZ to investigate, I have a friend who graduated from a Caribbean program (approved in NY & CA). He was denied licensure in a specific pain in the backside state. This state contacted the Dutch govenment who replied he isn't eligible for licensure in their country and that the island he studied on is NOT a country. My challenge to AZ is: why don't you call up the Dutch government and fine out what grads are and are not eligible to practice in their country???????????
We need doctors indeed in the US; properly trained doctors who are equivalent to US/Canadian trained medical school graduates.
azskeptic
We need doctors indeed in the US; properly trained doctors who are equivalent to US/Canadian trained medical school graduates.
azskeptic[/QUOTE]
Here it is again:
Are you saying that Caribbean governments oversee the Caribbean programs. I'm not sure any of these islands even have a department of education??????
I have one for AZ to investigate, I have a friend who graduated from a Caribbean program (approved in NY & CA). He was denied licensure in a specific pain in the backside state. This state contacted the Dutch govenment who replied he isn't eligible for licensure in their country and that the island he studied on is NOT a country. I know this for a fact, I say the letter. My challenge to AZ is: why don't you call up the Dutch government and fine out what grads are and are not eligible to practice in their country???????????
There are shows that use wires like this. Basically it is to show what some med schools are telling prospective parents of children considering going to an offshore school. They block out the faces of the Deans of the school but it will be televised.
I don't evaluate medical schools. That is the problem....who does? My volunteer work is to change that. Offshore schools, like US schools, should be evaluated by the same standards.
I am in the egg business and also an author (first book being released in October) but in the absence of a program someone needs to volunteer and I'm it at this point., Hopefully with my work will come some govt. oversite which seems to be happening. I have spoke in front of all of the administrators of state medical boards, am the Moderator of the State licensing forum on valuemd, and talk with state boards frequently at their request.
How did you end up in a non-UK chartered medical school in the UK, while we are sharing backgrounds.
New Eval system: All schools will be given one of the following designations>
Grade A extra extra large
Grade A extra large
Grade A large
Grade A medium
Grade A small
Extra extra large (Not grade A)
Extra large
Large
Medium
Small
Instead of the eggman your new handle should be Humpty Dumpty....
azskeptic
09-26-2005, 10:38 AM
Here it is again:
Are you saying that Caribbean governments oversee the Caribbean programs. I'm not sure any of these islands even have a department of education??????
I have one for AZ to investigate, I have a friend who graduated from a Caribbean program (approved in NY & CA). He was denied licensure in a specific pain in the backside state. This state contacted the Dutch govenment who replied he isn't eligible for licensure in their country and that the island he studied on is NOT a country. I know this for a fact, I say the letter. My challenge to AZ is: why don't you call up the Dutch government and fine out what grads are and are not eligible to practice in their country???????????
explanation of system
http://www.emanet.org/postgraduate/Netherl.html
contact on the actual board he needs to communicate with is:
http://www.onderzoekinformatie.nl/en/oi/nod/organisatie/ORG1234829/
azskeptic
09-26-2005, 10:40 AM
New Eval system: All schools will be given one of the following designations>
Grade A extra extra large
Grade A extra large
Grade A large
Grade A medium
Grade A small
Extra extra large (Not grade A)
Extra large
Large
Medium
Small
Instead of the eggman your new handle should be Humpty Dumpty.... You also have inedible eggs (these are eggs that are judged not fit for human consumption) we would need to add.
Can't take the handle Humpty Dumpty. It is trademarked by a company in Wisconsin already and they have successfuly defended their trademark.
Nebakanezer
09-26-2005, 12:01 PM
You didn't answer my question of what business you are in. Trying to dodge it?
Also, I'm not age/size biased. I'm azskeptic bias.
If you want to talk about bias, we should discuss your SC bias.
WHile I am not disabled(legal definition)and am a successful businessman, what difference would it make if I was? When you see the television show that was shot, you'll see how smart medical school people can be.
Again, another SC rumor not true. SC appears to be a rumor mill that doesn't have very good information. What's up with that? If you are going to take it to the personal level you probably should do more research because it makes you look like you have size/age biases. Guaranteed to take you a long way in your future profession of taking care of your elders as a physician.
azskeptic
09-26-2005, 12:04 PM
You didn't answer my question of what business you are in. Trying to dodge it?
Also, I'm not age/size biased, I'm azskeptic biased. Ok, infiniteUni here is my webpage
www.eggman.cc (http://www.eggman.cc)
Tell us about your business experience and background since we are into sharing.
azskeptic
A_funsho
09-26-2005, 12:42 PM
with all due respect, why are you so concerned about st chris? you are into agriculture, why would you take a particular interest in med school so much? Why does it bother you? St chris is not a straight forward school, they lack info.blah.blah..blah. why don't you just let those attending the school find that out themselves and deal with their problems.......afterall is not like you know these people.
I am really worried why you cared so much. You have your own business for God sake!
azskeptic
09-26-2005, 12:51 PM
with all due respect, why are you so concerned about st chris? you are into agriculture, why would you take a particular interest in med school so much? Why does it bother you? St chris is not a straight forward school, they lack info.blah.blah..blah. why don't you just let those attending the school find that out themselves and deal with their problems.......afterall is not like you know these people.
I am really worried why you cared so much. You have your own business for God sake! I've been a volunteer in working on healthfraud and quackery issues for 10 years also. Some people play golf: I fight fraud. I ask questions.
azkskeptic
A_funsho
09-26-2005, 01:09 PM
and this is how you go about fighting fraud? On the internet? Am guessing you have an office dedicated to fighting this war with you.
azskeptic
09-26-2005, 01:11 PM
and this is how you go about fighting fraud? On the internet? Am guessing you have an office dedicated to fighting this war with you. Yes, I have an office,overlooking the 4 peak mountains, and interface with other agencies involved in health issues. Your point?
A_funsho
09-26-2005, 01:25 PM
my point is that you waste so much time doing something that isn't really worth your time. I read alittle about your web page just incase am wrong but no...i don't think i am. First of all, you are one dimensional, you see things one way and close your mind on other possibilities. I don't know what the real deal is about this volunteering work of yours you claim to have in addition to your egg company.
fighting healthfraud and quackery...and you thought fake offshore school is where there is a major problem. It's more of a personal issue for you than just help saving the prospective student from bad school.
about the senegal comment, that is an example of how one dimensional you are when it comes to medicine and the truth is you might have being in the so called fraud fighting game for the amount of years you claim but you sure don't have any idea about medicine itself you just think you do.
azskeptic
09-26-2005, 01:29 PM
my point is that you waste so much time doing something that isn't really worth your time. I read alittle about your web page just incase am wrong but no...i don't think i am. First of all, you are one dimensional, you see things one way and close your mind on other possibilities. I don't know what the real deal is about this volunteering work of yours you claim to have in addition to your egg company.
fighting healthfraud and quackery...and you thought fake offshore school is where there is a major problem. It's more of a personal issue for you than just help saving the prospective student from bad school.
about the senegal comment, that is an example of how one dimensional you are when it comes to medicine and the truth is you might have being in the so called fraud fighting game for the amount of years you claim but you sure don't have any idea about medicine itself you just think you do.since you will begin medical school in January you can help teach others about the process.
I make no claims about knowledge of medicine; I do have experience in looking at the state licensing issue and have spoken in front of all of the Boards at the AIM meeting last year and will be addressing a different but larger group next spring at their request. I correspond with most of the state medical and foreign country boards so I do learn a bit on the fly.
Good luck.
explanation of system
http://www.emanet.org/postgraduate/Netherl.html
contact on the actual board he needs to communicate with is:
http://www.onderzoekinformatie.nl/en/oi/nod/organisatie/ORG1234829/
What I'm saying is that grads from most Caribbean Islands are NOT eligible for licensure in the country of origin. Based upon this info a friend of my family was DENIED licensure in a specific state. So yes you supplied the web sites for medical licensure requirements but it doesn't state eligibility. This sounds like a research opportunity for you with the ability to expand your offshore medical knowledge. All you have to do is make some phone calls and inquire about medical programs in the Netherland Antillies.
Here's your change to prove that you are not a recruiter with some unBIAS reporting.
It's put up or SHUT UP.
azskeptic
09-28-2005, 10:22 AM
What I'm saying is that grads from most Caribbean Islands are NOT eligible for licensure in the country of origin. Based upon this info a friend of my family was DENIED licensure in a specific state. So yes you supplied the web sites for medical licensure requirements but it doesn't state eligibility. This sounds like a research opportunity for you with the ability to expand your offshore medical knowledge. All you have to do is make some phone calls and inquire about medical programs in the Netherland Antillies.
Here's your change to prove that you are not a recruiter with some unBIAS reporting.
It's put up or SHUT UP. I'll supply the info but individuals affected need to do the checking because that is the way they should check what is real. I've put up.
I'll supply the info but individuals affected need to do the checking because that is the way they should check what is real. I've put up.
If that was the case they why did you Personally make the phone call to Canada about SCCOM??????????????????????????????????????????
Seems you have a bias opinion, or can I say a vested interest (recruiter).
Why won't you personally make the phone call about programs in the N.A.?????????????????????????????????????????????? ??????????????
It's seems to me you are talking "out the side of your mouth" an expression from my neighborhood. We all know what that means.............
Like I said "PUT UP OR SHUT UP" and you're not will to put up are you?
azskeptic
09-28-2005, 10:59 AM
If that was the case they why did you Personally make the phone call to Canada about SCCOM??????????????????????????????????????????
Seems you have a bias opinion, or can I say a vested interest (recruiter).
Why won't you personally make the phone call about programs in the N.A.?????????????????????????????????????????????? ??????????????
It's seems to me you are talking "out the side of your mouth" an expression from my neighborhood. We all know what that means.............
Like I said "PUT UP OR SHUT UP" and you're not will to put up are you?
Again, I know the answers to these questions about N.A. you ask but the students need to do it for themselves. I am not a recruiter but I am an informed consumer. Incidentally which island did the person go to school because there are different laws for different parts of N.A. I checked on SC because you can't believe what they tell you and particular students asked me to check for them which I did. If your friend wants to contact me I'll help them personally do the research and we'll post the results here on valuemd.
tanisha
09-28-2005, 11:03 AM
azkeptic please shut up and sit down.
azskeptic
09-28-2005, 11:06 AM
azkeptic please shut up and sit down. Be appropriate or you'll end up warned.
A_funsho
09-28-2005, 11:07 AM
:) :D :D :D :D :D
LOL. This is hilarious!!!!!!!
bts4202
09-28-2005, 03:03 PM
azkeptic please shut up and sit down.
only thing tanisha has said that I agree with.. lol
Again, I know the answers to these questions about N.A. you ask but the students need to do it for themselves. I am not a recruiter but I am an informed consumer. Incidentally which island did the person go to school because there are different laws for different parts of N.A. I checked on SC because you can't believe what they tell you and particular students asked me to check for them which I did. If your friend wants to contact me I'll help them personally do the research and we'll post the results here on valuemd.
What Bull, "I already know" if you do inform us. If students need to do it for themselves why are you calling Canada? Here's your chance to do what you say you do "inform us". Or is there some reason you don't want to say it?????
azskeptic
09-28-2005, 07:48 PM
What Bull, "I already know" if you do inform us. If students need to do it for themselves why are you calling Canada? Here's your chance to do what you say you do "inform us". Or is there some reason you don't want to say it????? No taunting..have your student friend contact me at deanhughson@gmail.com and I'll walk them through the process. I talk to Canada so not atypical for me to call them. I'll help any student who wants to help themselves.
No taunting..have your student friend contact me at deanhughson@gmail.com and I'll walk them through the process. I talk to Canada so not atypical for me to call them. I'll help any student who wants to help themselves.
AZ = Recruiter, enough said
azskeptic
09-28-2005, 08:29 PM
AZ = Recruiter, enough said There you go...you answered your question so no need to discuss any further. ha ha ha ha
Ah, azskeptic... after all this time, people have not yet determined that you are financially secure and are able to support your hobbies. Think they will make good doctors if they cant pick up subtle signs???
lol
azskeptic
09-28-2005, 10:17 PM
Ah, azskeptic... after all this time, people have not yet determined that you are financially secure and are able to support your hobbies. Think they will make good doctors if they cant pick up subtle signs???
lol Well, my kids don't understand my hobbies either but its ok. ha ha..
bts4202
09-28-2005, 10:40 PM
AZ = Recruiter, enough said
If only one perso came back from that meeting making this claim, then I could discount it as **. If it was only 2 people, then I would just think they conspired to lie and make him look bad. However, multiple people including proffessors all heard the same thing and relay the exact same story?? Some people may find it hard to ignore that as pure coincidence.
TAFKA
09-29-2005, 07:30 AM
edited to remove text
azskeptic
09-29-2005, 07:37 AM
In my opinion, the most compelling evidence that AZ is something other than he claims to be is that the ONLY thing he can offer a licensing authority, hospital, medical school, or anyone else is a google search. The idea of paying someone to share information that any moron in an internet cafe can find is just a little too far-fetched. However, the notion that he is a recruiter for MUA-Nevis is entirely unsubstantiated as far as I can tell. Again, in my opinion, he is probably just some guy with nothing but time and loneliness on his hands who found an online community willing to embrace him because everyone's petrified about not getting good clerkships, about not matching, or about not being able to practice in the state/country they want. Unfortunately, I doubt that this makes him harmless, though. The more scandal there is, the more people "need" someone like him and my guess is that he'd do anything to feel needed, including making false allegations to our trainig hospitals, state and federal licensing authorities, the AMA, AMSA, ECFMG, GMC, NHS, etc.... Not lonely but thanks for the evaluation. I am doing this because someone needs to do it. When a govt. agency is convinced to do it I'll go on to another project. There are quite a few people working on different parts of offshore medical education problems and all are volunteers that I can see. There are NO false allegations made--only factual materials can be used by licensing authorities.
Not lonely but thanks for the evaluation. I am doing this because someone needs to do it. When a govt. agency is convinced to do it I'll go on to another project. There are quite a few people working on different parts of offshore medical education problems and all are volunteers that I can see. There are NO false allegations made--only factual materials can be used by licensing authorities.
I love the statement "Factual materials" explain to me why my friend received a letter stating that he needed to be eligible for licensure in the COUNTRY of charter and that the Netherland Antillies is not a country. How long will it be before other states pick up on this and use this to exclude Caribbean grads???????????????
Or is this a topic you don't want to address because it will affect your recruitment efforts for MUA (located in the N.A.).
azskeptic
09-29-2005, 11:59 AM
I love the statement "Factual materials" explain to me why my friend received a letter stating that he needed to be eligible for licensure in the COUNTRY of charter and that the Netherland Antillies is not a country. How long will it be before other states pick up on this and use this to exclude Caribbean grads???????????????
Or is this a topic you don't want to address because it will affect your recruitment efforts for MUA (located in the N.A.). Am in touch with govt. agencies and asked for documentation. Will post it here when I get it back.
Am in touch with govt. agencies and asked for documentation. Will post it here when I get it back.
Maybe you can inform us which agencies and what contact phone numbers or addresses you used. I would also like to know the questions you have posed and what information you are trying to obtain.
azskeptic
09-29-2005, 06:39 PM
Maybe you can inform us which agencies and what contact phone numbers or addresses you used. I would also like to know the questions you have posed and what information you are trying to obtain. Either you do it or I do it. I did it through some official govt channels, agency to agency. Will share what I am told when I get it. Why don't you try it also? I gave you info on who to contact in the Dutch govt. if you want.
bts4202
09-29-2005, 06:41 PM
Either you do it or I do it. I did it through some official govt channels, agency to agency. Will share what I am told when I get it. Why don't you try it also? I gave you info on who to contact in the Dutch govt. if you want.
"agency to angency"? would you be so kind as to explain exactley which "agency" you are with?
azskeptic
09-29-2005, 06:43 PM
"agency to angency"? would you be so kind as to explain exactley which "agency" you are with? I am friendly with many agencies and one of them is helping me. I find govt. agencies respond better to other govt. agencies.
bts4202
09-29-2005, 06:46 PM
I am friendly with many agencies and one of them is helping me. I find govt. agencies respond better to other govt. agencies.
interesting. I think I know of a few agency's i need to start becoming friendly with.. hehe.
teratos
09-29-2005, 06:51 PM
I love the statement "Factual materials" explain to me why my friend received a letter stating that he needed to be eligible for licensure in the COUNTRY of charter and that the Netherland Antillies is not a country. How long will it be before other states pick up on this and use this to exclude Caribbean grads???????????????
Or is this a topic you don't want to address because it will affect your recruitment efforts for MUA (located in the N.A.).
I would bet that people more knowledgeable on the topic of sovereignty have already figured that one out.....;)
teratos
09-29-2005, 06:54 PM
What I'm saying is that grads from most Caribbean Islands are NOT eligible for licensure in the country of origin. Based upon this info a friend of my family was DENIED licensure in a specific state. So yes you supplied the web sites for medical licensure requirements but it doesn't state eligibility. This sounds like a research opportunity for you with the ability to expand your offshore medical knowledge. All you have to do is make some phone calls and inquire about medical programs in the Netherland Antillies.
Here's your change to prove that you are not a recruiter with some unBIAS reporting.
It's put up or SHUT UP.
Which state? I went to school in the Netherland Antilles. By international law, they are allowed to grant charters. I guess next thing you tell us, people who go to (LCME accredited) med schools in Puerto Rico are not allowed to be licensed because Puerto Rico is a territory and not a country? Gimme a break. G
Which state? I went to school in the Netherland Antilles. By international law, they are allowed to grant charters. I guess next thing you tell us, people who go to (LCME accredited) med schools in Puerto Rico are not allowed to be licensed because Puerto Rico is a territory and not a country? Gimme a break. G
I am sorry but I guess international law only applies if you get an international medical license. Each state is responsible for setting their own requirements for medical licensure. Most state laws say that a school needs to be LCME accredited not LCME accredited in the US, that is why any programs in Puerto Rico are accredited.
teratos
09-30-2005, 08:37 AM
I am sorry but I guess international law only applies if you get an international medical license. Each state is responsible for setting their own requirements for medical licensure. Most state laws say that a school needs to be LCME accredited not LCME accredited in the US, that is why any programs in Puerto Rico are accredited.
The LCME only accredits programs in the US and Cananda. They won't even consider the Caribbean. AUC is located in the Netherland Antilles, we have people licensed in all 50 states. G
azskeptic
09-30-2005, 09:35 AM
I am sorry but I guess international law only applies if you get an international medical license. Each state is responsible for setting their own requirements for medical licensure. Most state laws say that a school needs to be LCME accredited not LCME accredited in the US, that is why any programs in Puerto Rico are accredited. As this topic isn't about St. CHris I will post my results I have found on the State Licensing forum shortly. It is very interesting.
OLDPRO
09-30-2005, 10:08 AM
the FSMB is working on something...i don't think anybody really has any great insight as to what the outcome may be, though.
it is prob a smart move to go to a CA approved school simply because it is the toughest state to get. being good to go in CA will only be good. the non-approved schools likely will always be good somewhere. but, it is pretty foolish to be limiting yourself in this way, IMHO.
hey, azskeptic, any news from FSMB?
Still studying......report to come later..I'll keep everyone notified. My take....will take some time but something is definitely coming down the pike either from FSMB or CARICOM
__________________
Moderator - State Licensing Forum
If this is what you are talking about, It won't happen for some time or never, It would federalize the Lic of MD in the USA, that won't happen as far as I know. States like their rights!
If this is what you are talking about, It won't happen for some time or never, It would federalize the Lic of MD in the USA, that won't happen as far as I know. States like their rights!
My point isn't to attack or discredit any programs in the N.A. We all know that state licensure boards can change their rules at any time with out notice to you, me or the schools. We also know where we once had licensure can be lost in a moments notice. My goal was to show the Bias that AZ has for SCCOM. This along with his actions and lack of action proves that he is a recruiter for MUA simply put and that his credibality is virtually zero. He claims to be in contact and working thru government agencies like some secret agent, all a little unbelievable for me.
AZ, FYI this message will self destruct 5 seconds after you read it.
azskeptic
09-30-2005, 10:29 AM
My point isn't to attack or discredit any programs in the N.A. We all know that state licensure boards can change their rules at any time with out notice to you, me or the schools. We also know where we once had licensure can be lost in a moments notice. My goal was to show the Bias that AZ has for SCCOM. This along with his actions and lack of action proves that he is a recruiter for MUA simply put and that his credibality is virtually zero. He claims to be in contact and working thru government agencies like some secret agent, all a little unbelievable for me.
AZ, FYI this message will self destruct 5 seconds after you read it. As usual one can see the tag team approach to not wanting to talk about the issues comes from you and your team,not me. Those who want to see the results later today will on the State Licensing forum. But your question had nothing to do with SC? Curious attack from you. While we are into challenges why not call MUA-Nevis and find out for yourself if I work for them or even have ever talked to any of them? That should be easy. Easier to take the Joe McCarthy approach though. "I have a listing of millions of communists" he said as he held up the Moscow yellow pages.
bts4202
09-30-2005, 02:18 PM
While we are into challenges why not call MUA-Nevis and find out for yourself if I work for them or even have ever talked to any of them? That should be easy. Easier to take the Joe McCarthy approach though. "I have a listing of millions of communists" he said as he held up the Moscow yellow pages.
oh yeah, that sounds like a worthwhile idea :rolleyes:. Thats like asking Al Capone if he cheats on his taxes and expecting an honest response.
As usual one can see the tag team approach to not wanting to talk about the issues comes from you and your team,not me. Those who want to see the results later today will on the State Licensing forum. But your question had nothing to do with SC? Curious attack from you. While we are into challenges why not call MUA-Nevis and find out for yourself if I work for them or even have ever talked to any of them? That should be easy. Easier to take the Joe McCarthy approach though. "I have a listing of millions of communists" he said as he held up the Moscow yellow pages.
OK, I called MUA, they admitted that AZ is a recruiter for their program. They said they were sorry and that all the students AZ recruited will be returned to their original programs. Oh ya, they also said they would never do it again. ;) ;)
OK, I called MUA, they admitted that AZ is a recruiter for their program. They said they were sorry and that all the students AZ recruited will be returned to their original programs. Oh ya, they also said they would never do it again. ;) ;)
The silence is defining
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