Russian Med Schools 2004 ranking

[Mikhail]

Top 15 national medical schools in 2004 Ranking from The Ministry of Education
(out of 47, not including medical faculties at classic universities)

1. Moscow Medical Academy
2-3. Moscow State University of Medicine and Dentistry
2-3. Russian State Medical University (Moscow)
4. St Petersburg State Medical University
5. Siberian State Medical University (Tomsk)
6. Ryazan’ State Medical University
7-9. Volgograd State Medical University
7-9. Novosibirsk State Medical Academy
7-9. St Petersburg State Medical Academy
10-12. Bashkir State Medical University (Ufa)
10-12. Kuban’ State Medical Academy (Krasnodar)
10-12. Nizhnii Novgorod State Medical Academy
13-16. Kazan’ State Medical University
13-16. St Petersburg State Pediatric Medical Academy
13-16. Smolensk State Medical Academy
13-16. Tver’ State Medical Academy

To my knowledge programs in English are available from the following schools: #1, #2, #3 (postgraduate only), #4, #6, #7, #9, #12, #13 (?), #14, #16.

Here is the positions of classic universities having medical faculties:
1. Moscow State University
2-3. St Petersburg State University
4-5. People Friendship University (Moscow)
6. Tomsk State University
7. Nizhnii Novgorod State University
8. Rostov State University
9-10. Kazan’ State University

The following criteria were taken into consideration: qualification of staff, number of students, number of international students, students/professor ratio, research activities, publishing activity, hostels, hospitals, etc.

Good Luck,
Mikhail

[blueeyes]

Is there any way to objectively compare clinical training at Russian schools like MSU and MMA with other European or North American schools? I don't want to start any sort of flame war. It's just that I've heard a lot of conflicting things and I'm trying to make sense of it all.

I'm curious because I used to be really interested in Physics and MSU was a theoretical Physics powerhouse. But the state of health care in Russia right now makes me more than a little suspicious for Medicine.

[drtintin]

good post mikhail
I personally think
these rankings may stand good from the point of view of a russian med student but from the point of view of a foreign med student i ll rank the schools in this way:
1 Moscow state Univ faculty of med
2 St petersburg State univ faculty of med
3 Moscow medical Academy
4 People's friendship univ faculty of med
5. St Petersburg State Medical University (pavlov)
6 Volvograd State Medical University


I m surprised to see Ryazan state medical univ in the ranking list...i think it isnt hat good a school!

[rohania]

Dear Mikhail,
What is a classic university and what are the 47 univs categorised as?
Rohani.

[ajanth]

:? What about the Kursk State Medical Unicersity? I don't see it in the list. I'am from India, planning to study medicine in Russia next year. I was considering Kursk for the English medium of language and the low cost...

Ajanth.

[Mikhail]

Rohania,
Unlike to North America, in Soviet Union medical schools were separate institutions. In 1930s the government decided to give independence to medical faculties of Universities: Moscow State, Kazan State, etc (probably, StPetersburg State, I have no data on it). All these “new” schools were named Medical Institute. In 1990s they decided that it is better to be a university or academy. This way we got Moscow Medical Academy (former 1st Moscow Medical Institute), Russian State Medical University (former 2nd Moscow Medical Institute), etc. So, to avoid misunderstanding, sometimes in Russia we use “classic university” to indicate old-style structured educational organisations, which completely satisfy our understanding of a university: several faculties, several specializations, etc. Besides, these universities have re-organised medical faculties about 10 years ago: the faculties combine basic sciences and medicine to make doctors with very good research skills.
It is also should be mentioned that “classic universities” are governed by Ministry of Education whereas medical schools are supervised by Ministry of Healthcare.

Ajanth,
Kursk State Medical University is among top 20 medical schools in Russia. You may also consider inexpensive English medium programs at Ryazan, Saratov, Volgograd, Nizhnii Novgorod.

With best wishes,
Mikhail

[2bd1]

Hi Mikhail

Can u offer services if i wanna goto Nizhny Novrogod ?

[sjoshi44]

DO u have any info on the dorms at Ryazan ??

[Mikhail]

2bd1, you may be know, admission to med schools depends on some points: grades, citizenship, etc. I may give you an answer after consideration of the application package.

sjoshi44, they pay good attention to renovation of the rooms. Our applicants may get DVD on that school. Besides, they have very small intake this year.
With best wishes,
Mikhail

[sidneyaz]

What is the nature of the english program at MMA. I have heard conflicting things. My understanding is that the english program has english instruction the first three years and Russian the last three years. Is this correct? Is MMA licensed in CA and NY?

[Miklos]

What is the nature of the english program at MMA. I have heard conflicting things. My understanding is that the english program has english instruction the first three years and Russian the last three years. Is this correct? Is MMA licensed in CA and NY?

The native language program is recognized by California. The English program, to my knowledge is not. (To confirm this, contact Pat Park, the Foreign Schools Liaison at the Medical Board. Her contact info is listed here. (http://www.medbd.ca.gov/Applicant_Schools_Unapproved.htm))

Currently, no Russian schools are approved for more than 12 weeks of rotations outside of Russia for purposes of residency in NY. (http://www.op.nysed.gov/medforms.htm)

Form 2CC is not needed for graduates of the following medical schools, which have been approved by the New York State Education Department to allow students to complete more than 12 weeks of clinical clerkships in New York State. The schools are:

* St. George's University School of Medicine, St. George's, Grenada
* Ross University School of Medicine, Roseau, Dominica
* Fatima College of Medicine, Manila, Philippines
* The Autonomous University of Guadalajara, Guadalajara, Mexico
* International Health and Medicine Program, Ben Gurion University of the Negrev, Beer-Sheva, Israel
* English Language Program, Medical University of Lublin, Lublin, Poland
* English Language Program, Medical University of Silesia, Katowice, Poland
* American University of the Caribbean, St. Martin, Netherland Antilles
* Saba University School of Medicine, Saba, Netherland Antilles
* St. Matthew's University School of Medicine, Grand Cayman, Cayman Islands
* Kasturba Medical College, Manipal, India

[sjoshi44]

how is life in Ryazan ? What to expect ?

[Andy_I]

I don`t know what kind of research Mikhail did to rank Russian Med. Schools. I think he just made it up. There are no statistic data available to compare mad. schools in Russia. In US I met quite a few successful graduates from Russian State Medical University, 1-st Med. School in St.Petersburg, St. Petersburg Medical Military Academy (foreiners not allowed there, I think), Surprisingly I did not see that many Moscow Medical Academy graduates (none - to be precise, but I know there are some). All other med. schools graduates are unique. But it does not mean that there is significant difference in quality of Med. schools in Russia - all of them suck. But in these three you will be studing with students who have higher IQ and more oriented to enter residencies overseas. Make sure that med. school recognised by ECFMG and study yourself - still can get something from hospital rotations and case discussions. But basic sciences tuition is below 0.

Good Luck!!!

[Chemist_11]

Andy - SHUT UP! jeez, when you know what you are talking about, then feel free to post, but people can do without your point of view, ask for a brain cell at christmas, then people might listen to you.

[Mikhail]

Initially, MMA created combined English/Russian-medium program: academic program of years 1, 2 and 3 (preferably science subjects) was delivered in English, whereas clinical subjects at years 4, 5 and 6 (implying contacts with patients who usually don’t speak English) were taught in Russian. Since last year, MMA has being ordering full time English medium MD program (not excluding study of the language).
According to this forum messages MMA is not approved in CA and I did not see any information concerning NY.

[italiamaria6]

I graduated from MMA
Many of my classmates including myself are practicing medicine in the USA
There are plenty people from MMA all over states, most of them are very successful in passing USMLE and getting residency
Of course, Russian medical school education alone is not enough to passs USMLE

[drtintin]

Initially, MMA created combined English/Russian-medium program: academic program of years 1, 2 and 3 (preferably science subjects) was delivered in English, whereas clinical subjects at years 4, 5 and 6 (implying contacts with patients who usually don’t speak English) were taught in Russian. Since last year, MMA has being ordering full time English medium MD program (not excluding study of the language).
.

I am surprised one advertising for english medium programme when the same person wrote a few months ago the following

"""In Moscow MD programs in all universities are arranged as 3 in English+3 in Russian.
It is after you to decide which one is better. I have just one note. Schools announcing full 6 year in English are at risk to be derecognised abroad, at least in some countries. The problem is the students contact the patients using non-native language for patients. So, it is suggested that the prospective doctors don’t get skills, which shall be very sufficient part of clinical practise. I know that Medical Council of Malaysia was considering excluding Kursk from the list of 5 Russian med schools recognised there. I was said that the same might be true for Indian Medical Council, but the information is unofficial. """
http://www.valuemd.com/thread17576.html

well that's not my opinion

[dctm]

Compare Russian State Medical University and Nizhny Novgorod State Medical Academy, which 1 is d best place to do medicine ?

i juz wanna gt more oppinoin fr u :)

[dctm]

May i have the latest ranking of top 15 national medical schools in Russia Med School from The Ministry of Education
(out of 47, not including medical faculties at classic universities)


thank u :)

[applemas]

Compare Russian State Medical University and Nizhny Novgorod State Medical Academy, which 1 is d best place to do medicine ?

i juz wanna gt more oppinoin fr u :)

ok, i am from Malaysia, but study in Russia medical school.

which one better? I'm not really sure. If say about ranking, RSMU has better ranking than NNSMA, i suppose.

If say about study condition: RSMU 3 years English + 3 years Russian, that mean you may face language problem in your country when you finish study.
NNSMA 6 years English. But you still have to learn russian. Why? You have lecture and classes in English. When you talk to patient, taking history, you have to use Russian.

[applemas]

I am surprised one advertising for english medium programme when the same person wrote a few months ago the following

"""In Moscow MD programs in all universities are arranged as 3 in English+3 in Russian.
It is after you to decide which one is better. I have just one note. Schools announcing full 6 year in English are at risk to be derecognised abroad, at least in some countries. The problem is the students contact the patients using non-native language for patients. So, it is suggested that the prospective doctors don’t get skills, which shall be very sufficient part of clinical practise. I know that Medical Council of Malaysia was considering excluding Kursk from the list of 5 Russian med schools recognised there. I was said that the same might be true for Indian Medical Council, but the information is unofficial. """
http://www.valuemd.com/thread17576.html

well that's not my opinion

I"m fr 6 years English medium in 1 of the Russia medical school. I just want to clarify that we speak russian with patients. But, we use english in lecture hall and classroom. So far Malaysia medical council still recognize kursk.

[applemas]

Anyone has ranking for medical schools in Russia for this year? (by ministry of health)

[dctm]

so, conclusion is rsmu o nnsma ? which 1 will b better for a malaysian to get a medical degree?

[Mikhail]

May i have the latest ranking of top 15 national medical schools in Russia Med School from The Ministry of Education
(out of 47, not including medical faculties at classic universities)


I am afraid they did not publish information on 2006 yet. At least I am not able to find it in internet.

[Mikhail]

so, conclusion is rsmu o nnsma ? which 1 will b better for a malaysian to get a medical degree?

I guess, you need to ask for the answer your country-mates who are already in Russia or graduated from these medical schools.
It is quite difficult to explain the difference (unless you are cost-sensitive). Both schools are large (with 1000’s students in annual intake). So you may face both positive and negative sides of studying there and it is after an individual to be active and to get all the best the school may offer.
You would see a lot of Malaysians in both the schools.

[Mikhail]

Anyone has ranking for medical schools in Russia for this year? (by ministry of health)

The recent rank was published by Ministry of Education in January 2006
(http://www.abituru.ru/?razdel=rating&document=all&view=39 (http://www.abituru.ru/?razdel=rating&document=all&view=39) – in Russian)

1. Moscow Medical Academy
2. Moscow State University of Medicine and Dentistry
3. Russian State Medical University (Moscow)
4. St Petersburg State Medical University
5. Siberian State Medical University (Tomsk)
6. Volgograd State Medical University
7. Ryazan’ State Medical University
8. St Petersburg State Medical Academy
9. Kuban’ State Medical Academy (Krasnodar)
10. Novosibirsk State Medical Academy
11. Krasnoyarsk State Medical Academy
12. St Petersburg State Pediatric Medical Academy
13. Bashkir State Medical University (Ufa)
14. Kazan’ State Medical University
15. Kursk State Medical University
16. Samara State Medical University
17. Tver’ State Medical Academy
18. Perm State Medical Academy
19. Rostov State Medical University
20. Tjumen State Medical Academy
…
42. Chita State Medical Academy

Schools not included in the list:
- Nizhnii Novgorod State Medical Academy
- Smolensk State Medical Academy
- Voronezh State Medical Academy

All-Russia rank of universities:
1. Moscow State University (medical faculty, no English medium program)
2. St Petersburg State University (medical faculty, not sure on English medium program)
3. MFTI [Moscow Institute of Physics & Technology] (faculty of biophysics)
4. Russian People Friendship University [Moscow] (faculty of medicine, English medium program)
5. Tomsk State University (no MD program)

[Tension]

Hi Mikhail!
You seem to be very knowledgeable about the medical education system in Russia. Could you please help me out with a problem? Could you please tell me where I can find the syllabus of medical education in Russia? More specifically, which topics are covered under each of the subjects that are taught in medical school.
Thanks!

[drdritani]

greetings

may I have information about Saratov State Medical University,because here doesn't have enough information about this University ?

[applemas]

www.sgmu.ru/en

[drdritani]

thnx a lot applemas for the webpage.
so can u tell me more about the accreditation of this University ? is good to be in Saratov ? are living expenses more cheaper than Moscow and St.Petersburg?
I will be grateful to everyone , bye

[bpoichan]

hi there..

an honest piece of advice would be to simply avoid the provincial medical schools in russia..
the best would be to stick to moscow..and 2nd far behind choice would be St petersburg..

and dont follow this ' biased' ranking of med school.. as this mikhail guy is an agent for moscow state university..and that means to him ' more students in MSU ...more money for him'..
he is a nice and very articulate person.. very charming .. i had the chance to talk to him.. he was expeditive about my application to MSU.. and was very professional.. HOWEVER MSU is certainly not the best med school in russia.. the program is too new...was just accredited a few years ago by the WHO..

Russia does not have rankings.. you should find the school where you could be at YOUR best.. a school that will not treat you as dirt cuz you are a foreigner..
anyway look around...i could advise where to go.. but then .. make your own choices..
take care

[Mikhail]

an honest piece of advice would be to simply avoid the provincial medical schools in russia.. the best would be to stick to moscow..and 2nd far behind choice would be St petersburg..


The best place is probably to go to the states, but you did not go. And you had your reasons. So, it is very possible that somebody has his/her reasons not to go to (very good or the best Russian) medical schools in Moscow.



and dont follow this ' biased' ranking of med school..

It is not true – the rank is issued by Russian Minsitry of Education. Are you going to prove that somebody made them interested??

as this mikhail guy is an agent

It is true – www.cep.ru



as this mikhail guy is an agent for moscow state university..and that means to him ' more students in MSU ...more money for him'..

It is not complete true: we represent also MMA, PFU and some regional medical universities. We really have no preferences to send “our” applicants namely to MSU. We would be glad to assist everybody in admission to PFU.

he is a nice and very articulate person.. very charming ..

It’s … a personal opinion (besides, thank you)

HOWEVER MSU is certainly not the best med school in russia..

Nobody said it (if we keep in mind the Ministry ranking). Medical education here is provided by special (separate) medical schools (like MMA, RSMU, Saratov Medical University, etc) and medical faculties of what we call “classical universities” (like MSU and PFU). Medical faculties are not comparable to medical schools in size, number of students, history, etc. [If you wish, this gives both pro and contra arguments for studying there… ] And correspondingly, there are two ranks from the Ministry: one concerns medical schools only and another implies “classical universities” [as a whole, not their medical faculties].
Finally, according to Ministry, Moscow State University is the best national university (and, thus, the best national university among those having medical faculties in their structure). Also, according to the Minsitry’ ranking of medical schools, MMA is to be at the first place.
I would not discuss whether it is objective or not, but I confess I did not pay to the Ministry for any ranking result (as well as I don’t know anybody who did it].

MSU program is too new...was just accredited a few years ago by the WHO..


The program started in 1992. WHO does not perform any sort of accreditation. It LISTS international medical schools and the listing is formed by information from national governments.


Russia does not have rankings..

Ya, we also have no electricity and hot water. So, the students are expected to bring candles and make camp-fire to boil water.

you should find the school where you could be at YOUR best.. a school that will not treat you as dirt cuz you are a foreigner.. Make your own choice


+

[bpoichan]

Mikhail

first of all thank you for the very delicate and detailed explanation that you have provided us.

However you DO NOT represent MMA nor RSMU... only dr saman does and as he has a tight grasp of the place and is the UNIQUE contractor for both those universities, I am sure that he would not want to share that with anyone. so please be honest on that ..
or maybe you are an extra intermediary? you ll tell the prospective students in this room that you are an agent.. take your money from them..and then forward them to saman so that they ll have to pay him as well? that is MOST LIKELY the case..
that would be legitimate but unfair to the poor students..
That is sad that when a student applying to PFU has to pay you an extra fee when he could directly apply to PFU or the other places..

THIS IS FOR THE PROSPECTIVE STUDENTS: if you want to waste extra money.. then go for Mikhail.. he ll do a good job.. but if youfeel like saving that money for books.. and winter clothes and maybe more.. then contact DIRECTLY the university in question and find out the application process for international students !! that will save you tons of money!!!


Mikhail, I do not mean any harm.. i understand that you want to make a living .. but I like to shed light on the truth so that all the prospective students will not have to be used and pay useless amount of money for useless intermediaries...


As for the ranking from Russian Ministry of education, we both know that it is a JOKE.. so please portray the REAL picture .. people coming to this room are taking this information basing it according to what they are used to see ... but we both know that all official statistic data in RUSSIA were NEVER probed nor any extensive research was done.. HOW DO I KNOW THAT? please ask the dean of the medical Faculty at PFU Dr FROLOV .. he told me in person. Anyway.. even Russians dont believe what is told to them by their government..


I know Mikhail, that you are agent that went independent after leaving Moscow State University to make MORE MONEY.. and that is totally natural and normal.. i am no making those posts to hinder you from making money..that is your absolute right and privilege but i will post the simple truth.. and for those reading this post.. remember that I am NOT an agent and have absolutely no monetary benefits from doing this.. all the people that have sent me personal messages could corroborate this.
Therefore.. who would be more inclined to tell you " beautiful stories"?? the agent?? or the simple guy? just take a minute and think about it if you may....


Whatever you may claim.. I have been doing clinical work in MANY hospitals in Moscow.. i am sure that I met more docs than you have... and honestly in ALL my days in the Main hospitals of moscow (i could give you the names of the hospitals if needed) I have NEVER met a Moscow State MD... i am just saying that the MSU medical program does not shine much AT ALL.. MSU may be famous for mathematics.. physics.. but CERTAINLY NOT MEDICINE..
I believe what I have seen .. and not some tempered ranking.


I stand corrected about the WHO and thank you for the correction of my blunder.. when i mistakenly used the word ' accredited'..i was meaning that the MSU was recognized by the WHO only a few years ago..probably 2002 or so .. i am sure that you could inform us on that..
and i remember you trying to convince people to come to MSU while it was not yet accr...ooops sorry recognized by the WHO.


claiming about no hot water and no electricity .. i never did make such a claim..but since you engaged in that terrain.. we both know what happens every single winter in suburban towns of moscow and EVEN MOSCOW as well as many provincial towns all around Russia with frozen water pipes.. no heat..and people found dead frozen in their appartments.. .. i dont want to go on with this topic as it is not the purpose of my post.. but since Mikhail was sarcastically inferring that I had made such a comment.. i felt somewhat obliged to answer to this..

as for students with candles.. once again i made NO comments on that.. ALTHOUGH MANY STUDENTS HAVE CANDLES AS WITH ALL THE EVERSO HAPPENING BLACKOUTS ....the RAT infested dorms of MSU...
and the hot water being cut for a month in april (still winter in moscow)every year (they ll claim that they ll be cleaning the water pipes) that is definitely true.. i could go on and on again.. and all i would be saying would be the simple truth.. and not a simple rebuttal because you are reading what you dont like to see Mikhail.

Now if you guys (I mean prospective students) want some real pics of dorms.. please let me know.. then you ll see the truth..

ANYWAY .. THE BOTTOM LINE IS THE FOLLOWING..

I AM TALKING ABOUT HOW YOU (I MEAN YOU!! THE FOREIGN STUDENT IN RUSSIA) WILL BE TREATED .. HOW YOUR ACTUAL CONDITIONS WILL BE..
I AM TELLING WHAT TYPE OF PLACE YOU LL LIVE.. WHO AND HOW YOU LL HAVE TO BRIBE PEOPLE.. WHAT THE HOSPITALS ACTUALLY LOOK LIKE...

I DO NOT INTEND TO PAINT YOU A NICE PICTURE.. COVER WHAT IS NOT.. THROW AT YOUR FACE SOME RANKINGS.. AND MOST IMPORTANTLY..IF YOU WANT ME TO HELP YOU APPLY I CAN HELP YOU FOR FREE...

SO NOW JUDGE FOR YOURSELF..

god bless you all people.. and you too Mikhail!!

[medino]

Thanks for your advice for prospective students

Please tell me about the place i will live, how i will have to bribe people, hospital...etc in PFU.

By the way, could you tell me the cost of living(meals, transprort..) and cost of books in a year at here?
Should I have dinner in restaurant or buy food and cook by myself?

[medino]

If you have some real pics of dorm in PFU, please post here. great!

[bpoichan]

MIKHAIL,

I checked your company's site that you did not miss to write (nice commercial stunt!)...and i found it a little plain.. with nice stories..
i ve noticed that in russia, people could make a hump of dirt look like a gold mine...

Anyway.. i did not see any post concerning the prices for your services.. now i understand that you ll tell that it is a " case-by-case" type of service..

i believe that you should put the price of your services on your page..
I can somewhat figure why you did not ...

YOU PROBABLY CHARGE DIFFERENT PRICES FOR PEOPLE FROM DIFFERENT COUNTRIES.. RIGHT? (now that i said the truth i expect a rebuttal here!)

anyway let s make a simulation here ok?

i am a canadian college graduate and would like to attend the PFUR this upcoming fall... i have already sent you all the appropriate documents needed ... what would the total fee to be paid to your company please?

please dont tell us about the driver that will wait for the student at the airport and all the bla bla..that are basic services from the university anyway..

All i want and probably all the prospective students is a PRICE!

dont evade that question.. just give a simulated price and service..

thank you

[rashim.kamra]

sir can any 1 please clear 2 me that which uni in russia is known as pfr.

secondly i m a final yr student of mbbs from india, want 2 know that if i complete my post grad from russia in english med. in gen. surgery.
is tht of use if i later plan to clear USMLE & settle in US,
thirdly can i prepare for usmle simultaneously with my post grad from russia
Thanks

[Mikhail]

you DO NOT represent MMA nor RSMU...
I would say we may assist in admission to these schools, is it OK with you?

That is sad that when a student applying to PFU has to pay you an extra fee when he could directly apply to PFU or the other places..
We charge the Application fee for our services. We do not overcharge the universities fees and publish the real fees. What’s the problem? It is after the students to decide what is better for him/her.

Mikhail... i understand that you want to make a living .. but I like to shed light on the truth so that all the prospective students will not have to be used and pay useless amount of money for useless intermediaries...
You are shedding light on your imaginations

As for the ranking from Russian Ministry of education, we both know that it is a JOKE
Originally, you reported that the ranking is biased. And I see you can’t prove it and you do not mean to prove it. So, it was lie?
As to the joke, I do not think it is a joke and I did not meet anybody who thought so. It is quite possible that position in the rank does not necessarily correspond with a level of services for international students. However, there is public information on how they made the ranking, so, everybody may make the personal conclusion.

I know Mikhail, that you are agent that went independent after leaving Moscow State University to make MORE MONEY..
Again, what is a problem with you to prove your position without personal accusations on your opponents? I guess, you do not know me in a person and I never said you why I changed my job. So, why you say all these things? Just to think you are the coolest person in your school?

i am sure that I met more docs than you have...
Again, I doubt that you know anything about my experience. So, what data you used to compare?

and honestly in ALL my days in the Main hospitals of moscow (i could give you the names of the hospitals if needed) I have NEVER met a Moscow State MD... i am just saying that the MSU medical program does not shine much AT ALL..

Faculty of Medicine at Moscow State University accepts 35 students annually. They had their first (after a long period) graduates in 1998. Some of them are practicing abroad, some of them are doing research, some returned to their home cities in Russia. So, it is not too much MSU graduates working as doctors in Moscow clinics and hospitals. And I do not wonder you never met them. So, why you take a right to judge about education there?
I guess it should be a person who met and used to work with at least some graduates of this school.

and i remember you trying to convince people to come to MSU while it was not yet accr...ooops sorry recognized by the WHO.
As a rule, WHO includes in he list medical schools having at least 1 or 2 annual groups of graduates. Russian Government applied for MSU listing by WHO in 1999. And it was not a problem (or crime) to attract students to the MSU at that times because we had an explanation from WHO and ECFMG that in a case a student enters a state foreign medical school and at the time of the student’s graduation (6 years later) the school is listed by WHO, the student (MD graduate) has no problems with participation in local medical exams (let say USMLE).
I already wrote that WHO just lists the schools and the letter from the national government was a guarantee the school will be included in the list (and it is in the list now).

claiming about no hot water and no electricity .. i never did make such a claim
But you claimed “Russia does not have rankings” Why we are to discuss these “non-existent” but official rankings now?!

frozen water pipes.. no heat.
Does it concern any national medical school?

since Mikhail was sarcastically inferring that I had made such a comment..
I really did not mean to be sarcastic. But please say me what I should think about your sometimes too categorical sentences (bow-wow style)?

God bless you all people.. and you too Mikhail!!
Thank you, I need it very much

[Mikhail]

I checked your company's site that you did not miss to write (nice commercial stunt!)...
In 2003 I got an offer from the Forum moderator to participate in the Forum as the School Official. According to the Forum rules such a participant has a right to “post a message in a student forum (Russian forum in this case) introducing yourself and letting users know that you are available to answer questions in the designated "School Admins & Faculty" Forum. to post free ads; use the designated "School Admins & Faculty" Forum to provide information for users who seek official info.
I think I never indicated the site address before, but it is not the problem to name it according to the moderators position.
Anyway.. i did not see any post concerning the prices for your services.. now i understand that you ll tell that it is a " case-by-case" type of service..
i believe that you should put the price of your services on your page..
I can somewhat figure why you did not ...
Is the personal aggression the main skill you got from your school?!
YOU PROBABLY CHARGE DIFFERENT PRICES FOR PEOPLE FROM DIFFERENT COUNTRIES.. RIGHT? (now that i said the truth i expect a rebuttal here!)
please dont tell us about the driver that will wait for the student at the airport and all the bla bla..that are basic services from the university anyway.. We charge standard USD 350-450 Application fee. It covers: consulting, costs of invitation process (issuing documents for visa support) and associated taxes, postage to send the original invitation letter by DHL express mail, meeting at the airport and transfer to the university hostel, assistance in accommodation and orientation, assistance in getting registered with the states and with the university. In a case the student chooses a regional university (located outside Moscow and St Petersburg) the fee includes transfer from the airport to a railway station, assistance in getting the train ticket, meeting at the place of destination and transfer to a hostel with full on-site service as described above.
In a case of PFU, we always send our representative to the airport. PFU sends a car to pick up an individual student, but the student pays USD 100 to the university as a registration fee. If the student applies via our company the fee is a part of the Application fee.
Also, individual students are to pay USD 230 per year for their medical treatment (health insurance) in the PFU clinic. If the student applies via our company he/she pays the same USD 230 and gets the accident/life insurance extra.
Also, we have an office on the PFU campus and render assistance to our current students there when required.
We increase the fee if the student requests movie on the schools we distribute on DVD or CD (PFU is not in the list but I guess it will be done within a year).
Thank you,
Mikhail

[Mikhail]

sir can any 1 please clear 2 me that which uni in russia is known as pfr.
I guess you mean PFU, it is an abbreviation of People Friendship University.
secondly i m a final yr student of mbbs from india, want 2 know that if i complete my post grad from russia in english med. in gen. surgery.
Just few national schools offer postgraduate trainin in English. To my experience these are Ryazan State Medical University and Moscow State University of Medicine and Dentistry. May be somebody here can give some more ideas on that. I also think you need to undertake a clinical training in India to be eligible for a postgraduate training in Russia (Russian MD is for 6 years and Russian Ministry of Health is in position that Indian 4,5 year MBBS is not equal to it).

[applemas]

Mikhail: Do you know where can get the list of ranking for Russian medical schools for year 2006? (Russian/ English; it doesn't matter) I am just curious......

[Mikhail]

Take a look at
http://www.ucheba.ru/vuz-rating/1075.html (http://www.ucheba.ru/vuz-rating/1075.html)
http://www.abituru.ru/?razdel=rating&document=all&view=33 (http://www.abituru.ru/?razdel=rating&document=all&view=33)
But I did not see any new one. It looks like they decided to change methods of the rankings calculation and it takes a lot of time and efforts to change the system.

[bpoichan]

applemas .. .you do study in russia and know good and well that the rankings in RUSSIA are all flawed..and totally useless....

[rubayee]

can anyone give me information about the institute of cardiology in saints petersburg,some one told me that the only affiliated to saint petersburg university.
is it so?
and how is the academic status in europe.

kind regards
dr riaz

[Cox's Bazar]

But buddy, the sites u suggested for ranking is purely in russian. I am learning russian but can't read or understand still fluently. Can u please send a reply giving the ranks of only the ENGLISH offering med schools in Russia? Would be of great help!

[Cox's Bazar]

I Belarus better than Russia? If so, then in what respects? Anyone out there from Belarus or at least knows something about Belarus. An uncle of mine lives there so I feel safe to go there but am not sure about the education standards. What are the prominent universities of medicine there in Belarus? Is Belarus a SCHENEGEN enlisted country?

[princezz]

i am having the same prob here..is mma lisensed in CA AND NY?SOME BODY help!!!i just want to know where MMA stands...

[Cox's Bazar]

You will probably get your answer here. Check this out California's Lists of Nonrecognized and Recognized Medical Schools (http://www.credentialwatch.org/non/california_medical.shtml)

[bpoichan]

We charge standard USD 350-450 Application fee. It covers: consulting, costs of invitation process (issuing documents for visa support) and associated taxes, postage to send the original invitation letter by DHL express mail, meeting at the airport and transfer to the university hostel, assistance in accommodation and orientation, assistance in getting registered with the states and with the university. In a case the student chooses a regional university (located outside Moscow and St Petersburg) the fee includes transfer from the airport to a railway station, assistance in getting the train ticket, meeting at the place of destination and transfer to a hostel with full on-site service as described above.[/color]
In a case of PFU, we always send our representative to the airport. PFU sends a car to pick up an individual student, but the student pays USD 100 to the university as a registration fee. If the student applies via our company the fee is a part of the Application fee.
Also, individual students are to pay USD 230 per year for their medical treatment (health insurance) in the PFU clinic. If the student applies via our company he/she pays the same USD 230 and gets the accident/life insurance extra.
Also, we have an office on the PFU campus and render assistance to our current students there when required.
We increase the fee if the student requests movie on the schools we distribute on DVD or CD (PFU is not in the list but I guess it will be done within a year).
Thank you,
Mikhail

That is exactly what I had claimed... anyone contacting the DIRECT agent of the school could avoid wasting uselessly that amount of money..

medical insurance is not of 230 USD... what a blunt lie.. you can have it for 120USD...

Mikhail ...Mikhail....wont you ever stop your lies ???

[Cox's Bazar]

Whats the per year fee of PFU??? Please only real fee and no agent fee

[bpoichan]

I dont remember....but at PFU you ll have to pay the university a basic fee plus 500$ per year or more for the english medium as the profs in english medium are paid more..
but you wont have to pay MIKHAIL nothing... all his story about airport pick up and all the visa stories.. will be in your fees in PFU..and therefore no need to waste over 500 dollars..

I can find you the number of the agent at PFU and you can call him if you want..

[Cox's Bazar]

Thanks so u 500$ more than the russian medium fee? In that case whats the russian medium fee per year? Please it would be really helpful if u inform about agents u know I may try to talk to them as I am still not decided where to go

thanks

[bpoichan]

It depends.. some russians pay NOTHING... some pay a few dollars..and others pay about 1 or 2 thousand dollars..
Russian students at PFU have some advantages as of course they are in their native country. if you are able to maintain some good grades, you are given a 50% discount or so.. i remember many russian friends not paying for med school but never bother asking them how the system worked for them as it would not work for me.

but here is the price of tuition for foreign students:
Rates of Tuition fees|PFUR - Peoples' Friendship University of Russia (http://www.rudn.ru/en/?pagec=20)

here is the site for MMA
International Students Faculty (http://eng.mma.ru/fsf)

their tuition is cheaper than PFU(quality has its price) from the paper.. but I remember at MMA paying $6500.. gosh i was ripped off again!..
anyway.. dont waste the extra money with Mikhail.. you can apply yourself to the schools.. and they ll tell you what to fax them..you do it yourself and save yourselves over $500~600..unless you dont really care about wasting money!

[Mikhail]

medical insurance is not of 230 USD... what a blunt lie.. you can have it for 120USD...

Mikhail ...Mikhail....wont you ever stop your lies ???

I do understand you being so selfish when you speak about your personal experience.
But numbers… It is easy to check…
The official insurance fee announced by the university last year is 6000 Russian roubles (it is valid till now). According to the current Central Bank ration of exchange 1 USD = 23,64 roubles resulting 6000 roubles = USD 250. So, the real fee is even more than USD 230 I said (changed because USD is coming down).
If you have a prejudice against all the agents, it is just your problem

[Mikhail]

anyway.. dont waste the extra money with Mikhail.. you can apply yourself to the schools.. and they ll tell you what to fax them..you do it yourself and save yourselves over $500~600..unless you dont really care about wasting money!

Just another side of the coin:
This year People Friendship University significantly increased the academic fees (up to 50% for some programs). The increase concerned also the current students: the university-student standard contract implies the university may increase the fees twice (not more than by 25%) during the period of study. In terms of MD program in English the increase in annual tuition for individual students is about USD 600. Our contract with the university does not include such an option and the students who entered the university with our assistance will pay for their study the same (old) fees. That means 1-st year English medium MD students will save at least (if no more increase will take place in subsequent years) USD 600 x 5 years = USD 3000.
Should I also mention that library fee (usage of textbooks and printing study materials) for individual student is USD 500/year whereas our students pay USD 400?
Finally it is USD 3500 to save vs Euro 300 to pay as Application fee (for real services).

[bpoichan]

Mikhail.. are you stupid by birth or are you doing it on purpose?
being selfish when i speak about my personal experience? W T F ???
i am sharing my experience so that people can have an idea.. and not be lulled by crooks like yourself.

you said it is easy to check...unless your eyes are full of
s--t...i gave some links above so that people can CHECK...


NOW IF YOU DARE LYING AND SAYING THAT THOSE STUDENTS APPLYING TO PFU WITH YOUR SERVICES WILL PAY THE 'OLD FEES' IS AN OUTRIGHT LIE..
YOU ARE INEXISTANT AT PFU..AND I DOUBT THAT THIS SPECIAL SERVICE EXISTS.. I ACTUALLY CALLED MR DEMUROV (VICE DEAN OF THE MEDICAL SCHOOL) AND TOLD ME THAT SUCH THING DOES NOT EXIST..

i wrote in capital letters for those that want to know the truth...
Mikhail.. you are a disappointment.. stop lying to those students please!!!
you must be aware that many have limited financial resources.. believe in your fantastic stories..and once in Russia get hit by the reality..and can not afford the real price.. by then you will be miles away and have no legal bound with them..

I know that it is hard for a Russian these days.. but have a heart and be honest.


I dont have any prejudice against normal agents.. but have prejudice against so-called agents trying to make nice stories to students..and make them pay extra money that they dont need , or can not afford, to waste for some.

And yes you are right.. you are a problem.. cuz people like you make it more difficult for non-governmental sponsored prospective medical students to have a clear and honest opinion of med schools in Russia.

anyway... you are a lame crook agent.. trying to rip off all those prospective students.. and that s all that you are.. maybe it is because there is nothing else you can do?;)


question to you: how come you dont work at Moscow state University anymore? i know the real story but am waiting for your ' version'

Your imbecility is congenital..and unfortunately nothing can be done for you..

[Novikvik]

Hi Mikhail,

Can you suggest a former USSR medical college where I can do 1 year internship? Pls include the fees if you know.

I have got my MD already.

I am looking for a cheap place plus good quality of training.

Thanks in advance.

[magaboo]

Hello everyone,
im a student from malaysia and im thinking of doing medicine in russia myself as its the only place i can afford besides indonesia. in my country russian medical grads are held as the "more experienced" doctors compared to those who graduated locally..imagine how bad the systems are here ( i have no intention whatesoever to bash my own country's name but thats the truth ). so, i would like to know more about job prospects of russian grads in the EU/UK/Canada as i dont intend to return after graduating. can somebody please shed some light?? thanks