From Ross to Saba

[TigerMD]

Hello,

I have finished two semesters at Ross. But the Ross program has estranged me and I do not feel comfortable studying in their environment.

Actually, I will be honest and tell you that I am flat out scared of failing or getting bad grades at the least. I don't mean to speak negatively of my former school, but this is my experience. I have barely passed these last two semesters.

I would like to know if Saba has any of these downsides that Ross has?

*High Student to Faculty Ratio
*Professors with little time
*Extremely competitive and cut throat (peoples failures mean someone else passes)
*Cheating: Shelf Exams are out there and they make up 20% or > of the grade. This can affect the minimum passing score.
*Ego. Ross professors have enormous egos and act as though they don't really have time to help.
*Dangerous island. I had $$$ stolen from my apartment. And I witnessed a near rape of a student by a local.
*Hard to get help
*Hard to get help
*Hard to get help
*Exams that are much tougher than what is taught in class.
*Terrible and inconsistent administration

I am thinking of transfering. Can you help me.

I would truly appreciate your advice.

[wolfvgang22]

You will join the dark side....
http://img53.exs.cx/img53/9884/Palpatine2.jpg

[scoobz1981]

Okay... since I actually go to Saba, this is how I saw it:

*High Student to Faculty Ratio
A: Not really, but yes.... in our classes we have about 50-60 students per semester and 2 professors per course. Thus I consider this a faculty student ratio of 30:1. However, in the schools eyes, because we have 3 classes in most semesters we actually get 6 professors (2 per subject) so they count it as 10:1. Take it as you will. I still think 30:1 is GREAT!

*Professors with little time
A: They have plenty of time. Even though sometimes it is difficult to find them in their office, IF YOU DO ASK THEM after class that you would like to arrange a meeting with them cause you have questions, THEN THEY WILL GLADLY (and I mean gladly) answer all your questions.

*Extremely competitive and cut throat (peoples failures mean someone else passes)
A: This depends on the class. In our semester, we were a VERY competitive class, and a few students were cut throat (which is expected to some degree). HOWEVER, AT NO TIME DID ANYONE'S SUCCESS MEAN ANOTHERS FAILURE! If 100% of the class passed, then so be it. Just because someone scored 100% didn't mean anything. It may affect the final curve in certain classes, but overall, if you score 75% (the passing grade) on all your tests, then YOU WILL PASS THE CLASS NO MATTER HOW MANY PEOPLE PASS!

*Cheating: Shelf Exams are out there and they make up 20% or > of the grade. This can affect the minimum passing score.
A: While I went to SABA, the Shelfs were worth about 20% of your grade in SOME classes (in others they meant nothing). The shelf exams were out there and available for people to see, and what those people chose to do with them was THEIR OWN BUSINESS. I didn't look at a single one, although the opportunity was given to me. I wanted to see where I stood in terms of my grade, and that mattered to me most. But again, they were available, and some people used em, and others didn't.


*Ego. Ross professors have enormous egos and act as though they don't really have time to help.
A: NOPE! SABA professors for the most part, are EXTREMELY FRIENDLY. Again, you may have a hard time catching them in their offices, but IF YOU MAKE AN APPOINTMENT with them, then THEY WILL GLADLY HELP YOU!

*Dangerous island. I had $$$ stolen from my apartment. And I witnessed a near rape of a student by a local.
There have been a couple of crimes on the island. Saying that, it is a VERY VERY SAFE ISLAND, and the safest in the Caribbean probably. There was an attempted rape of a student about a year ago, the suspect to my knowledge was never aprehended. My neighbour NEVER locked his door, and no one ever took anything from him.

*Hard to get help
A: On SABA there are always a couple of really really smart students and they are always willing to help other students. THANKS DIANA!!!! *WINK* If you have trouble, just ask people, and they will usually help you unless they too are confused with the material.


*Exams that are much tougher than what is taught in class.
I ONLY STUDIED THE POWERPOINTS that were given to us in class, and I NEVER scored anything less than a B in any class. (Except Pharmacology where I read the book - much more useful cause that class was a mess).

*Terrible and inconsistent administration
On the island, the administration is good. Pat, Laura and the others up there do a GREAT JOB, and I NEVER GOT TO THANK THEM FOR EVERYTHING!!!! THANK YOU GUYS!

Any others?

Val

[TigerMD]

Can you tell what the quality of the professors is at Saba.

What subjects are taught extremely well, while which ones are problematic due to inadequate professors???

Thank you, once again.

[scoobz1981]

I never paid attention in class, but this is what I think:

Extremely well:

Physio (except RENAL - but that can be supplemented with textbook and BRS for Physio)
Histology
Anatomy used to be - don't know now, new profs
Microbiology/Immuno
Neuro wasn't taught well, but it was taught the way I like to learn
Path
Clin Med
Physical Diagnosis

POORELY:
Pharm - but now it may be better cause 1 of the professors left...


Val

[TigerMD]

I was wondering if you have heard of any other transfer students in your school from either Ross or AUC?

I was wondering if you could give me any feedback on what their experiences were at Saba compared to the other school.

Thank you once again. This advice is making my life a hundred percent easier.

[scoobz1981]

Giuseppe transferred from AUC. He loved it on SABA. You would have to ask him what he thinks in detail, but I don't have his contact info. He is currently in 5th semester I think. I don't know of any other transfers. I do know that he became the histology TA.


Val

[futuremdsomewhere]

I am also a student at ross and would have to disagree with some of the above posters "downsides"

*High Student to Faculty Ratio- True there are a lot of students, we started with around 320 but in biochem we had 5 profs, histo 6 including 2 great visitings, genetics 3, and DPS was different all the time but the course director was always open for question. That is at least 15 profs for 320 students. This ratio makes no sense anyways because most people dont go and see them as this was true even in undergrad. It is your resource if you dont use it, it is your own fault.

*Professors with little time
I went to see profs all three semesters so far and they always had time to discuss anything I brought to them. A couple had me make appts but that was because I came outside their set office hours and they were getting ready for class.

*Extremely competitive and cut throat (peoples failures mean someone else passes)
Like this isnt true at most schools. You will always have people like that.

*Cheating: Shelf Exams are out there and they make up 20% or > of the grade. This can affect the minimum passing score.
I never saw one and scored above 80's on both of the ones I have taken

*Ego. Ross professors have enormous egos and act as though they don't really have time to help.
Never had this problem. All of them helped with any and all questions I took to them. Of course if you wait until a week until the final they will not be able to do anything for you. You have to be proactive.

*Dangerous island. I had $$$ stolen from my apartment. And I witnessed a near rape of a student by a local.
Dangerous. Never a problem so far not to say things dont happen hear. I just havent seen it. In undergrad I had my laptop and a lot of stuff stolen. Does that mean my school was in a dangerous area? No of course not.

*Hard to get help
*Hard to get help
*Hard to get help

*Exams that are much tougher than what is taught in class.
The exams were not that much tougher. The only class where I did not feel ready for the exams because of lecture was anatomy but they have no time to teach everything. If you knew the handouts you should at least have passed seeing the min. was about 65.

*Terrible and inconsistent administration
Mainly true. Something Devry should start working on.

If you dont like it go somewhere else it really is what you make of it. I just want to let people know that not everyone is as negative as you. It is funny to see how people who are not doing well always down everything at Ross but most of the people who are doing well have only trivial problems or none at all.

[mdme]

I just want to let you know a little about Saba. I agree wholeheartedly with Val. I am a 3rd semester student and have found that you get out of it what you put into it. The professors are there for you in one way or another. If they don't keep office hours when you can get there, then they give you their email or phone number (and encourage you to contact them). There have been some turnover professors in the last semester, but this happens all over. Mostly, the professors test on the material they have taught you. Medical school is NOT an easy ride. It is NOT undergrad school. You WILL have to put forth SOME effort. Your effort will be your grade at this school. I am an "older" student and have found all of this to be true just as I have stated. I don't think Saba is as you have described Ross to be. However, each class here has its own personality...some are VERY competetive, some are very arrogant, mine is a great class that works together and gets along great. :D If you aren't happy where you are, then change. Life is too short to be unhappy. Even if you are changing schools for the wrong reasons, the bottom line is that you are not happy there and so you should change to something different.

[TigerMD]

First of all, let me just mention that some profs at Ross are also part of the administration. One of the Biochem Profs in 1st semester to be more particular. And the administration IS terrible.

You are right that Ross is terrible for people who struggle while it's no big deal for people who get through more easily. This is because you will find very little assitance at Ross. When you struggle no one will help... I had to knock on many many doors of Profs to get help. I felt like a poor begger. Back in the states I could have just dished out some money and got a tutor to answer my questions...but in Dominica it is not possible.

That is the character that makes a school though. Especially a private school. Why should I go to Ross when I could go somewhere else where they actually care and I can get help. In Dominica, I can't get tutoring help even if I wanted it. Tutoring is not available until the 3 week of classes. That's too late with Mini 1 right around the corner. And the profs have no time. You will waste time waiting for profs to have time.

*High Student to Faculty Ratio-
It is true that Ross has this problem. Try to go and find an Anatomy Prof to help you in the lab!!! Good luck! I tried to get this help for weeks. No one offered to help. They would simply act as though I was dumb for not knowing how to ID the organs in the body.

They really demoralized me.

*Prof with little time-
There are profs that do a lot of administrative work. They have very little time. This is especially true with the 1st and 2nd semester profs.

*Extremely competitive and cut throat-
Saba apparently is not this way but they have a high level of education from what I can assess.

*Cheating, Shelf Exam Available
This is true that the Shelf is out there. I was given told to remember a few questions before the exam by a certain friend. They showed up exactly. The word is that the whole thing is out there!!! What if you are a borderline student. You can get destroyed by some of those cheating students with the MPS moving up all of a sudden. This is ridiculous. That is $10,500. That is no joke my friend.

*Ego-
There are some professors that act very intimidating and demeaning towards students. They only had respect for me once I started scoring high on my exams. Sad! I hate those type of professors. They wanted my advice and were very friendly once I started scoring raw 90's on my Minis. They treated me really bad before that. I hate such people who only appreciate status.

*Dangerous Island-
It is very much a dangerous island with a high crime rate. The school does very little for you in this respect. I was told to tell the Portsmouth Police which were not very helpful. They didn't really care. On top of that they blamed me.

Actually Ross and Dominica are just a blame game. When something goes wrong they blame the student!!

Let me be clear and say that I am not "trying" to be negative I do have a negative perspective of the school. I can hack it but the school is not helpful at all. That's all. That's why I was thinking of leaving Ross.

Thanks. More opinions on Saba would be appreciated

[ResearchingGuy]

I visited Ross before deciding upon Saba, so my opinion may be a bit biased. One of the things I liked most about Saba was the smaller class size and the fairly laid-back atmosphere. In Dominica, I couldn't get students to talk to me. In Saba they would stop me to talk up the school.

I pretty much agree with Val's point by point. We did have some competetive people in our class but there were no cut-throat gunners. People were almost always willing to share whatever notes or study aids they had. If you made a 75 you passed. Though we did have just a few people who didn't pass (or withdrew) some courses each semester, there was no wholesale effort to flunk people out.

The people I met who transferred into Saba (about 5 or so while I was there) seemed happy with their choice.

Best of Luck!

[TigerMD]

Thank you very much to all the Saba students for the responses. I appreciate it wholeheartedly.

Can you also tell me what the lifestyle is like on Saba? The pros and cons. Do they have frequent electricity outages as Dominica or??

And if you have visited both schools, can you tell me the difference in living stardards when comparing the two?

This is not major criteria for me but it is also important to know.

Thank you.

[futuremdsomewhere]

*You are right that Ross is terrible for people who struggle while it's no *big deal for people who get through more easily. This is because you *will find very little assitance at Ross. When you struggle no one will *help... I had to knock on many many doors of Profs to get help. I felt *like a poor begger. Back in the states I could have just dished out some *money and got a tutor to answer my questions...but in Dominica it is not *possible.
This is totally a lie. 1)The school offers one on one tutors in all 1/2 semester classes as well as some classes beyond. 2)They also have small group sessions every week that if you take the effort to go to are really good. 3)There are TAs for gross/neuro with review sessions multiple times a week. 4)Profs have no problem helping, unless maybe you made an a@@ of yourself or something. I have asked them questions many times and got the answers that I needed. Of course if you wait until the day before the final you are out of luck.

All of the above mentioned items cost you nothing more than what you have already paid the school. As for the dishing out of money for a tutor. Where do I sign up, I have not seen any signs outside on any of the boards or do you expect people to just know you need help??



*That is the character that makes a school though. Especially a private *school. Why should I go to Ross when I could go somewhere else where *they actually care and I can get help. In Dominica, I can't get tutoring *help even if I wanted it. Tutoring is not available until the 3 week of *classes. That's too late with Mini 1 right around the corner. And the *profs have no time. You will waste time waiting for profs to have time.

Wrong again, group study starts 2nd week of class. Who needs it during the first week, you havent even had some of the classes yet. How do I know, because I was a ta last semester and this semester.

*High Student to Faculty Ratio-
*It is true that Ross has this problem. Try to go and find an Anatomy *Prof to help you in the lab!!! Good luck! I tried to get this help for *weeks. No one offered to help. They would simply act as though I was *dumb for not knowing how to ID the organs in the body.

Did you try a TA? There are at least 4 profs in the lab during lab time. Last semester there was about 80-90 students at a time.



*Cheating, Shelf Exam Available
*This is true that the Shelf is out there. I was given told to remember a *few questions before the exam by a certain friend. They showed up *exactly. The word is that the whole thing is out there!!! What if you are *a borderline student. You can get destroyed by some of those cheating *students with the MPS moving up all of a sudden. This is ridiculous. *That is $10,500. That is no joke my friend.
Well if they are out there then U.S. students have access as well and other schools. Just study and dont be borderline.


*Actually Ross and Dominica are just a blame game. When something *goes wrong they blame the student!!
I agree it is a blame game at Ross and Dominica but it is some students who blame Ross/Dominica for their problems.

*Let me be clear and say that I am not "trying" to be negative I do have *a negative perspective of the school. I can hack it but the school is not *helpful at all. That's all. That's why I was thinking of leaving Ross.

Leave

[futuremdsomewhere]

TigerMD aka troll by another name.

Why must you lie. While looking through some of his old posts I came upon an interesting one.

http://www.valuemd.com/ftopic28689-0-asc-15.html

He states he failed the last mini but himself and the profs were to blame. Why might you ask the profs were to blame since he has stated many many times that never would they help him or talk to him. Well he states that :

TigerMD message(I did not bomb any minis except the last. I don't really know how bad I did because they don't tell you. I passed all my classes though.

Please don't blame the student only. My message is clear: it takes two hands to clap. I could take blame even though I studied very hard (9 hours a day) and met with profs regularly, but they are also to blame.)


So you met with them regularly? Why are they to blame if you dont understand the basics. You are right it takes two hands to clap, you have two hands. As for the study 9 hours a day. Get off of the interenet and make it 9 hours of actual study time.

[TigerMD]

futuresmdsomewhere,

Your attitude is typical of Ross. And also the way many students like you treat other students here. Now you have made it clear to even Saba students.

I don't think I need to say much. Your apathy and insulting nature has the mark of "Ross" all over it.

Thank you for demonstrating my point.

[futuremdsomewhere]

futuresmdsomewhere,

Your attitude is typical of Ross. And also the way many students like you treat other students here. Now you have made it clear to even Saba students.

I don't think I need to say much. Your apathy and insulting nature has the mark of "Ross" all over it.

Thank you for demonstrating my point.

If your posts did not say one thing and then in another post you say the exact opposite I may have been more sympathetic to your cause. The contradictions of your posts make me think you are nothing but a troll or a student who is just mad for failing or almost failing.

As for the way I treat other students here, you have no idea. Every semester I have went out of my way to help other students. I have been on the welcome comit. twice, ta for 7 different classes (I am 3rd semester as well), and I also meet with fellow students every week for q/a sessions. If you are comparing me to the average Ross student then I say way to go Ross students.

I have only commented on the things I know to be true or false. If you have any questions about Ross or how to obtain any assistance please feel free to ask. Oh tigermd if you need help in third just ask and I would be happy to add you to my list.

[futuremdsomewhere]

Hello,

I have finished two semesters at Ross. But the Ross program has estranged me and I do not feel comfortable studying in their environment.

Actually, I will be honest and tell you that I am flat out scared of failing or getting bad grades at the least. I don't mean to speak negatively of my former school, but this is my experience. I have barely passed these last two semesters.

I would like to know if Saba has any of these downsides that Ross has?

*High Student to Faculty Ratio
*Professors with little time
*Extremely competitive and cut throat (peoples failures mean someone else passes)
*Cheating: Shelf Exams are out there and they make up 20% or > of the grade. This can affect the minimum passing score.
*Ego. Ross professors have enormous egos and act as though they don't really have time to help.
*Dangerous island. I had $$$ stolen from my apartment. And I witnessed a near rape of a student by a local.
*Hard to get help
*Hard to get help
*Hard to get help
*Exams that are much tougher than what is taught in class.
*Terrible and inconsistent administration

I am thinking of transfering. Can you help me.

I would truly appreciate your advice.

How long has it been since you were at Ross, a year? The shelf exams have not been worth 20% for at least that long. Starting in May 2004 they became worth 15% of one class and you only took one for each semester. tigermd troll somewhere else.

[wolfvgang22]

I might agree with you and call him a troll if he were posting on the ROSS forum, but he posted on the Saba forum, asking about conditions at Saba.

If the OP is all the things that you would have us believe, perhaps you should leave him to his fate of inevitable failure.

I don't know what you intend to accomplish here...or why flaming the OP is so important to you. I could be wrong, but this is the Saba forum, and we don't care that much about your Ross issues. Whether his claims are true or not about Ross isn't really significant.

[futuremdsomewhere]

I might agree with you and call him a troll if he were posting on the ROSS forum, but he posted on the Saba forum, asking about conditions at Saba.

If the OP is all the things that you would have us believe, perhaps you should leave him to his fate of inevitable failure.

I don't know what you intend to accomplish here...or why flaming the OP is so important to you. I could be wrong, but this is the Saba forum, and we don't care that much about your Ross issues. Whether his claims are true or not about Ross isn't really significant.

Well he is posting the same wrong information in both forums. I just happened upon this post by checking out his recent posts. I am just sick and tired of the lies. If there wasnt so many dicrepencies in his posts I would have let him be. Well how about you take him and then he can be your issue