Spartan Alumni hosts new nationwide public television show

[ZAATARI]

Dr.Krishmar of Miami,board certified cardiologist Yale affiliated hospital trained ,national speaker for Berkeley Heart labs recently gained national recognition for being the host of a new public television show called Healthy mind http://healthybodyhealthymind.com ,This nationwide show is a half hour series common patient health issues.
hope Spartan alumni will enjoy this nationwide show.

[ZAATARI]

Also this alumni was the initial founder of the largest cardiology practice in Miami,&&& voted as THE BEST CARDIOLOGY GROUP IN FLORIDA.

[ZAATARI]

outstanding alumni in Florida: Perry one of the original founders of largest cardiology group in S.Florida,nationwide Health TV host,best cardiology group in the state of Florida award,Lisa best healthcare executive award in Florida ,best healthcare CEO nationwide award[the stevies] ,Sean best resident OSU for 3 yrs,Nobel peace prize committe invitee to recieve Nobel peace prize for doctors without borders, Ty physician recognition award/physician of the yr for "superior medical care"Tenet ,Florida,Mary national speaker and author pain managment and pain control.Douglas best resident in radiology award in Florida,We thank all above top notch physicians for saving thousands of lives every year and as one patient wrote" Miracles became daily routines with you doctors",God bless you and God bless America.Above physicians educated at Harvard,Yale,Brown,Columbia,and MD anderson affiliated university hospitals.

[shockandawe]

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[shockandawe]

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[shockandawe]

Dr.Krishmar of Miami,board certified cardiologist Yale affiliated hospital trained ,national speaker for Berkeley Heart labs recently gained national recognition for being the host of a new public television show called Healthy mind http://healthybodyhealthymind.com ,This nationwide show is a half hour series common patient health issues.
hope Spartan alumni will enjoy this nationwide show.

Azkeptic, why don't you tell your Courant to write an article about him??? Maybe you and your friends could start writing about something positive for a change?? More, your website, which is suppose to be fair and balanced, displays that Courant article but why don't you have any positive articles on it, such as these sites and the Prime Ministers' visit to Spartan which totally contradicts the Courant?? Don't you feel that you are obligated to be fair with your audience??? It seems to us that you are only giving them one side of the story.. -s&a

[ZAATARI]

As Spartan alumni my duty always been to be the best of what I do,to help others in need,and to take a look at the big picture,we do have exceptional alumni,I do know of many more impressive stories but will share it in the right time [not too many schools has alumni invited to oslo or nationwide medical show host,or gets stevies,or asked to take care of the royal family critically ill kids,....] but I also must point out that the alumni will never be able to defend ourself if asked why our school not seeking CA.NY,or FL approvals yet?we always must look at the good and the bad in order to move forward in the right direction.

[ZAATARI]

Forget to mention interesting coincident :When I was picking up a child from the pediatric intensive care unit at King Faisel Specialists hospital and research center in Riyadh to bring to Boston Children's for surgery,the pediatric cardiologist ,she was Saudi Citizen Spartan graduate...interesting.

[shockandawe]

Forget to mention interesting coincident :When I was picking up a child from the pediatric intensive care unit at King Faisel Specialists hospital and research center in Riyadh to bring to Boston Children's for surgery,the pediatric cardiologist ,she was Saudi Citizen Spartan graduate...interesting.

Very impressive... ZAATARI, you are always amazing us with truly impressive stories of alumni doing great things for our society. I speak for all alumni when I say Thank You... I wish, the Az, would open his eyes a little bit and be more fair...

Aside from all of this, I agree with you that Spartan still needs to apply for CA, NY, FL.. Heck, we have some of the most successful grads out of the caribbean in the state of Florida!!! But it doesn't look good when the Spartan administration does not make the slightest effort. Really the Spartan administration sucks, but the students, many of them are outstanding.. And the thing is that many of them would not be doctors were it not for Spartan and the fact that they keep their tuition so low so that many of the underrepresented can afford to be doctors..

The truth is that the school you graduate from says very little about what kind of doctor you are going to be... You can have a Harvard grad barely passing his boards and a Spartan grad getting 99.. For even the greatest facilities and the greatest professors in the world cannot ever beat nor replace the human spirit. -s&a

[ZAATARI]

Saba experience proved to us that you can keep small classes,keep low tuition[$5500/semester] and get approved,because they are looking for the long term goals and now they can put any price they want,someone told me since they got approved their phone from new applicants does not stop...& they deserve it.Spartan can be better if they start planning because they have "Gold Mine" of celebrities alumni:Medical celebrities[award winning MD's],business celebrities[stevies],and media celebrities[TV hosts].

[shockandawe]

Saba experience proved to us that you can keep small classes,keep low tuition[$5500/semester] and get approved,because they are looking for the long term goals and now they can put any price they want,someone told me since they got approved their phone from new applicants does not stop...& they deserve it.Spartan can be better if they start planning because they have "Gold Mine" of celebrities alumni:Medical celebrities[award winning MD's],business celebrities[stevies],and media celebrities[TV hosts].


Man, I'm telling you, if the Spartan administration had half a brain, not a full brain, just half a brain, they would be CA proved and making a killing right now... -s&a

[ZAATARI]

I viewed few topics on the internet from the healthbodyhealthmind site and found it very useful,I recommend to everyone to enjoy few topics and meet on video your school alumni.

[greendogz]

Zaatari,

Yeah, this guy is impressive. How he got Cards out of a small program like Griffin is even more impressive. But he was a student back when Caribbean grads were few and far between and pretty much flew under the radar.

How about giving us an amazing success story for a recent student, say a grad from 1995 and beyond. Frankly, that would lend a lot more credit to Spartan as being as good some of the other Carib schools.

[ZAATARI]

Greendogs,I am not here to promotes or demote Spartan,I am sharing success stories with fellow Alumni from classmates of mine.If you want more recent names I have it all,mostly from top US school,I will level with you and give you 2 name today just because you asked :look at devos childrens hosp pediatric endocrinology[an alumni just finished,Georgetown trained and Devos childrens considered one of the best in the US,and current fellow at Harvard BWH cardic anesthesia program
I like also for you to bring me from whatever school you attend 5 names that acheived the followings:physician of the year,stevie award equivalence,invitation to Oslo,resident in the entire state award,and one name attended Harvard.
I usually do not answer negative anger messages but I made an exception today because I am in a good mood.

[shockandawe]

Zaatari,

Yeah, this guy is impressive. How he got Cards out of a small program like Griffin is even more impressive. But he was a student back when Caribbean grads were few and far between and pretty much flew under the radar.

How about giving us an amazing success story for a recent student, say a grad from 1995 and beyond. Frankly, that would lend a lot more credit to Spartan as being as good some of the other Carib schools.

I'm sorry greendogz, but people like you are an embarrassment to Spartan alumni everywhere...

The Stevie award winner is a graduate of the 1990's, the Nobel prize invitee was not only resident of the year 3 times in a row at Ohio state but also it made into MD Anderson at the best cancer research institute, in gyn-oncology, a sub-specialty which only has 25 spots per year and is probably one of the most difficult sub-specialties to get, he was a graduate of Spartan in the 1990's!!!! I have spartan friends and classmates that made into Harvard, Yale, Brown, Mayo, in fact, there are current Spartan graduates that are at Brighams and Women’s, Yale anesthesiology, etc, etc, etc... Your pessimism greendogz, never ceases to amaze me.. Dude, you've go to crawl out of that long dark cave that you live it, its just not healthy to live like that... Its a beautiful world out there!!! -s&a

[wolfvgang22]

not the noble prize stuff again.... :lol:

[azskeptic]

not the noble prize stuff again.... :lol:

well, at least the newspapers are getting it a bit better

http://www.saintpetersburgtimes.com/2004/11/12/Citytimes/Partygoers_hit_Zoofari.shtml

Guest speaker, Dr. ***********, a surgical oncologist at the
Moffitt Cancer Center & Research Institute, represented Doctor's
Without Borders, winner of the 1999 Nobel Peace Prize for aiding
victims of armed conflict, epidemics and natural and man-made
disasters.

[shockandawe]

not the noble prize stuff again.... :lol:

well, at least the newspapers are getting it a bit better

http://www.saintpetersburgtimes.com/2004/11/12/Citytimes/Partygoers_hit_Zoofari.shtml

Guest speaker, Dr. ***********, a surgical oncologist at the
Moffitt Cancer Center & Research Institute, represented Doctor's
Without Borders, winner of the 1999 Nobel Peace Prize for aiding
victims of armed conflict, epidemics and natural and man-made
disasters.


A lot of jealous people in this forum... -s&a

[azskeptic]

not the noble prize stuff again.... :lol:

well, at least the newspapers are getting it a bit better

http://www.saintpetersburgtimes.com/2004/11/12/Citytimes/Partygoers_hit_Zoofari.shtml

Guest speaker, Dr. ***********, a surgical oncologist at the
Moffitt Cancer Center & Research Institute, represented Doctor's
Without Borders, winner of the 1999 Nobel Peace Prize for aiding
victims of armed conflict, epidemics and natural and man-made
disasters.


A lot of jealous people in this forum... -s&a

no, just happy to see the newspaper reporting it correctly. azskeptic p.s. one applauds those who doing well but one should correct errors...

[shockandawe]

not the noble prize stuff again.... :lol:

well, at least the newspapers are getting it a bit better

http://www.saintpetersburgtimes.com/2004/11/12/Citytimes/Partygoers_hit_Zoofari.shtml

Guest speaker, Dr. ***********, a surgical oncologist at the
Moffitt Cancer Center & Research Institute, represented Doctor's
Without Borders, winner of the 1999 Nobel Peace Prize for aiding
victims of armed conflict, epidemics and natural and man-made
disasters.


A lot of jealous people in this forum... -s&a

no, just happy to see the newspaper reporting it correctly. azskeptic p.s. one applauds those who doing well but one should correct errors...


The Hartford Courant made many errors Az, when are you going to correct them??? Or is it just that you correct those that are playing your propaganda and those you are jealous of??? -s&a

[azskeptic]

not the noble prize stuff again.... :lol:

well, at least the newspapers are getting it a bit better

http://www.saintpetersburgtimes.com/2004/11/12/Citytimes/Partygoers_hit_Zoofari.shtml

Guest speaker, Dr. ***********, a surgical oncologist at the
Moffitt Cancer Center & Research Institute, represented Doctor's
Without Borders, winner of the 1999 Nobel Peace Prize for aiding
victims of armed conflict, epidemics and natural and man-made
disasters.


A lot of jealous people in this forum... -s&a

no, just happy to see the newspaper reporting it correctly. azskeptic p.s. one applauds those who doing well but one should correct errors...


The Hartford Courant made many errors Az, when are you going to correct them??? Or is it just that you correct those that are playing your propaganda and those you are jealous of??? -s&a

Dr. still waiting for proof ot the errors and the unethical behavior you allege. send it privately to me if you wish. I'll check into it.

[shockandawe]

ZAATARI, you son of a ----, you did it again.. You caused all the chronic negative posters in this whole forum to go crazy!!! Just when I was starting to think that this forum was getting boring.. They are going postal!!! How do you do it everytime?? I love it!!!! You should be a revolutionary!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

[shockandawe]

not the noble prize stuff again.... :lol:

well, at least the newspapers are getting it a bit better

http://www.saintpetersburgtimes.com/2004/11/12/Citytimes/Partygoers_hit_Zoofari.shtml

Guest speaker, Dr. ***********, a surgical oncologist at the
Moffitt Cancer Center & Research Institute, represented Doctor's
Without Borders, winner of the 1999 Nobel Peace Prize for aiding
victims of armed conflict, epidemics and natural and man-made
disasters.


A lot of jealous people in this forum... -s&a

no, just happy to see the newspaper reporting it correctly. azskeptic p.s. one applauds those who doing well but one should correct errors...


The Hartford Courant made many errors Az, when are you going to correct them??? Or is it just that you correct those that are playing your propaganda and those you are jealous of??? -s&a

Dr. still waiting for proof ot the errors and the unethical behavior you allege. send it privately to me if you wish. I'll check into it.


How about Spartans' approval by the St.Lucian government? Only a few months after their visit the Prime Minister of St. Lucia was on TV at Spartan, giving a speech for Spartans new campus... They lied and siad that Spartan wasn't approved...

What about the Idaho, NM state licensures?? They lied about that too..

What about mentioning the 4 classrooms and TOTALLY not mentioning the new campus that was right in front of their faces!!!

What about them implying that the error committed by that doctor was due to his medical training, when IN FACT, intubating is taugh in residency.. At the most, a medical student, might be lucky and intubate a couple of times in their whole medical school career... If an anesthesiologist is unable to intubate, you should blame their RESIDENCY program, not their medical school because that is where they learned their art...

They implied lies, manipulated facts and deceived innocent people and these are your heros, Az!!! The whole thing was a set-up.

Why don't they go to the University of Ethiopia and evaluate them?? The University of Ethiopia medical school graduates are approved in CA.. In fact, I met one of their graduates in my hospital. He is one of the top people in his field and he gives lectures around the USA. Yeah, their schools must be really good.. -s&a

[azskeptic]

not the noble prize stuff again.... :lol:

well, at least the newspapers are getting it a bit better

http://www.saintpetersburgtimes.com/2004/11/12/Citytimes/Partygoers_hit_Zoofari.shtml

Guest speaker, Dr. ***********, a surgical oncologist at the
Moffitt Cancer Center & Research Institute, represented Doctor's
Without Borders, winner of the 1999 Nobel Peace Prize for aiding
victims of armed conflict, epidemics and natural and man-made
disasters.


A lot of jealous people in this forum... -s&a

no, just happy to see the newspaper reporting it correctly. azskeptic p.s. one applauds those who doing well but one should correct errors...


The Hartford Courant made many errors Az, when are you going to correct them??? Or is it just that you correct those that are playing your propaganda and those you are jealous of??? -s&a

Dr. still waiting for proof ot the errors and the unethical behavior you allege. send it privately to me if you wish. I'll check into it.


How about Spartans' approval by the St.Lucian government? Only a few months after their visit the Prime Minister of St. Lucia was on TV at Spartan, giving a speech for Spartans new campus... They lied and siad that Spartan wasn't approved...

What about the Idaho, NM state licensures?? They lied about that too..

What about mentioning the 4 classrooms and TOTALLY not mentioning the new campus that was right in front of their faces!!!

What about them implying that the error committed by that doctor was due to his medical training, when IN FACT, intubating is taugh in residency.. At the most, a medical student, might be lucky and intubate a couple of times in their whole medical school career... If an anesthesiologist is unable to intubate, you should blame their RESIDENCY program, not their medical school because that is where they learned their art...

They implied lies, manipulated facts and deceived innocent people and these are your heros, Az!!! The whole thing was a set-up.

Why don't they go to the University of Ethiopia and evaluate them?? The University of Ethiopia medical school graduates are approved in CA.. In fact, I met one of their graduates in my hospital. He is one of the top people in his field and he gives lectures around the USA. Yeah, their schools must be really good.. -s&a

So let me get this straight: You are saying that Dr. D mentioned in the article was lying as to the ability of Spartan grads to get licensed in St. Lucia?

You are saying that Idaho and NM will license your grads now?

Let me know and I'll check.

[shockandawe]

Exactly and the worst is the St. Lucian government thing because that would mean that Spartan is not even allowed to be licensed in their own country!!! They not only wrote about it but also said it on NPR!!! Call up the St. Lucian government and they will tell you the truth, which is that Spartan grads ARE ALLOWED TO WORK AND BE LICENSED IN ST. LUCIA but only after completing residency... St.Lucia does NOT have a residency program, however, if a Spartan grad completes his/her residency elsewhere, such as in the USA, they are allowed to apply and be approved for licensure in St.Lucia!!!!!!!!!! None of the USA residency trained Spartan grads have ever returned to St. Lucia,,, And you can't blame them, do the the math $160,000 average salary in the USA compared to 30,000 bucks in St. Lucia....

[AUCMD2006]

the article does say that after a residency they can work there and that is misleading b/c it spends the whole time talking about how they can't and only two sentences on how they can. the bigger issue for a prospective student are the roations and what the program director said, that there haven't been any since 1999, or 3 or 4 since 1997, or very few....

like you all say if the admin was awake the school could be much better. it is amusing though how you two (zaatari and s&a) are your biggest fans...it be nice for a change to hear from other spartanites.

it was bad press for the school, deserved or not, the school should have had a strong response and addressed the issues. good luck

[shockandawe]

the article does say that after a residency they can work there and that is misleading b/c it spends the whole time talking about how they can't and only two sentences on how they can. the bigger issue for a prospective student are the roations and what the program director said, that there haven't been any since 1999, or 3 or 4 since 1997, or very few....

like you all say if the admin was awake the school could be much better. it is amusing though how you two (zaatari and s&a) are your biggest fans...it be nice for a change to hear from other spartanites.

it was bad press for the school, deserved or not, the school should have had a strong response and addressed the issues. good luck


Of all the chronic negative posters, this thread would not be complete without the rod adding his 2 cents... That must be the icing on the cake..

But rod, cores are not done at St. Raphael's hospital, only the electives are done there.. And since Spartanites can do electives at places where they do NOT have to pay extra fees, many opt out of going to someplace like St. Raphael and paying... That is what I did..

The cores are done at Griffin and St. Mary's.. Very conveniently, the Courant didn't mention how many students were in those hospitals because there were plenty... I find it amazing, how these writers can twist the truth and only mention and manipulate something that they know will make the school look bad, unless of course, they didn't know that you can't do cores at St. Raphael, but I doubt it, because judging from the rest of the article, they are way to corrupt for me to give them the benefit of the doubt...

I also love how they downplay the Spartan medcial school experience. They write:

St Mary’s in Waterbury has an open-ended agreement that allows Spartan students to spend 12 weeks in a surgical rotation, taking patient histories, performing physicals and holding retractors during operations, said Dr V Timothy Shea, chairman of St Mary’s surgical department.

Doing H &P's, holding retractors and if they are really lucky, putting a couple of stitches in at the end of the surgery is what medical students do in every single program in the USA!!!!! Medical students are not expected to do surgeries... St. Mary's has a strong surgical residency program that happens to be Yale affiliate and it is an excellent learning experience for medical students.

I agree that Spartan should have had some type of strong response but the administration is weak and they have sub-zero PR.. Sad, but that does not mean that everything that the Courant alleges is true... -s&a

[AUCMD2006]

both of you have turned into chronic negative posters, aka allways tell it like it is with no **, over the last few weeks.
i don't think the article was fair and unbiased but if the school doesn't dispute it who will?

i understand that as alums you want to improve the school but i just don't get your argument. on one hand you show a couple of highly successful grads and on the other you state the faculty is a joke, the admin is worthless, you fear repraisal for voicing your opinion, SGA is corrupt, you have to do all your own work for rotations and you have to do all your work for residency.

what this basically says is that the school has nothing to do with your, or anyone else there, sucess stories. that you guys are highly motivated, bright enough, and politically correct enough, to get all this done on your own and the school deserves no credit whatsoever.

i guess what i am asking is why would a prospective student want to go there over all the other schools that also give you the same opportunity while also providing admistrative support and a qualified faculty. point is if you want to make the admin shake and make changes why not collectively, when ****** is there, turn in transfer request forms?

the US is in desperate need of doctors so if you can improve the school and make more qualified doctors available everyone benefits....the school makes more money, more students get to study medicine, and zaatari and s&a can put up every self awarded title and prize each grad gives to themsemselves :lol:

[ZAATARI]

410 Persons opened this topic in one day....wow...I love it when people love success stories...thank you and wishing you to have similar extremely successful careers and happy holidays...............sorry for the few negative individuals but I have no interest with current Spartan,I am sharing serior alumni sucess stories..

[AUCMD2006]

"sorry for the few negative"

why you don't like hearing the truth? :lol:

i think hearing about sucessful grads is really helpfull to current students so keep it up it gives us all a light at the end of the tunnel

[shockandawe]

both of you have turned into chronic negative posters, aka allways tell it like it is with no **, over the last few weeks.
i don't think the article was fair and unbiased but if the school doesn't dispute it who will?

I don't know who will... Of course, we all agree that the school should dispute it.


i understand that as alums you want to improve the school but i just don't get your argument. on one hand you show a couple of highly successful grads and on the other you state the faculty is a joke, the admin is worthless, you fear repraisal for voicing your opinion, SGA is corrupt, you have to do all your own work for rotations and you have to do all your work for residency.


What I have been saying all along rrod, is that it really doesn't matter where you come from... I think that your major problems is that you are misinterpreting what ZAATARI or I are saying as, "People should go to this school because..." But either ZAATARI nor I give a crap about people coming to this school. Some of these people are our classmates and we are happy for their success. End of story.


what this basically says is that the school has nothing to do with your, or anyone else there, sucess stories. that you guys are highly motivated, bright enough, and politically correct enough, to get all this done on your own and the school deserves no credit whatsoever.


Almost exactly!!!! This is what I have been trying to say.. I said "almost" exactly because getting our USA rotations was definitely helpful and I give the school some credit for approving our rotations and not sending us to someplace like England or Ireland.



i guess what i am asking is why would a prospective student want to go there over all the other schools that also give you the same opportunity while also providing admistrative support and a qualified faculty. point is if you want to make the admin shake and make changes why not collectively, when ****** is there, turn in transfer request forms?

There really is only ONE MAJOR reason why people choose Spartan over the other schools. LOW TUITION. You have to understand, rrod, that for many people Spartan is the ONLY choice and this is because either they have to pay out of their own pockets or they are from Canada or they have really bad credit, etc, etc., or they couldn't get into Saba, especially now that Saba is CA approved, their admission applications have hit the roof...

The neat thing is that you can make it from Spartan and you see some of those success stories, they are very impressive. With the Courant article and Saba acheiving CA, I don' t know what the future will hold for Spartan?? Hopefully, the administration will wake up..

The thing about Spartan is that they can survive with just under 10 students per class and they are just fine with that.. You cannot really hurt them that easy.. More, they do not really care for getting too many students because that means more work for them. I am sure the owner would like to have 60 students per class but the administration could care less either way, in fact, the lesser the students, the lesser the trouble for them... Sad but true... This school is not like any other... -s&a

[anotherstudent]

what this basically says is that the school has nothing to do with your, or anyone else there, sucess stories. that you guys are highly motivated, bright enough, and politically correct enough, to get all this done on your own and the school deserves no credit whatsoever.
well said. and true

i guess what i am asking is why would a prospective student want to go there over all the other schools that also give you the same opportunity while also providing admistrative support and a qualified faculty.
Now that's a very good point. Maybe this is one of the reason's the school keeps it's tuition so cheap. not becuse they are trying to give students a break, but because it's a brilliant trap to appeal to those who are extremely hard up for money.

point is if you want to make the admin shake and make changes why not collectively, when ****** is there, turn in transfer request forms?
this would never happen, their parents would kill them and throw their tails in the Ganges river. "you will be dokta like yo fatha and his fatha." do as your told.....LOL.

[azskeptic]

both of you have turned into chronic negative posters, aka allways tell it like it is with no **, over the last few weeks.
i don't think the article was fair and unbiased but if the school doesn't dispute it who will?

I don't know who will... Of course, we all agree that the school should dispute it.


i understand that as alums you want to improve the school but i just don't get your argument. on one hand you show a couple of highly successful grads and on the other you state the faculty is a joke, the admin is worthless, you fear repraisal for voicing your opinion, SGA is corrupt, you have to do all your own work for rotations and you have to do all your work for residency.


What I have been saying all along rrod, is that it really doesn't matter where you come from... I think that your major problems is that you are misinterpreting what ZAATARI or I are saying as, "People should go to this school because..." But either ZAATARI nor I give a crap about people coming to this school. Some of these people are our classmates and we are happy for their success. End of story.


what this basically says is that the school has nothing to do with your, or anyone else there, sucess stories. that you guys are highly motivated, bright enough, and politically correct enough, to get all this done on your own and the school deserves no credit whatsoever.


Almost exactly!!!! This is what I have been trying to say.. I said "almost" exactly because getting our USA rotations was definitely helpful and I give the school some credit for approving our rotations and not sending us to someplace like England or Ireland.



i guess what i am asking is why would a prospective student want to go there over all the other schools that also give you the same opportunity while also providing admistrative support and a qualified faculty. point is if you want to make the admin shake and make changes why not collectively, when ****** is there, turn in transfer request forms?

There really is only ONE MAJOR reason why people choose Spartan over the other schools. LOW TUITION. You have to understand, rrod, that for many people Spartan is the ONLY choice and this is because either they have to pay out of their own pockets or they are from Canada or they have really bad credit, etc, etc., or they couldn't get into Saba, especially now that Saba is CA approved, their admission applications have hit the roof...

The neat thing is that you can make it from Spartan and you see some of those success stories, they are very impressive. With the Courant article and Saba acheiving CA, I don' t know what the future will hold for Spartan?? Hopefully, the administration will wake up..

The thing about Spartan is that they can survive with just under 10 students per class and they are just fine with that.. You cannot really hurt them that easy.. More, they do not really care for getting too many students because that means more work for them. I am sure the owner would like to have 60 students per class but the administration could care less either way, in fact, the lesser the students, the lesser the trouble for them... Sad but true... This school is not like any other... -s&a

So what shock is saying is that with full knowledge of the situation some students choose to go to schools where the administration isn't supportive and this is due to being able to get cheap tuition solely? This reminds me of a story of a farmer I knew. Someone once said about him "He is the kind of guy that if he finds a barb wire fence with a door would always prefer to go over the top barb wire because he was more use to it then going the normal way through a door. It takes a different mind set.

[AUCMD2006]

it is a double trap for some students because since it is a cheap alternative they have to go there as a last resort and once there they are stuck there because there is no place to transfer that is affordable. i can see why the admin does not change, there is absolutely no reason for them to change current practices.

i guess whoever survives this is at another level of determination...to be self taught and still be able to make it really says something about the caharcter it takes to do it. what is the attrition rate? how many don't finish the program because it is so self reliant maybe some just don't have it in them?

hell has frozen over i know it now, last week SC repressentative told a fact about SC without exaggerating and without spin and now i agree with zaatari and shock and awe......we are all doomed

[blondeshedoc]

I am new here, but I would like to say a few things about some assertions that people here have made about Spartan. I am a forth year student at Spartan and my boyfriend is an intern in IM who went to Saba. I am going to convey my personal experience here, so s&a cannot say that it is wrong. :evil:

1) Griffin does not take Spartan students anymore. I called there myself and they told me so. Unless this has changed within the last few months, this is what I was told.

2) Spartan has VERY FEW AFFILIATED core rotations that are ACGME approved. This anyone can find out very easily by going to the ACGME website. By affiliated I mean that the school has a WRITTEN CONTRACT with the program to take Spartan students. Atlanta is not approved. Cook County is approved in just about all cores. The rotations that Spartan is affiliated with in NY are for electives only s&a. I know nothing about any affiliated rotation sites in Florida as s&a mentioned in a post recently. I was told that a site in Baltimore has opened up that is approved in IM for core rotation but nothing else.

3) My boyfriend's rotations were arranged for him by the school. I did not have this when I was doing my rotations early on (I did not want to go to Chicago). This was frustrating. Also, when I called the NM office to ask about this I was told to try to recruit programs myself (instead of the administration doing this as is done by Saba and other programs).

4) Nobody is giving me answers about when Stafford will be approved. From what I hear, the St. Lucian government is still EVALUATING Spartan by visiting its rotation sites. They were recently in Atlanta and went to Chicago. By calling the DOE in the US, I was able to find out that this is part of the FIRST STEP in acquiring the loan (being approved by the home country).

5) My boyfriend had a 5th semester at Saba that taught him all of his PE skills. I know that Ross and AUC have this as well. I did not have that at Spartan and it really hurt me when I got to Family Practice and IM. This is a serious matter that the admin really needs to address. My boyfriend is still helping me out with some of this now.

I would advise any future doctor reading this forum to investigate resources other than Spartan. If you can get into Saba then GO with whatever loans they have. Worry about the cost later.

[ZAATARI]

Blondshedoc
Just curious why you did not go to SABA with your boybriend? I agree that SABA is an attractive school now,Spartan gave me a future that exceeded my wildest dreams but with todays regulations and changes its much safer to go to school that is approved in all states[100%] and as of this moment the only school that acheived this is ROSS[I believe they just cleared Texas few days ago]..................................................

[sean]

Hi guys,

Just wanted to add some comments to this discussion. Welcome to the board blondeshedoc. Nice to see some new blood on the forum. I think most people agree that Spartan has some positives and some negatives. It is also obvious that Spartan needs to improve certain aspects of its educational experience in order to compete and survive as a business. When I 1st went to Spartan ('96), Saba had just opened up and the "Big three" + Antigua/Dominican Schools were the only ones in existence. Since then many, many schools have opened up in the Caribbean +/- Central America. State Medical Boards are also slowly but surely becoming tighter in the restrictions. In order for Spartan (and its students/graduates) to compete in this new environment, Spartan must adjust. I think its great the Spartan facilities on St. Lucia have improved and I think this is a good 1st step. However, its only that, a 1st step. I, personally, don't see Stafford loans as the major issue for Spartan (even though they seem to want to make it the issue). Of course, I'm already long gone from the school... I think its much more important to ...
1. improve the quality of teaching and
2. get more and improve the clinical coordination.
If this takes (another) increase in tuition, then that's what it takes. I think that once this happens, then Spartan can look for all the state board approvals that it wants. It doesn't necessarily need many, many teachers and clinical sites but it does need enough to accomodate the numbers of student that it takes. At the risk of being repetitive I have written a lot of what others before have said. Well anyway...ya'll have a good Sunday.

[shockandawe]

1) Griffin does not take Spartan students anymore. I called there myself and they told me so. Unless this has changed within the last few months, this is what I was told.

I'll take your word for it, blondshedoc, and I will say that this could be devastating for Spartan. The Yale affliliate hospitals were Spartan's best assets.


2) Spartan has VERY FEW AFFILIATED core rotations that are ACGME approved. This anyone can find out very easily by going to the ACGME website. By affiliated I mean that the school has a WRITTEN CONTRACT with the program to take Spartan students. Atlanta is not approved. Cook County is approved in just about all cores. The rotations that Spartan is affiliated with in NY are for electives only s&a. I know nothing about any affiliated rotation sites in Florida as s&a mentioned in a post recently. I was told that a site in Baltimore has opened up that is approved in IM for core rotation but nothing else.


Not quite, blond, you should have done a little more researching... More, you can do cores such as psychiatry and family in NY. Both of them at ACGME approved hospitals in those specialties!!!!! I've had friends do ALL of their rotations in FL. Your post is missing a lot of information... I'm not blaming you for it and I do not believe that it is intentional, at all... It's just that, at Spartan, you are suppose to do your own research.


3) My boyfriend's rotations were arranged for him by the school. I did not have this when I was doing my rotations early on (I did not want to go to Chicago). This was frustrating. Also, when I called the NM office to ask about this I was told to try to recruit programs myself (instead of the administration doing this as is done by Saba and other programs).


Did you pass your boards??? I know that Chicago accepts students wthout passing their boards. It really shouldn't be that hard... I cannot comment on the present situtation but for me, I scored high on my boards and was immediately sent to Connecticut. I loved my experience but it seems the times are chang'in..


4) Nobody is giving me answers about when Stafford will be approved. From what I hear, the St. Lucian government is still EVALUATING Spartan by visiting its rotation sites. They were recently in Atlanta and went to Chicago. By calling the DOE in the US, I was able to find out that this is part of the FIRST STEP in acquiring the loan (being approved by the home country).


It seems that they have been on the first step of the process, since the beginning of time...


5) My boyfriend had a 5th semester at Saba that taught him all of his PE skills. I know that Ross and AUC have this as well. I did not have that at Spartan and it really hurt me when I got to Family Practice and IM. This is a serious matter that the admin really needs to address. My boyfriend is still helping me out with some of this now.


Blondshedoc, doing H & P's really isn't that hard. I hope that you are not really serious when you say that you "still" need help with it. You should be an H & P machine just after your first few weeks of IM. If you "still" need help, that is pretty sad... I do not think that Spartan needs to add awhole new fifth semester and make people stay on the island, fo something so simple as the PE...


I would advise any future doctor reading this forum to investigate resources other than Spartan. If you can get into Saba then GO with whatever loans they have. Worry about the cost later.

I would have to agree with you here... -s&a

[shockandawe]

Blondshedoc
Just curious why you did not go to SABA with your boybriend? I agree that SABA is an attractive school now,Spartan gave me a future that exceeded my wildest dreams but with todays regulations and changes its much safer to go to school that is approved in all states[100%] and as of this moment the only school that acheived this is ROSS[I believe they just cleared Texas few days ago]..................................................


I agree with you 100% ZAATARI!!! It really didn't matter so much before, but now with the political climate, the Courant article, the federation search, new CA approval of Saba, it is much better to be safe and go with a school that is 100% state approved, maybe even going to another country all together, outside of the caribbean. If I could do it over again, I would have tried harder in the USA and if I couldn't make it, I would have gone to Australia... -s&a

[AUCMD2006]

"I know that Chicago accepts students wthout passing their boards"

chicago requires passing step one scores as of last month, i just started the process for rotations. i'm doing some in louisiana and then either chicago or michigan and all require passing step one score....unless its a different hospital

[shockandawe]

"I know that Chicago accepts students wthout passing their boards"

chicago requires passing step one scores as of last month, i just started the process for rotations. i'm doing some in louisiana and then either chicago or michigan and all require passing step one score....unless its a different hospital

St. Joseph's Provera and Jackson do NOT require step 1. I know that St. Anthony's does require step 1. The medical student program director at St. Anthony's Hospital is a Spartan graduate. I am not sure about Cook county.. They might require it. I think that it really depends on which hospital you go to.. On the other hand, I believe that in Connecticut ALL the hospitals require step 1. -s&a

[greendogz]

Yes, Dr. Shaeffer at St. Anthony's in Chicago definatley requires Step 1 and I've been told that the quality of rotations there are excellent. However, there are many other students from different schools there and I personally wasn't able to get rotations on the schedule that I wanted and instead started out with Griffin.

I know of atleast one student who has completed all of her rotations in CT WITHOUT Step I, but I don't know if this was at Griffin or Waterbury etc. etc, when I was there all these hospital required Step I so I don't know how this student got away with it.

As for Elgin and Jackson Park, neither of these places in Chicago require Step 1. As for rotations, I was forced to complete many at what I now found out be non-ACGME accredited hospitals (despite having both Steps), and back when I was a student Raj and ******* were useless in helping students get cores.

[Picard]

but with todays regulations and changes its much safer to go to school that is approved in all states[100%] and as of this moment the only school that acheived this is ROSS[I believe they just cleared Texas few days ago]..................................................

Just a clarification -- SGU has always been "OK" with Texas and SGU grads have always been eligible for TX licensure (know someone who just got it). The reason Ross requested TX approval was because Ross grads were barred from even applying for TX licensure before, so the only recourse it had was to request a site visit from TX to get itself formally approved. SGU did not go through this process because SGU grads have always been eligible for TX licensure (abeit need to do more paperwork), and TX is coming out with a formal eval process for Carib schools in 2005, at which time, all schools will be evaluated. So, to be technically correct, SGU is also "good in 50 states."

P

[teratos]

Blondshedoc, doing H & P's really isn't that hard.

Right, doing an H&P isn't hard. Doing an H&P WELL requires practice, and eludes many people. When you get to a clinical site, it is expected that you already know how to do it. There are a lot of things you just can't learn from a book. The residents and attendings won't spend time with you teaching you to do a physical. They WILL think you are putz if you don't know how already.

Also to clarify. AUC grads have been able to, and continue to be able to be licensed in TX. They will have to submit some extra documentation because they haven't had a site visit by TX, but the are not "disapproved". AUC, like SGU is "good" in all 50 states. G

[stephew]

correct: SGU grads get licensed in all states. Ross had an expedited process with texas ebcause NO grad was allowed to practice. This process ultimately cleared the way for ross grads to get licsencure without filling out extra paperwork. SGU students still have to fill out this paperwork but may practice there. Bottom line is ross was against the wall and to remedy/evaluate this, they went througha formal process and came out nicely the other end. SGU never needed to go through the process which is good; but subsequently grads still must go through the extra paperwork.

[blondeshedoc]

St. Joseph's Provera and Jackson do NOT require step 1. I know that St. Anthony's does require step 1. The medical student program director at St. Anthony's Hospital is a Spartan graduate. I am not sure about Cook county.. They might require it. I think that it really depends on which hospital you go to.. On the other hand, I believe that in Connecticut ALL the hospitals require step 1. -s&a[/quote]

Hello,

Thank you for the nice welcome here.

1) I know someone who is rotating at St. Anthony's without Step 1 but is also an excellent student. Also, everyone knows that Jackson Park is a JOKE and no one learns anything there. Jackson is the place that Spartan's many non-serious students go just to say that they are still in medical school. This is probably the same group that goes on to never pass any of the Steps.

2) Yes, s&a, I did pass Step 1 and am studying for Step 2 CS which is why I am seriously questioning my PE skills. It would not hurt for Spartan to give a clinical semester so that we don't walk into FP or IM without the knowledge that other schools provide. That is all I am saying. I think that Spartan should get rid of classes like Human Sexuality and Geriatrics and concentrate more on H/P with volunteer patients from the community. I know this is done at AUC.

3) ZAATARI, thanks for your comment. I could not go to Saba for financial reasons, plain and simple. I am advising others to try their best to get any kind of loan before settling for Spartan.

4) s&a, I think things may have gotten alot worse since you were at Spartan as far as rotation availability. It is not your job to be up on this at this time because you are done already, but I really think you had it better when you were in school. I am talking about my own experience.

Thank you all for your kind comments.

[shockandawe]

blondeshedoc,

Thank you for your nice comments and I agree that it would be nicer to do more PE than geriatrics and sexuality which is a joke. I'm sorry to hear that the rotation situation is not as good. The hard part really is just the cores. The electives should be easy to get. Good luck, -s&a

[wolfvgang22]

Also, everyone knows that Jackson Park is a JOKE and no one learns anything there. Jackson is the place that Spartan's many non-serious students go just to say that they are still in medical school. This is probably the same group that goes on to never pass any of the Steps
This coincides with my own general gut feeling about Jackson Park after reading their website. Saba students can also go to Jackson Park, but none were there when the CA board inspected the clinical site. Maybe it's to be avoided?