Transfers?

[coolest35]

Hopefully someone can help me out here...give me some insight/advice.

I was thinking of transferring into the clinical rotations program.

A profile of me to give you an idea of what I'm dealing with:
US citizen, Finishing 2nd Yr Med School in Feb 10 (IMED listed, in India)

Doing well in school, however, it's a "5 1/2" year course here.
On top of that students spend an extra 1 year to clear Step 1 and 2.
Based on the timing of the normal residency match, you're looking at 7 years between start of med school and start of residency. With the transfer, I'm shrinking that by 1-2 years, and I'm getting US clinical exposure.In India, you have classes for 4.5 years along with clinicals for 3.5 years.

My option is to join AUC's 5th semester.. Transfer all of my pre-clinical subjects (although I've already been on rotations in India for a year now). And after (hopefully) clearing Step 1, I'd continue green-book hospitals.

Does this seem worth the effort? Do the US clinicial experience and the US physician recommendations justify transferring into the AUC Clinical Program?

[slevit1]

Hopefully someone can help me out here...give me some insight/advice.

I was thinking of transferring into the clinical rotations program.

A profile of me to give you an idea of what I'm dealing with:
US citizen, Finishing 2nd Yr Med School in Feb 10 (IMED listed, in India)

Doing well in school, however, it's a "5 1/2" year course here.
On top of that students spend an extra 1 year to clear Step 1 and 2.
Based on the timing of the normal residency match, you're looking at 7 years between start of med school and start of residency. With the transfer, I'm shrinking that by 1-2 years, and I'm getting US clinical exposure.In India, you have classes for 4.5 years along with clinicals for 3.5 years.

My option is to join AUC's 5th semester.. Transfer all of my pre-clinical subjects (although I've already been on rotations in India for a year now). And after (hopefully) clearing Step 1, I'd continue green-book hospitals.

Does this seem worth the effort? Do the US clinicial experience and the US physician recommendations justify transferring into the AUC Clinical Program?

I'd say it's absolutely worth it, if you want to practice in the US. However, I'd be surprised if they let you start in 5th semester and didn't make you start over.

[Itempest]

Agree with Slevit. If practicing in the US is the end goal, such a switch may well be worthit. But in may be more involved than you realize, particularly with having to start over basic sciences. Also, I understand things begin a little differently in India. Do you have a bachelor's degree or did you enter Med school right after your +2 (12th grade)?

[coolest35]

I actually started right after high school. I would be eligilbe to write the Step 1, but understand that AUC offers some prep stuff, so I thought that might prove beneficial. Would it help if I applied for a transfer after taking the step 1?

On a Side Note: I spoke to a representative of another school regarding this matter, and I'm not sure if they gave me a ** answer. They said "because I do not have undergraduate credits, my chances of practicing in the US would be very difficult, as seen by the low match rates of the Indian Med Graduates".. I passed this off as complete **, and asked him what the purpose of the Board exams were and he said that they also take undergrad into consideration. So everything he said was ** right?

[Lemacfar]

If your eligible to take step 1, I would suggest you take it and then apply to AUC,SGU, and ROSS. I've heard of 2nd and 3rd tier students from other caribbean schools transferring to the "big 3" after Step 1.

I would also consider the financial aspect of transferring. You say your from India right? You would not be eligible for federal loans and thus would have to come out of pocket in order to pay for tuition/living

[Lemacfar]

I actually started right after high school. I would be eligilbe to write the Step 1, but understand that AUC offers some prep stuff, so I thought that might prove beneficial. Would it help if I applied for a transfer after taking the step 1?

On a Side Note: I spoke to a representative of another school regarding this matter, and I'm not sure if they gave me a ** answer. They said "because I do not have undergraduate credits, my chances of practicing in the US would be very difficult, as seen by the low match rates of the Indian Med Graduates".. I passed this off as complete **, and asked him what the purpose of the Board exams were and he said that they also take undergrad into consideration. So everything he said was ** right?

I don't think undergrad has a lot to do with your acceptance into a residency program but you could ask someone who is up at that level

[coolest35]

If your eligible to take step 1, I would suggest you take it and then apply to AUC,SGU, and ROSS. I've heard of 2nd and 3rd tier students from other caribbean schools transferring to the "big 3" after Step 1.

I would also consider the financial aspect of transferring. You say your from India right? You would not be eligible for federal loans and thus would have to come out of pocket in order to pay for tuition/living
That's what I was thinking, perhaps the Step 1. But wouldn't it make sense to join in for the semester where they would be helping us prep for Step 1? After all I think they would make me do a semester before going onto clinicals anyways. As for the Big 3, I looked on their website, and it states that I also need to fulfill any requirements that are needed for first time applicants, which includes Undergrad Credits. I'm not sure if there is an exception if you've written the Step 1. If anyone can update me?

As for my legal status, I'm a permanent resident of the US. So I guess I would be eligible.

[Mich2go]

I don't think undergraduate is required for "training license" which is required for residency...but many states (not sure exactly how many) require at least 60 hours of undergraduate coursework in prerequisites, some require 90 hours...for an unrestricted license.

Training license is easier to get and I have seen stories here on VMD where it is possible to do a residency in a state where one cannot get permanent licensure.

Be careful...you dont want to be in a position where you would be blocked due to undergrad hour requirement.

There are some med schools in the carib who accept students directly out of HS...very bad for them in the long run.

Likewise, if you consider doing premed outside of the US (to fulfill the undergrad requirement)...be absolutely sure that those schools are recognized...most if not all premed courses from the carib are not eligible to fulfill the undergrad requirement for unrestricted licensure.

[coolest35]

Hmm, I wish you had told me that it was bad to go right out of HS 3 years ago! :)

As for right now, I highly doubt I'd go back to do undergrad, especially when I can go the conventional route and write my boards and try and match like all the other guys from Asian Med. Schools. But I would be at a specific disadvantage as compared to Carribean Meds (no US clinical experience), so that's my biggest concern. I'm just trying to salvage the best I can right now, and I think that option (if available) would be transferring to a 2nd or even 3rd tier Carribean school just for clinicals.

Are there any other schools I should look at that allow transfers that would be similiar to mine? (No undergrad, +/- Step 1) I've looked at XAVIER, IAU, AUA, I ''accidentally'' called the Destiny guy's, and they seem MORE than interested in getting me on board haha.

When I called up SABA, I was told to email a rep. with info regarding why I wanted to transfer and such.

[medguy]

I am certainly not an authority on this. But I think that if you are in med school in another country that accepts out of high school (and i believe most of these programs are 6 years) that would satisfy the undergraduate credit hours requirement.

It sounds like you're trying to shave a couple of years off. You really need to research this thoroughly. Don't jump into a 2nd or 3rd tier school. I'm sure they would be happy to take you but you may end up hurting yourself in the long run. Make sure you would satisfy requirements in the U.S.

Now, you're a green card holder so there is no visa issue. That gives you a boost even if you finish in India. Just do well on your boards.

Now to your statement that in India it will take you about 7 years. You're still a year ahead. In the states it takes 8 years (undergrad +).

Just be very careful.

[Banyo King]

I seem to remember reading about situations similar to yours on these boards before. Try doing a search using relevant terms, hopefully something will pop up.

If my memory serves me correctly, I don't think you'll be successful getting into the more reputable Caribbean schools because you lack the undergraduate coursework. True, you have undergraduate coursework from your medical school, but does it include one year of general biology, chemistry, organic chemistry, and physics? If it does, then you probably have a shot. If not, I don't think they'll accept you. I know it seems nonsensical not to accept someone who has proven their aptitude for medical science in favor of someone who has taken the usual pre-med courses, but that is how I remember it (it is exactly the absurdity of requiring of premed prereqs for medical school transferees which made it stick in my memory!)

And if you're applying to the "Big 4," you would certainly have to take the MCAT, even as a transfer. I clearly remember that.

I don't know the process for transferring in after taking Step 1, but I'd imagine it could only strengthen your case in regards to having premed prereqs waived. Good luck.

[coolest35]

I am certainly not an authority on this. But I think that if you are in med school in another country that accepts out of high school (and i believe most of these programs are 6 years) that would satisfy the undergraduate credit hours requirement.

It sounds like you're trying to shave a couple of years off. You really need to research this thoroughly. Don't jump into a 2nd or 3rd tier school. I'm sure they would be happy to take you but you may end up hurting yourself in the long run. Make sure you would satisfy requirements in the U.S.

Now, you're a green card holder so there is no visa issue. That gives you a boost even if you finish in India. Just do well on your boards.

Now to your statement that in India it will take you about 7 years. You're still a year ahead. In the states it takes 8 years (undergrad +).

Just be very careful.

I was trying to shave a couple of years off, and I still would be able to but it creates more of a problem in the end. By enrolling in a 2nd tier school, is it not alright if their rotations are all green book? I thought that was a deciding factor amongst other stuff.

As for 7 years vs. 8, in the event that I would lets say theoretically obtain the same board score as an average Caribbean Graduate, would it not be better for the Caribbean Graduate that he's got some relevant US clinical experience vs. me not having any? That's what the deciding factor here is. I just want to be better of in the end rather then short term. As for the board scores, I think i'm confident enough to say that i'll score in the low 90's atleast, not sure how that will compare once I write it next year.

I seem to remember reading about situations similar to yours on these boards before. Try doing a search using relevant terms, hopefully something will pop up.

If my memory serves me correctly, I don't think you'll be successful getting into the more reputable Caribbean schools because you lack the undergraduate coursework. True, you have undergraduate coursework from your medical school, but does it include one year of general biology, chemistry, organic chemistry, and physics? If it does, then you probably have a shot. If not, I don't think they'll accept you. I know it seems nonsensical not to accept someone who has proven their aptitude for medical science in favor of someone who has taken the usual pre-med courses, but that is how I remember it (it is exactly the absurdity of requiring of premed prereqs for medical school transferees which made it stick in my memory!)

And if you're applying to the "Big 4," you would certainly have to take the MCAT, even as a transfer. I clearly remember that.

I don't know the process for transferring in after taking Step 1, but I'd imagine it could only strengthen your case in regards to having premed prereqs waived. Good luck.

I searched thoroughly through the forum, but found really old threads regarding this stuff. You're right when it comes to getting into the Big 4 because they require undergrad course work. So I was mainly considering 2nd tier schools focusing on their clinicals only. I heard that if their rotations are all greenbook then I'd be fine.

As for taking Step 1, I thought so too. But then again I would be preparing for the exam by myself and then once I transfer I would have to trasnfer into a semester that is training students for the Step 1. So in end, i'm just paying for a semester that I wouldn't really need, so I thought it would be best if I were to transfer into that semester before I took the exam so that I could use the resourses. I guess it makes sense, but the admissions comittee doesn't seem too fond of the idea. No idea why. :doh:



Anyone have recommendations for "good" 2nd tier schools that I should consider for their clinicals? I looked through all of the forums, found that most of them were lacking one thing or another. The one that was keen on was XAVIER so far, I also looked at AUA but saw that their students had a ''wait time'' for certain rotations. How does AUC compare against these two?

[georgelucas45]

AUC > AUA > Xavier

In General, for US bound students:
1st tier = US MD school
2nd tier = US DO school
3rd tier = Big 4 Caribbean school
4th tier = The rest of the Caribbean schools

What you really mean to say is that you're aiming for a 4th tier school, not a 2nd tier school.

My current girlfriend is from Bangalore and went to medical school in India. For her, it was a 6 year program for the bachelors and MD. Afterwards, she took a year off for Step1/Step2 studying and scored 95/99. After that, she took another year off applying for residency and has a prelim spot in NY and a PM&R spot waiting for her in Chicago next year. It still took her 8 years to get into residency, same as it would take a US person going to AUC. But the plus side is that she doesn't have any loans hanging over her head. This is great because she can pay for all the things we do when we go out. I don't know the details of what transferring involves, but it seems that theres too much that can go wrong with your plan. I would suggest just staying in India, if you study for a whole year, you WILL do well on the steps. You can definitely make it to the US. Plus, once you get here, you can live like a king since you're not in debt. The ladies will flock to you. I suggest you join your local ILL chapter, or form your own if they don't have one at your school. It's the best way to meet singles.

[slevit1]

I disagree with US DO over Caribbean MD, but to each his own. There is really no such thing as a "good" second tier caribbean med school, and I don't think you should be looking at them. None of them have 50 state approval, which means you'll only be able to practice in certain states. Do you really want to be limited in where you can practice because of where you went to school?

[Lemacfar]

I wish I won the lottery for like 300k, no school debt would be the only thing I'd wish for these days

[coolest35]

AUC > AUA > Xavier

In General, for US bound students:
1st tier = US MD school
2nd tier = US DO school
3rd tier = Big 4 Caribbean school
4th tier = The rest of the Caribbean schools

What you really mean to say is that you're aiming for a 4th tier school, not a 2nd tier school.

My current girlfriend is from Bangalore and went to medical school in India. For her, it was a 6 year program for the bachelors and MD. Afterwards, she took a year off for Step1/Step2 studying and scored 95/99. After that, she took another year off applying for residency and has a prelim spot in NY and a PM&R spot waiting for her in Chicago next year. It still took her 8 years to get into residency, same as it would take a US person going to AUC. But the plus side is that she doesn't have any loans hanging over her head. This is great because she can pay for all the things we do when we go out. I don't know the details of what transferring involves, but it seems that theres too much that can go wrong with your plan. I would suggest just staying in India, if you study for a whole year, you WILL do well on the steps. You can definitely make it to the US. Plus, once you get here, you can live like a king since you're not in debt. The ladies will flock to you. I suggest you join your local ILL chapter, or form your own if they don't have one at your school. It's the best way to meet singles.

Well, its not only a factor of saving time. Along with that,there are several personal reasons as to why I want to transfer so badly. But I see where you are going with your point, and in a way you are correct. But right now, I think I've got my mind set on coming back to the North America.

I disagree with US DO over Caribbean MD, but to each his own. There is really no such thing as a "good" second tier caribbean med school, and I don't think you should be looking at them. None of them have 50 state approval, which means you'll only be able to practice in certain states. Do you really want to be limited in where you can practice because of where you went to school?

Yea, your right, almost none have certifications for places like Ca, Ny, etc. But overall my main target is to practice in Canada, which will be easier once I get a license over in the US (any state) and then write the FRCP / MCQEE Exams since going striaght to Canada is nearly impossible.