Wow Saba is getting super competitive!

[tieubao81]

Not to scare off potential applicants, but I submitted all of the materials needed to apply to SABA for September 2010 and all information was received on September 2nd. LOR, Transcripts, MCAT scores, PS etc... here it is September 3rd, and I got a rejection email? Wow, I would have liked for them to actually sit down and look at the application as a whole, like others who have posted on here. Anyways, my stats include: 3.469 gpa 3.21 s/gpa, 23-O MCAT, yeah I know it's low, but maybe next year. Maybe the fact that I put that I am a single parent and a veteran of the armed forces that turned them off. I guess I will email them what weaknesses I needed to improve on to better my application. Well on the bright side, I was extended an interview at Meherry Medical College in TN, on 12 Sep. Good luck future applicants!

[Shiz77]

Wow you got an interview to an American medical school and a rejection from Saba? Wow.

Well I guess what explains it is that Saba has a LOT of Canadian applicants w/ 3.7-3.8s. I know 4 people that have gone to Saba, all 4 were Canadian and all had GPA's of 3.7+. All 4 had applied two years in a row and were denied in Canada and now they are happy w/ Saba. Infact one of them just started an FP residency in Kansas. The school is around 60-65% Canadian.

[sgMD]

Wow you got an interview to an American medical school and a rejection from Saba? Wow.

Well I guess what explains it is that Saba has a LOT of Canadian applicants w/ 3.7-3.8s. I know 4 people that have gone to Saba, all 4 were Canadian and all had GPA's of 3.7+. All 4 had applied two years in a row and were denied in Canada and now they are happy w/ Saba. Infact one of them just started an FP residency in Kansas. The school is around 60-65% Canadian.

yes it is true, in fact. Canadians have really good scores and yet they cannot get into a medical school in Canada (mostly Ontario students because unlike all other provinces, Ontario schools dont give their students priority of any sort!)...

regardless, the applicant who was rejected, are you sure you had all the pre-reqs including the volunteer hours? Saba usually rejects applicants right away if they do not fulfill the requirements....


Best of luck,

[tieubao81]

Oh yes, I've got all the pre-reqs out of the way, I am a Biochem major at Arizona State... uhh did 90+ hours at Maricopa Medical Center (county hospital) and shadowed 3 physicians. I am thinking, it's my low MCAT scores. I am still waiting for them to reply. The funny thing is, at the bottom of the rejection .pdf file I got, it said, they could forward my application to MUA-Nevis for free for me. I'm going to pass on that offer. But on a side note, it's good to hear SABA and the other top Caribbean schools are making it competitive to get into their schools, maybe now other residency programs and admins in the US can start taking these schools more seriously.

[Shiz77]

Hey tieubao81 can you keep us updated on why Saba rejected you, it would be interesting to find out. I cannot imagine any reason why you were rejected. And it cannot be your MCAT, it is not a requirement at Saba.

[devildoc8404]

Good luck with Meharry! That's better than any Carib option, anyway.

[tieubao81]

Hey tieubao81 can you keep us updated on why Saba rejected you, it would be interesting to find out. I cannot imagine any reason why you were rejected. And it cannot be your MCAT, it is not a requirement at Saba.

Yes absolutely, I'll keep you guys updated.

[azulpanther]

All 4 had applied two years in a row and were denied in Canada and now they are happy w/ Saba. Infact one of them just started an FP residency in Kansas. The school is around 60-65% Canadian.



Kansas ??? are you sure about that? Kansas has that 15 yr rule for medical schools. Saba is not 15 yrs old.

[mario345]

Wow you got an interview to an American medical school and a rejection from Saba? Wow.

Well I guess what explains it is that Saba has a LOT of Canadian applicants w/ 3.7-3.8s. I know 4 people that have gone to Saba, all 4 were Canadian and all had GPA's of 3.7+. All 4 had applied two years in a row and were denied in Canada and now they are happy w/ Saba. Infact one of them just started an FP residency in Kansas. The school is around 60-65% Canadian.

apart from sharing the same feelings as the OP in regards to SABA's changing standards, what you have brought up is also quite an interesting point.
call it stupidity or ignorance on behalf of the CDN government, it is UNFAIR for students go through TOUGH undergrad programs in Ontario (UT, queens, Mac) and not be able to make it to medical school because their GPA was only 3.6 instead of a 3.8. :rolleyes:
I guarantee you that a person from York Univ. with a liberal arts degree and a 3.95 GPA is almost guaranteed acceptance than a student with a 3.65 GPA specialist life sciences who probably worked his butt off in those 4 years. I know this because the of OT9 UT meds class president was from York and only took those two required science courses. here she was being supper jumpy and excited and giving 'advice' to 3rd year kids who obviously had taken more science courses than her. anyways...
There is nothing else in this planet that makes me more angry than these ridiculous policies which are OVERTLY unfair.

it suits the cdn government well. sure, do NOT accept good students into your medical schools. you are losing big time on young, talented physicians, esp. since a lot of them go down to states after they finish their schooling in canada anyway. and then dont complain about how in some town in manitoba there is a only 1 foreign MD who doesnt speak the same dialect of english as the 600 patients he is carrying all by himself.

no thanks.

ummmreeka all the way. ;);)

[mario345]

Kansas ??? are you sure about that? Kansas has that 15 yr rule for medical schools. Saba is not 15 yrs old.
he probably meant kansas city, missouri...
http://www.saba.edu/saba/images/Forms/2009_residency.pdf

[mario345]

Oh yes, I've got all the pre-reqs out of the way, I am a Biochem major at Arizona State... uhh did 90+ hours at Maricopa Medical Center (county hospital) and shadowed 3 physicians. I am thinking, it's my low MCAT scores. I am still waiting for them to reply. The funny thing is, at the bottom of the rejection .pdf file I got, it said, they could forward my application to MUA-Nevis for free for me. I'm going to pass on that offer. But on a side note, it's good to hear SABA and the other top Caribbean schools are making it competitive to get into their schools, maybe now other residency programs and admins in the US can start taking these schools more seriously.
i think part of it is maybe that you applied for a september semester. i guess the accepting GPA is higher for sept than jan and may only because more people apply for it.
i looked at Meharry...i dont know why I myself didnt apply there ;)

if you get it, go there...coz as they say, the worst american D.O school is better than the best foreign school (caribbean or other). :)

[TEXAG]

I submitted all of the materials needed to apply to SABA for September 2010 and all information was received on September 2nd

well it looks like you applied a little late--that may be why you got rejected. most of the seats probably filled up by the time your file was complete.

[Shiz77]

Even if the OP applied late they would have been offered an interview for Jan or May.

Saba is approved in Kansas. It's more than 15 years old. It's even on the Kansas Medical board website KSBHA - (http://www.ksbha.org/medicalschoolsapprovedunapproved.html)

And finally yes the system sucks but there's nothing you can do about it. There are programs like McMAster Health Science where most people get 3.9s for 'inquiry' courses and it's a joke program. The MCAT is supposed to be an equalizer but a lot of schools think all programs are equal, I don't know what hash school admissions are smoking but it's defn BC bud.

Here's an example of unfairness, two friends of mine, one w/ a 3.75 GPA from a really easy program, had the gift o the gab, wrote the MCAT 3 times got below 25 each time. Got into Ottawa right away as it does not require MCAT. Another friend, 3.6 GPA from Biochem, got a 38 on the MCAT and got rejected. Tried again and got rejected. Almost went to Ireland but got into Western last minute. His brother had a 3.7 in Genetics, got rejected. Went to Austrailia after doing masters and being rejected again and is now doing his nephro fellowship in NY. I know someone in McMaster Med school who got 19 on the MCAT first try and a 21 on the second try, but she went to health sci so she had a 3.7. There are many examples of how ridiculous the system is. Plus they're heavily biased towards women which is kinda retarded as studies show women are more likely to leave medicine compared to men.

[tieubao81]

well it looks like you applied a little late--that may be why you got rejected. most of the seats probably filled up by the time your file was complete.

Late? You really think this is late too apply for medical school for admission in Sep 2010? I sent my application in mid August, but was not able to get all LOR and transcripts in until end of August, hence the 2 Sep final date. Most US medical schools, accept applications until Oct 31 and Nov 31. I think, I was rather early or well prepared for this application cycle.

Update: I got an email back from Dr. Alan B..... Director of admissions, apparently, my low grade point average eliminated me from being accepted. As I said before, this is a good thing for Saba and other Caribbean schools. They don't just accept anyone into their medical schools... and this competitiveness makes their school a little bit more prestigious.

[Shiz77]

3.5 is too low???? :S:S

[tieubao81]

well I think it's more of the 3.21 science gpa that turned them off. oh well... I'll just keep applying to other schools... hopefully I can get into one.

[sgMD]

apart from sharing the same feelings as the OP in regards to SABA's changing standards, what you have brought up is also quite an interesting point.
call it stupidity or ignorance on behalf of the CDN government, it is UNFAIR for students go through TOUGH undergrad programs in Ontario (UT, queens, Mac) and not be able to make it to medical school because their GPA was only 3.6 instead of a 3.8. :rolleyes:
I guarantee you that a person from York Univ. with a liberal arts degree and a 3.95 GPA is almost guaranteed acceptance than a student with a 3.65 GPA specialist life sciences who probably worked his butt off in those 4 years. I know this because the of OT9 UT meds class president was from York and only took those two required science courses. here she was being supper jumpy and excited and giving 'advice' to 3rd year kids who obviously had taken more science courses than her. anyways...
There is nothing else in this planet that makes me more angry than these ridiculous policies which are OVERTLY unfair.

it suits the cdn government well. sure, do NOT accept good students into your medical schools. you are losing big time on young, talented physicians, esp. since a lot of them go down to states after they finish their schooling in canada anyway. and then dont complain about how in some town in manitoba there is a only 1 foreign MD who doesnt speak the same dialect of english as the 600 patients he is carrying all by himself.

no thanks.

ummmreeka all the way. ;);)


couldn't agree more...

they are losing big time, not because I was not accepted to ontario MD schools, but because I see what kind of people get in and what kinds don't and it just makes me want to puke!... hey, if CDN dont give a damn about us, they cant expect us anything more than a 'damn' either!! OSAP gives us interest-free loans to study abroad and come back to canada! yeah right, no I am more happy with a more prestiguous residency spot with a higher income, and a nice weather and higher life standards in the US... they can keep those liberal arts students for themselves who cannot define the word 'science'... lack of critical thinking? shortage of physicians in canada? well, no wonder! .... goverments get what they deserve.

[utorontograd]

Wait, didn't the OP apply a year in advance for the September 2010 class? How late can that possibly be?

well it looks like you applied a little late--that may be why you got rejected. most of the seats probably filled up by the time your file was complete.

[rokshana]

if you get it, go there...coz as they say, the worst american D.O school is better than the best foreign school (caribbean or other). :)


umm its the worst US MD school is better than an off shore school...DO schools are another thing altogether (and the better DO schools MAY be an equal or better option...but even then...) DO grads are NOT US seniors (MD only there) they are independant applicants just like the rest of us...

[mario345]

umm its the worst US MD school is better than an off shore school...DO schools are another thing altogether (and the better DO schools MAY be an equal or better option...but even then...) DO grads are NOT US seniors (MD only there) they are independant applicants just like the rest of us...
UMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM, consider the following irrefutable facts that obviously put D.O. grads ahead among their 'independant' applicant peers.

1) they can apply to BOTH the AOA and the ACGME match.
2) They are U.S. trained in a 4 year program, which is NOT inferior to an allopathic school by any means. D.O. is equivalent to an M.D., regardless of what the conception is. They have pretty much the same training that M.D.s have and complete the same required residencies. Infact more DO's match into ACGME programs than AOA.
3) Common sense makes one think that more than 90% are U.S. citizens.

Therefore, they obviously have these significant advantages over any foreign grad.

I recently came to know the heirarchy that one program director uses for selecting residents, and it generally goes along with what the trends that we hear about - but no one specifically lays it out.
U.S./CDN grad (LCME approved schools)> D.O. grad from a U.S. school>U.S. IMG from Australia and Western European countries and 5th pathway students > U.S. IMG from top 4 Caribbean schools with strong U.S. letters >U.S. IMG from other countries (India most common) > CDN IMG requiring H1B > all other foreign grads.

[rokshana]

and this is an age old arguement...

yes DO applicants CAN apply to both, but the DO match is a month earlier than the allopathic match and if the match in the DO match (the easier match to match in), then they are required to withdraw from the NRMP match...so its not like they can wiegh their options and pick one . Most DO applicant who are applying to the NRMP match would list that their choice over a DO residency, so for them to take that option they will have to forego the DO match for the yr they are a senior and take their chancesin the allopathic match and then either scramble (in their equivilant) or wait out the year to apply to the DO match the following Feb. So unless you are looking at competitive residecnies (ortho is always the example given), then having the DO match optionisn;t such a big deal (and for those uber competitive residencies,the AOA system has far fewer spots than their ACGME counterpart).

i never said they are inferior but realistically, DOs are not seen any diffferently than I/FMG...both are options taken by people who couldn't get into a US MD program (there are of course those that truly believe the DO philosophy, but the majority of DO students are MD wannabes)and different programs view the 2 differently...there are programs that view the 2 the same and interview applicants from the 2 at the same rate...then there are programs that favor the IMG over the DO applicant and there are programs that favor the DO applicant over the IMG...just because you have a friend of a friend that tells you that his program favors DOs over IMGs doesn't make that the gold standard...my program for example took NO DOs in the last match...but took a few F/IMGs (though we are predominantly an AMG program) .
And Austrailan IMGs are not looked at in any greater favor than other IMGs...IMG is IMG...the difference between IMG and FMG are more visa issues...in fact an FMG with a GC or citizenship may be looked upon more favorably than IMGs from off shore schools , simply becasue they are grads from domiciled schools...they are trhe cream of their country's crop...they have no problemswith english and no visa issues...they will receive invites. And 5th pathway exists no more and really again NO different (if not less)than an IMG from a caribbean offshore (just take a look at UAG's match list...its was like 40 last year...and they have waaay more than 40 gradss...UAG is the only school left really that used 5th pathway).

the trend IS that there are more and more USMD grads coming out and it is getting harder as an IMG to get those residency spots, but it is NOT because DO are getting more of the allopathic spots...IMG off shore with US citizenship or GC will have essentially the same shot.

4-5 years ago i would have said there is no real difference with the ability to get a residency spot coming from the caribbean or a DO school and pick which is best suited to you (its what I and many others here did when having to choose between DO and offshore accptances and chose off shore)...now the only reason i would say that DO may be a greater consideration would be that at least you have the fall back position of a DO residency (becasue as you states, there are more DOs trying to get MD residency spots and they are leaving tons of DO spots unfilled) and that at least is a guarantee that you can eventually practice in the US, but not because your shot at an allopathic residency is better as a DO. But don't believe for one moment that DOs are somehow looked at as better than off shore MD...both have their stigma.

IMHO those unfilled DO spots should be open to MD applicants...like you said there isn't much difference between the 2 and and MD student could easily do well on the COMLEX and take a seminar on OMM...mistake was back in the day of the ACGME allowing the AOA it breech their territory.

I have been through the process from applying to USMD , DO, and offshore programs, going on the interview trail, and am in residency...work alongside USMDs, DOs, and I/FMGs and ultimately there isn't much of a difference (there are some that are great and some that are horrible, the 2 letters behind their names doesn't give you a heads up).

UMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM, consider the following irrefutable facts that obviously put D.O. grads ahead among their 'independant' applicant peers.


1) they can apply to BOTH the AOA and the ACGME match.
2) They are U.S. trained in a 4 year program, which is NOT inferior to an allopathic school by any means. D.O. is equivalent to an M.D., regardless of what the conception is. They have pretty much the same training that M.D.s have and complete the same required residencies. Infact more DO's match into ACGME programs than AOA.
3) Common sense makes one think that more than 90% are U.S. citizens.

Therefore, they obviously have these significant advantages over any foreign grad.

I recently came to know the heirarchy that one program director uses for selecting residents, and it generally goes along with what the trends that we hear about - but no one specifically lays it out.
U.S./CDN grad (LCME approved schools)> D.O. grad from a U.S. school>U.S. IMG from Australia and Western European countries and 5th pathway students > U.S. IMG from top 4 Caribbean schools with strong U.S. letters >U.S. IMG from other countries (India most common) > CDN IMG requiring H1B > all other foreign grads.

[rokshana]

Late? You really think this is late too apply for medical school for admission in Sep 2010? I sent my application in mid August, but was not able to get all LOR and transcripts in until end of August, hence the 2 Sep final date. Most US medical schools, accept applications until Oct 31 and Nov 31. I think, I was rather early or well prepared for this application cycle.

you are certainly eary for the caribbean, but for the US MD cycle????!!! NO you are most certainly not early....if you wait for the oct/nov deadlines for US schools to submit your AMCAS, you are going to be interviewing for waitlist spots at best...US schools start interviewing in sept and by Dec have given enough acceptances to fill their classes...interviewing after that is for a waitlist spot unless you are very competitive (but then if you were competitive, you would have gotten an interview earlier). For the US cycle, that AMCAS needs to be sent the 1st day in JUNE that AMCAS opens...you should be getting and have filled out secondaries by now and really have started to get interview invites.

good luck with the Meharry interview..and if you get accepted take it! Meharry is ranked dead last (and frankly you may actually get better prep at some of the better caribbean schools), but the designation as US senior when applying to residency will serve you well.

[Experienced]

couldn't agree more...

they are losing big time, not because I was not accepted to ontario MD schools, but because I see what kind of people get in and what kinds don't and it just makes me want to puke!... hey, if CDN dont give a damn about us, they cant expect us anything more than a 'damn' either!! OSAP gives us interest-free loans to study abroad and come back to canada! yeah right, no I am more happy with a more prestiguous residency spot with a higher income, and a nice weather and higher life standards in the US... they can keep those liberal arts students for themselves who cannot define the word 'science'... lack of critical thinking? shortage of physicians in canada? well, no wonder! .... goverments get what they deserve.

It's better than it was 5 years ago when NO Canadians could do rotations in Canada, much less a residency, after attending a Caribbean school. Saba now has several students (due mostly to their own hard work) who are doing clinicals in the Maritimes, esp N.S.

Meanwhile, Sint Eustatius (Statia) SOM has been approved for OSAP loans so if Saba gets too choosy, you Maple Leaf guys can apply to Statia.

E.

-

[Dr. Jay]

good luck with the Meharry interview..and if you get accepted take it! Meharry is ranked dead last (and frankly you may actually get better prep at some of the better caribbean schools), but the designation as US senior when applying to residency will serve you well.[/QUOTE]






Dead last? Where did you get that stat from?

[rokshana]

good luck with the Meharry interview..and if you get accepted take it! Meharry is ranked dead last (and frankly you may actually get better prep at some of the better caribbean schools), but the designation as US senior when applying to residency will serve you well.

Dead last? Where did you get that stat from?

eh that is a pretty known rep...but the US senior part...that will amke up for the lowest of the low tier designation