Quest. about exam system in HU

[Scandiguy]

Hi,

I am considering applying to a Hungarian med school. However I would like some info on the exam system. I understand that 95% of exams are oral, I don´t really like that but maybe I could learn to perform in those.

Do you have 3 goes at a particular exam before one is forced to retake the whole year as I understand they have in Czech R.?

Thank you, Scandiguy

[cools]

Hi ,

In the first year first sem , the exams will be written , then from the second sem the oral exams will start. From second year onwards most of the exams have 2 parts. written and oral. You can't go into the oral part , until you pass the written. The only exception to this rule is , when you are on your C chance, when ... even if you fail the written , you will be allowed to go to the oral part of the examination.


Like in czech , you have 3 chances, A , B and C , before you are asked to repeat the whole year.

Also worth noting, that, if you fail subjects that, are not important prerequisite to the next year subjects, then you don't necessarily have to repeat one whole year, depending on the subject you fail. ( Its decided more or less based on the credit system. )



Hope .. this answers your questions.

Good luck

[Scandiguy]

Hi cools,

Thanks a lot, that was exactly the information I needed!

Scandiguy

[SwedenForTheWin]

Its clear that cools didnt study or studies in hungary.

Most exams are oral, there are a few exceptions like chemistry.
You have A, B and C chance. Once you have failed all 3, then you have failed the subject. However, dont think you always get A, B, and C chance in all subjects. Cause lately hungary universities accept more students than they have room for. Result in some cases are that you wont even get B chance.

Oral exams in hungary are really bad, why? Teacher decides from his head what he wants to ask you. He can fuck you bigtime, and this is the case for most students. Dont think they follow some kind of standard like civilized countries.

Hungary is a old communist country, they broke free themselves from communism not to long ago. Alcoholism dominates in hungary, #3 in the world when it comes to alcohol consumption. Teachers, professors, doesnt matter, all of them drink a lot.

Because of oral exams, if you dont agree with the teacher. You want to complain, you cant show shit, cause its oral, what are you going to complain about? You have no proof. In written exam you do.

For instant, when I studied dentistry there. Head of department of dentistry asked my friend (you are always 3 students in each examroom), who gets oral cancer?
My friend said, people who smoke, use other kind of tobaco, etc etc. He said no, poor people get oral cancer. And my friend got failed. This is not something I make up, how fucked up this can sound to you, its reality.

If you fail a subject in hungary, you automaticlly lose a year. Why? Lets say you fail biology the first semester. Second semester anatomy starts. You wont be able to take anatomy and histology leassons second semester, cause you need to pass biology the first semester to do so.

And you have to wait 1 whole year before you are able to retake the biology course you failed. And it costs a shitload, even if you just need to take 1 subject for 1 semester.

Hungary is a joke. I dont know 1 student who has passed dentistry in 5 years or medicine in 6 years here, without repeating a year or more. You could do it before, but because of the massive amount of students who apply to hungary now each year, they have raised the bars. 2 years ago it was 60% to pass physics, now its 85%.

I know students who has been there 10 years but are on the 5th year medicine.
Another student who has been there 4 years but arent even done with her second year. I know this american girl and her brother, who has been there like 5 years, and are still on the second year. This is normal and reality. Dont think for a second they are bad students. They do study, if they had studied in another country, they would have made it.

I know this girl who is a pharmacist, she has a 4 year degree. But decided to study medicine after she got it. She failed PHARMACOLOGY, not because she is stupid or because she is a bad student. But like I said earlier, there is no justice in hungarian school system.

[kristo]

For your information, SwedenForTheWin, I do believe cools is or at least was a student of DOTE. I can confirm everything cools said.

However, some of the stuff SwedenForTheWin says is also true. Some of it is garbage and some of it are exaggerations, but some is true.

Most exams are oral, there are a few exceptions like chemistry.
You have A, B and C chance. Once you have failed all 3, then you have failed the subject. However, dont think you always get A, B, and C chance in all subjects. Cause lately hungary universities accept more students than they have room for. Result in some cases are that you wont even get B chance.

First of all, as Cools said, most of the exams in the first two years are written. The only oral exams are in anatomy (all), histology, embryology, physiology, and biochemistry (only final exam).

Students will usually have six weeks to get their exams done. They decide themselves how they use those six weeks. If the exam period is over and you have not taken an exam (be it A, B, or C chance), then yes, you do not get that chance. However, this is known from the start. You are responsible for organizing your own exam period.

It can be tough getting an exam date if you don't organize yourself well beforehand, as in, you might have to wait a bit for a B chance if you apply late. However, I've never heard of anyone not getting a chance if they want it and have time for it within the exam period. The departments simply add more exam slots or even exam days when necessary.

I finished second year at DOTE this spring. The longest I have ever taken to finish all my exams was in the end of first year, two and a half weeks. Those six weeks usually prove to be ample for most students.

Oral exams in hungary are really bad, why? Teacher decides from his head what he wants to ask you. He can making babies you bigtime, and this is the case for most students. Dont think they follow some kind of standard like civilized countries.

I have taken about a dozen oral exams at DOTE. I have failed two SCTs, total (didn't do so well during the semester in anatomy I, but fixed it in the exam period). In none of those exams have I ever felt that I was being treated unfairly. A lot of students come out of oral exams saying "the professor asked me blah, blah, ridiculous question" and failed me because I couldn't answer it. The fact of the matter is, that the last few questions for those who fail are usually very difficult. Why? Because the professor is giving a student who did bad a chance to redeem him- or herself. Thinking, "well, he/she did bad to begin with, but I'll throw this in and if he/she can answer, then I'll forgive the initial slip-up and move on".
Usually, those students claim (and believe themselves) that this was their only mistake on the exam. Believe me, I've witnessed exams like this, they are not right on this.

Hungary is a old communist country, they broke free themselves from communism not to long ago. Alcoholism dominates in hungary, #3 in the world when it comes to alcohol consumption. Teachers, professors, doesnt matter, all of them drink a lot.

Because of oral exams, if you dont agree with the teacher. You want to complain, you cant show pooh pooh, cause its oral, what are you going to complain about? You have no proof. In written exam you do.

Alcoholism is a huge public health problem in the country. However, at DOTE, I have only known two teachers who had this problem affect their work. Granted, that's two to many, but it's hardly "all of them". One of the people I'm referring to does not do oral exams. The other one does, but is being phased out. Has already been dismissed from his former prestigous position.

I agree, in an oral exam you can't debate the matter afterwards. However, there is a witness in all final examinations, so that gives you a fighting chance. The fact of the matter is, however, that the examiner has been doing research on this material for decades. The examinee is not likely to be able to answer a question decided by the examiner in a way that is correct in reality but incorrect according to the examiner.

I dislike written exams in some of DOTE's departments immensely, however. Written tests in the dept. of Anatomy are usually very badly corrected, in a hurry and often unfairly. This is a problem, but since their only written exams are in neurobiology and actually are only for a miniscule part of the material, it doesn't really matter that much. Bloody irritating, though.
Also, tests from the dept. of Biochemistry and Molecular Biology are usually very difficult and sometimes badly worded. They have been getting better, though.

For instant, when I studied dentistry there. Head of department of dentistry asked my friend (you are always 3 students in each examroom), who gets oral cancer?
My friend said, people who smoke, use other kind of tobaco, etc etc. He said no, poor people get oral cancer. And my friend got failed. This is not something I make up, how making babiesed up this can sound to you, its reality.

I'm 100% sure that student did not fail because of that question. He failed because he didn't know the material well enough, as shown by his performance on the whole test. Taking just one question out of context and putting it up on an Internet forum does not change that. If you do badly on a test, sit down, open your book and rock the next one. It really is simple as that.

If you fail a subject in hungary, you automaticlly lose a year. Why? Lets say you fail biology the first semester. Second semester anatomy starts. You wont be able to take anatomy and histology leassons second semester, cause you need to pass biology the first semester to do so.

And you have to wait 1 whole year before you are able to retake the biology course you failed. And it costs a pooh poohload, even if you just need to take 1 subject for 1 semester.

True. I'm assuming you're talking about cell biology here, as opposed to molecular biology. They do give you 50% discount from the tuition fees if you're only taking one or very few subjects (ECTS credits), but it's still a lot of money. Also, the way the system is with prerequisites, if you fail almost any subject, it will delay you for a year.
However, you do have six weeks, plus two weeks in the autumn, to do your 3 chances - make the most of them.
Knowing this about the school is important, though.

Hungary is a joke. I dont know 1 student who has passed dentistry in 5 years or medicine in 6 years here, without repeating a year or more. You could do it before, but because of the massive amount of students who apply to hungary now each year, they have raised the bars. 2 years ago it was 60% to pass physics, now its 85%.

We obviously don't hang around with the same people. I know loads that either graduated this spring or will graduate this autumn who have done it without being delayed.
If it's biophysics you're referring to, then no, it's still 60%.

We do agree, however, that a lot of people fail. Especially in the first two and even three years. Why? Because medical school is difficult! In a school that admits just about anyone and gives them a chance to prove themselves, a lot of people will fail. That's just the name of the game. In most countries, only people who have already had an excellent academic record are admitted into medical school. Of course, very few fail in medical school there.

I know students who has been there 10 years but are on the 5th year medicine.
Another student who has been there 4 years but arent even done with her second year. I know this american girl and her brother, who has been there like 5 years, and are still on the second year. This is normal and reality. Dont think for a second they are bad students. They do study, if they had studied in another country, they would have made it.

I know this girl who is a pharmacist, she has a 4 year degree. But decided to study medicine after she got it. She failed PHARMACOLOGY, not because she is stupid or because she is a bad student. But like I said earlier, there is no justice in hungarian school system.

Anecdotal, non-verifyable information. Yes, we all know people who have not done well on their exams. It's difficult and we often feel that they deserve better. The fact is that not everyone is cut out for this. Having said that, people often turn around after failing a year, put more work in, and excel. It's all about how much effort you put in.

[SwedenForTheWin]

For your information, SwedenForTheWin, I do believe cools is or at least was a student of DOTE. I can confirm everything cools said.

However, some of the stuff SwedenForTheWin says is also true. Some of it is garbage and some of it are exaggerations, but some is true.



First of all, as Cools said, most of the exams in the first two years are written. The only oral exams are in anatomy (all), histology, embryology, physiology, and biochemistry (only final exam).

Students will usually have six weeks to get their exams done. They decide themselves how they use those six weeks. If the exam period is over and you have not taken an exam (be it A, B, or C chance), then yes, you do not get that chance. However, this is known from the start. You are responsible for organizing your own exam period.

It can be tough getting an exam date if you don't organize yourself well beforehand, as in, you might have to wait a bit for a B chance if you apply late. However, I've never heard of anyone not getting a chance if they want it and have time for it within the exam period. The departments simply add more exam slots or even exam days when necessary.

I finished second year at DOTE this spring. The longest I have ever taken to finish all my exams was in the end of first year, two and a half weeks. Those six weeks usually prove to be ample for most students.



I have taken about a dozen oral exams at DOTE. I have failed two SCTs, total (didn't do so well during the semester in anatomy I, but fixed it in the exam period). In none of those exams have I ever felt that I was being treated unfairly. A lot of students come out of oral exams saying "the professor asked me blah, blah, ridiculous question" and failed me because I couldn't answer it. The fact of the matter is, that the last few questions for those who fail are usually very difficult. Why? Because the professor is giving a student who did bad a chance to redeem him- or herself. Thinking, "well, he/she did bad to begin with, but I'll throw this in and if he/she can answer, then I'll forgive the initial slip-up and move on".
Usually, those students claim (and believe themselves) that this was their only mistake on the exam. Believe me, I've witnessed exams like this, they are not right on this.



Alcoholism is a huge public health problem in the country. However, at DOTE, I have only known two teachers who had this problem affect their work. Granted, that's two to many, but it's hardly "all of them". One of the people I'm referring to does not do oral exams. The other one does, but is being phased out. Has already been dismissed from his former prestigous position.

I agree, in an oral exam you can't debate the matter afterwards. However, there is a witness in all final examinations, so that gives you a fighting chance. The fact of the matter is, however, that the examiner has been doing research on this material for decades. The examinee is not likely to be able to answer a question decided by the examiner in a way that is correct in reality but incorrect according to the examiner.

I dislike written exams in some of DOTE's departments immensely, however. Written tests in the dept. of Anatomy are usually very badly corrected, in a hurry and often unfairly. This is a problem, but since their only written exams are in neurobiology and actually are only for a miniscule part of the material, it doesn't really matter that much. Bloody irritating, though.
Also, tests from the dept. of Biochemistry and Molecular Biology are usually very difficult and sometimes badly worded. They have been getting better, though.



I'm 100% sure that student did not fail because of that question. He failed because he didn't know the material well enough, as shown by his performance on the whole test. Taking just one question out of context and putting it up on an Internet forum does not change that. If you do badly on a test, sit down, open your book and rock the next one. It really is simple as that.



True. I'm assuming you're talking about cell biology here, as opposed to molecular biology. They do give you 50% discount from the tuition fees if you're only taking one or very few subjects (ECTS credits), but it's still a lot of money. Also, the way the system is with prerequisites, if you fail almost any subject, it will delay you for a year.
However, you do have six weeks, plus two weeks in the autumn, to do your 3 chances - make the most of them.
Knowing this about the school is important, though.



We obviously don't hang around with the same people. I know loads that either graduated this spring or will graduate this autumn who have done it without being delayed.
If it's biophysics you're referring to, then no, it's still 60%.

We do agree, however, that a lot of people fail. Especially in the first two and even three years. Why? Because medical school is difficult! In a school that admits just about anyone and gives them a chance to prove themselves, a lot of people will fail. That's just the name of the game. In most countries, only people who have already had an excellent academic record are admitted into medical school. Of course, very few fail in medical school there.



Anecdotal, non-verifyable information. Yes, we all know people who have not done well on their exams. It's difficult and we often feel that they deserve better. The fact is that not everyone is cut out for this. Having said that, people often turn around after failing a year, put more work in, and excel. It's all about how much effort you put in.

You must have studied/study at semmelweiss correct? The capital university is the easiest one of the 4.

In the other 3 universities, everything is fucked. For example, when you study semester 1, you will have all the topics and syllbus on the semester 2 exam. Semmelweiss is the exception here. They only have it again when its the final.

So for example, if you study semester 1, cellbiology, lets say its 50 topics, you pass and move on to semester 2. You have cellbiology again, this time its 50 topics again for semester 2.

Semmelweiss works like this; You will only have test on the 50 new topics on the semester 2

The other 3 universities works like this: You will have the 50 new topics PLUS THE 50 OLD! Its a shitload of information, and they will fuck you in the ***, trust me.

Save yourselves, dont come to hungary. If you come here, make sure you pay yourself, so you dont get into debt for learning how fucked up a education system can be. Go to poland, ukraine, romania or any other country. You wont find a more fucked up system then hungary.

[SwedenForTheWin]

scandiguy, listen, i wish i had this kind of information before i went to hungary. Hungaries education SUCKS. Majority of the students will agree with me. The system is UNFAIR, thats why it sucks.

In histology and embryology (2 subjects with 1 test together), you are given 2 slides in histology that you should check up with a microscope and then tell the teacher what you see if you can recognize both slides, teacher will ask you on embryology, if you cant recognize your 2 slides, the teacher will fail you directly, to save time.

So, my friend and I are in the same room about to get examed, he goes first and couldnt recgonize ANY slide of the both. He didnt even know the name of the slides. What it was. Teacher helped him and he passed.

My turn, I recognized both my slides, BOTH, and did good on my embryology, but teacher failed me, cause i was "weak" on the histology part. Ok, lets put this into logic.

Person A cant even name his 2 slides, teacher helps, and he pass.

Person B knows his 2 slides with no help and he fails.



So much to say. So much to say. Lets take some other example, the guy up here who disagree with me on a few issues. Lets put some logic into what his saying.

Its true that for example sweden, only AAA students gets acccepted into medicine and dentistry. But others, like us, we dont have that kind of grades and have to go abroad. So, lets make a comparison.

Swedish student VS forgeiner student in hungary.

If you take the swedish exams from the first semester of medicine and dentistry and give it to the students in hungary who are on the same semester. The students in hungary will do pretty good.

Now, reverse it.

Give the hungarian tests to the swedish students, i am telling you, they wont be able to answer shit. Cause the exams in hungary are fucked up. Insted of asking questions about the most important things, they can go into details that no doctor on this planet even knows.

Save your time and money and dont go to hungary.

[kristo]

You must have studied/study at semmelweiss correct? The capital university is the easiest one of the 4.

No, this is not correct. I studied at DOTE the 2006-7 and 2007-8 academic years. I'm transferring to Iceland as of this coming academic year (2008-9).

In the other 3 universities, everything is making babiesed. For example, when you study semester 1, you will have all the topics and syllbus on the semester 2 exam. Semmelweiss is the exception here. They only have it again when its the final.

This is not true for DOTE. There, you study each semester's material in that semester, then you have all of it (or most of it, actually they are continually decreasing the material on final exams) on the final.

The other 3 universities works like this: You will have the 50 new topics PLUS THE 50 OLD! Its a pooh poohload of information, and they will making babies you in the ***, trust me.

Medical school is all about knowing a lot of information. That's how it is everywhere and you simply cannot avoid that if you want to become a doctor.

Save yourselves, dont come to hungary. If you come here, make sure you pay yourself, so you dont get into debt for learning how making babiesed up a education system can be. Go to poland, ukraine, romania or any other country. You wont find a more making babiesed up system then hungary.

It certainly sounds like you have had some bad experiences. I agree, many students don't do so good and are delayed for one or more years. This is sad, but as much as it pains me to say it, it is simply because those people did not do well on exams. Those who put in the work that this requires do well. That's simply how it goes. No use in crying about it if you don't do well.
Somebody once said; "If you get kicked in the ***, make sure you use it to get pushed forwards" (or something like that). The bottomline: Double your efforts and excel!

[kristo]

scandiguy, listen, i wish i had this kind of information before i went to hungary. Hungaries education SUCKS. Majority of the students will agree with me. The system is UNFAIR, thats why it sucks.

You know, some people always think it's unfair when they don't do well. They think it's the referee's fault when they lose a football game, the school's fault when they fail exams, etc.

I'm not saying you are one of those people, but the way you present yourself certainly would lead one to that conclusion. I recommend taking up another tone in your posts if you want to be taken seriously.

In histology and embryology (2 subjects with 1 test together), you are given 2 slides in histology that you should check up with a microscope and then tell the teacher what you see if you can recognize both slides, teacher will ask you on embryology, if you cant recognize your 2 slides, the teacher will fail you directly, to save time.

Actually, the embryology part is now separate, at least at DOTE's anatomy/histo/embryo final exam. Other than that, this is true. Do you believe this system is unfair?

So, my friend and I are in the same room about to get examed, he goes first and couldnt recgonize ANY slide of the both. He didnt even know the name of the slides. What it was. Teacher helped him and he passed.

My turn, I recognized both my slides, BOTH, and did good on my embryology, but teacher failed me, cause i was "weak" on the histology part. Ok, lets put this into logic.

Person A cant even name his 2 slides, teacher helps, and he pass.

Person B knows his 2 slides with no help and he fails.

As I mentioned in my first post on this thread, people who fail often do not know enough to know why they failed and someone else passed. They often only remember some points, believe those to be key points, and incorrectly assume that there is some kind of faulty or unfair logic at work, when there isn't.


Give the hungarian tests to the swedish students, i am telling you, they wont be able to answer pooh pooh. Cause the exams in hungary are making babiesed up. Insted of asking questions about the most important things, they can go into details that no doctor on this planet even knows.

And yet, a lot of people graduate every year. If you are so convinced that DOTE requires you to know more than other schools, hold your head up high and be proud - when you graduate, you know that you have accomplished more than any other doctor - right? :)

[SwedenForTheWin]

You know, some people always think it's unfair when they don't do well. They think it's the referee's fault when they lose a football game, the school's fault when they fail exams, etc.

I'm not saying you are one of those people, but the way you present yourself certainly would lead one to that conclusion. I recommend taking up another tone in your posts if you want to be taken seriously.



Actually, the embryology part is now separate, at least at DOTE's anatomy/histo/embryo final exam. Other than that, this is true. Do you believe this system is unfair?



As I mentioned in my first post on this thread, people who fail often do not know enough to know why they failed and someone else passed. They often only remember some points, believe those to be key points, and incorrectly assume that there is some kind of faulty or unfair logic at work, when there isn't.




And yet, a lot of people graduate every year. If you are so convinced that DOTE requires you to know more than other schools, hold your head up high and be proud - when you graduate, you know that you have accomplished more than any other doctor - right? :)

Let me put it in this way then so you understand. You say that so many students graduate each year. From which university are you talking about? We are talking about 10-20 students maximum who graduate each year. Is that a lot too you?

So, lets put it into simple english. Hungary has the highest procent of failrate in europe. There is a logic reason why. But you are trying to build up a picture in your mind that its because of the lazy students.

Go to romania or ukraine or somewhere else and see for yourself what the difference is. I have. I know.

[kristo]

Let me put it in this way then so you understand. You say that so many students graduate each year. From which university are you talking about? We are talking about 10-20 students maximum who graduate each year. Is that a lot too you?

I'm referring to DOTE, which is the only one I know from my own experience. The number you mentioned is not from DOTE, I can tell you that for sure.

So, lets put it into simple english. Hungary has the highest procent of failrate in europe. There is a logic reason why. But you are trying to build up a picture in your mind that its because of the lazy students.

Not exactly. I agree with you that the failure rate is high. Do you have anything to back up your claim that it's the highest in Europe?

What I believe to be the reason is that most medical schools in Europe (all except in Eastern Europe) have rather stiff entrance requirements. That means that most medical schools only admit students with relatively proven ability to do well on exams (not necessarily proven ability to become good doctors, but that's something for another thread).

Schools that admit another demographic will obviously get different results. One might even speculate that you should compare how many apply to the school vs. how many are admitted and graduate. Then you would have a more realistic comparison.

Go to romania or ukraine or somewhere else and see for yourself what the difference is. I have. I know.

I haven't gone there, so I can't say much. I can say, however, that the two countries you mentioned seem to have a bit shady reputation, so they might not be the best ones to compare against.

[SwedenForTheWin]

I'm referring to DOTE, which is the only one I know from my own experience. The number you mentioned is not from DOTE, I can tell you that for sure.



Not exactly. I agree with you that the failure rate is high. Do you have anything to back up your claim that it's the highest in Europe?

What I believe to be the reason is that most medical schools in Europe (all except in Eastern Europe) have rather stiff entrance requirements. That means that most medical schools only admit students with relatively proven ability to do well on exams (not necessarily proven ability to become good doctors, but that's something for another thread).

Schools that admit another demographic will obviously get different results. One might even speculate that you should compare how many apply to the school vs. how many are admitted and graduate. Then you would have a more realistic comparison.



I haven't gone there, so I can't say much. I can say, however, that the two countries you mentioned seem to have a bit shady reputation, so they might not be the best ones to compare against.


Sorry, here we can tell the difference. I know, I have been in many of the european countries to check out the universities. Only in hungary can you find classes with few students left after 1-2 years.

For example, I know a dentistry class in one of the universities in hungary where they are only 6 left on the second year from being 26 in the first year. 20 ppl are out.

In romania they dont even have a entrence exam or something, just apply and you get accepted. Still, droprate is not as high as in hungary. But in hungary you actully have a entrence exam (oral and written).

:)

Hungary sucks.

[kristo]

Sorry, here we can tell the difference. I know, I have been in many of the european countries to check out the universities. Only in hungary can you find classes with few students left after 1-2 years.

For example, I know a dentistry class in one of the universities in hungary where they are only 6 left on the second year from being 26 in the first year. 20 ppl are out.

In romania they dont even have a entrence exam or something, just apply and you get accepted. Still, droprate is not as high as in hungary. But in hungary you actully have a entrence exam (oral and written).

Actually, the entrance examinations for DOTE are oral only, no written.

What exactly is it that you're saying? That DOTE is more difficult than the others? In most academic circles, that's considered an advantage - it means that it's graduates are, on average, more knowledgeable.

I've already answered your comments on the exams being unfair...do you think the standard may simply be lower in the other countries you mention?

I don't think we're doing anyone any favors by recommending that they go to schools that have lower standards. We should encourage people to go where they can maximize their academic potential, somewhere where they will be challenged to be the best they can be. While I am by no means an authority on which school exactly that would be, it doesn't really sound right that the "easiest" school is the one we should be advocating for.

[SwedenForTheWin]

Actually, the entrance examinations for DOTE are oral only, no written.

What exactly is it that you're saying? That DOTE is more difficult than the others? In most academic circles, that's considered an advantage - it means that it's graduates are, on average, more knowledgeable.

I've already answered your comments on the exams being unfair...do you think the standard may simply be lower in the other countries you mention?

I don't think we're doing anyone any favors by recommending that they go to schools that have lower standards. We should encourage people to go where they can maximize their academic potential, somewhere where they will be challenged to be the best they can be. While I am by no means an authority on which school exactly that would be, it doesn't really sound right that the "easiest" school is the one we should be advocating for.


Listen. What the fu*k is it that you dont get?
Here is the difference btw hungary and sweden, I will tell you so you understand.

In any subject, pick one, lets say cellbiology. The swedish student knows that its impossible to memorize everything. Every little detail. Cause you have more then 1 subjects and you only have so much time.

So what the student will do is, study the most important things in cellbiology and focus on that. Cause that is what the teachers will ask about. Not some fucking stupid detail shit that not even the doctors in sweden can answer.

But in hungary this is impossible. Because of the retarded exam system and everything is up to your teacher. You can study 20 out of 50 topics in cellbiology and hope that you get 3 out of thoose 20. Its possible, many have done it. Others know 49 topics out of 50 but fail because they picked the only topic they didnt know.

I am just telling you, the hungarian education system has more flaws then windows vista. Everyone knows that.

What year are you in and what field?

[kristo]

Listen. What the fu*k is it that you dont get?
Here is the difference btw hungary and sweden, I will tell you so you understand.

Please don't make a fool of yourself online. Remember, all we have to gauge your character by here is what you post. You may be a very intelligent, well rounded individual, but when you post garbage and profanity, it does not emphasize your merits as a future doctor.

On a different matter; what makes you think medical students in Sweden don't study the same amount of details you do in Hungary? Have you ever studied medicine at a Swedish medical school?

In any subject, pick one, lets say cellbiology. The swedish student knows that its impossible to memorize everything. Every little detail. Cause you have more then 1 subjects and you only have so much time.

So what the student will do is, study the most important things in cellbiology and focus on that. Cause that is what the teachers will ask about. Not some making babiesing stupid detail pooh pooh that not even the doctors in sweden can answer.

Okay. We've established that you think the requirements in Hungary are too rigorous. Too detailed. More detailed than you need.

Now, I agree with you in one out of three. More specifically, I agree that in the basic sciences, they probably do teach you more than you, strictly speaking, need. I don't think this is necessarily a bad thing. In fact, it may even be regarded as a better bang for the buck.
You know, maybe we're both wrong about this. After all, neither one of us are doctors, yet, right? Maybe we simply underestimate the amount of cell biology a doctor needs. I know I found my previous studies of cell biology very helpful in histology, physiology and even biochemistry.

You obviously disagree with this. Let's just agree to disagree there.

Regarding the other two, well, I didn't think cell biology in first year was impossible. Most of my friends didn't either. 'Nuff said.

But in hungary this is impossible. Because of the retarded exam system and everything is up to your teacher. You can study 20 out of 50 topics in cellbiology and hope that you get 3 out of thoose 20. Its possible, many have done it. Others know 49 topics out of 50 but fail because they picked the only topic they didnt know.

We've already discussed this. You or people you know have had bad experiences in exams and believe it to be someone else's fault. I won't argue with you on this, I wasn't there.

I will say this, though; I spent two years at DOTE. I met a lot of people there. I noticed a trend. Those who put the most effort in do well and seem to be fairly content with the oral exams.
Those who put in less effort or have difficulties grasping the material do not do so well. Some of them, not all...actually, a minority of them, keep reporting bad experiences from exams. Unfair teachers, ridiculous questions, unfair grading. Always the same people.

Either you're one of those people, or you have somehow managed to consistently meet another set of professors from those me or my friends meet. Take your pick.

What year are you in and what field?

Just finished second year, general medicine. Never failed a subject. I guess that makes me a strange deviation from the norm, according to your statements?

[Back_To_School]

Let me put it in this way then so you understand. You say that so many students graduate each year. From which university are you talking about? We are talking about 10-20 students maximum who graduate each year. Is that a lot too you?

So, lets put it into simple english. Hungary has the highest procent of failrate in europe. There is a logic reason why. But you are trying to build up a picture in your mind that its because of the lazy students.

Go to romania or ukraine or somewhere else and see for yourself what the difference is. I have. I know.

There is also a more logical reason for the high failure rate that the previous poster has mentioned. The majority of students entering the English parallel courses throughout Europe were unable to gain entry to med schools in their home country for academic reasons and as Hungarian med schools practically accept anyone that applies to these fee paying courses, obviously the attrition rates are going to be extremely high.

Perhaps you should have done your research before going to Hungary and then their examinations wouldn't have been such a surprise. You say that the failings in their education system are so obvious therefore, you must not have spoken to any students studying on the course before you enrolled or they would have informed you of the difficulties.

How on Earth can you advise people to attend schools in Romania or Ukraine when you blatently hadn't done any research into schools in a country you were actually going to attend.

Stop whining and choose a career you can actually handle! If becoming a Doctor was easy everyone would be one!

[gawtti]

this topic is played out. every few months (usually following exam period) there is a new poster on here slamming the hungarian system. that's hillarious!:D

I must agree though that if you fail one of the major subjects you will be held back a year.


You must have studied/study at semmelweiss correct? The capital university is the easiest one of the 4.

In the other 3 universities, everything is making babiesed. For example, when you study semester 1, you will have all the topics and syllbus on the semester 2 exam. Semmelweiss is the exception here. They only have it again when its the final.

So for example, if you study semester 1, cellbiology, lets say its 50 topics, you pass and move on to semester 2. You have cellbiology again, this time its 50 topics again for semester 2.

Semmelweiss works like this; You will only have test on the 50 new topics on the semester 2

The other 3 universities works like this: You will have the 50 new topics PLUS THE 50 OLD! Its a pooh poohload of information, and they will making babies you in the ***, trust me.

Save yourselves, dont come to hungary. If you come here, make sure you pay yourself, so you dont get into debt for learning how making babiesed up a education system can be. Go to poland, ukraine, romania or any other country. You wont find a more making babiesed up system then hungary.

[Scandiguy]

Hmm, I am not sure I am "tough" enoungh for the Hungarian education system. They seem to expect a great deal of their students. Maybe that is considered good by some, but I know myself, I am an "average" student.

What about you students who have done fairly well there, are you "straight A students" or do you have some secret formula?

I will think about it some more.
But I would like to study in Hungary I have been there twice - I love Dreher.

[Back_To_School]

Hmm, I am not sure I am "tough" enoungh for the Hungarian education system. They seem to expect a great deal of their students. Maybe that is considered good by some, but I know myself, I am an "average" student.

Ditto. I like the idea of studying at a university with so much history but, I don't think I could go through the Hungarian system and keep my sanity. Where students find enough time to learn the language so they can get something out of clinicals is beyond me.

Full respect to the Doctors who have made it.

[whattupdog6969]

Listen. What the fu*k is it that you dont get?
Here is the difference btw hungary and sweden, I will tell you so you understand.

In any subject, pick one, lets say cellbiology. The swedish student knows that its impossible to memorize everything. Every little detail. Cause you have more then 1 subjects and you only have so much time.

So what the student will do is, study the most important things in cellbiology and focus on that. Cause that is what the teachers will ask about. Not some making babiesing stupid detail pooh pooh that not even the doctors in sweden can answer.

But in hungary this is impossible. Because of the retarded exam system and everything is up to your teacher. You can study 20 out of 50 topics in cellbiology and hope that you get 3 out of thoose 20. Its possible, many have done it. Others know 49 topics out of 50 but fail because they picked the only topic they didnt know.

I am just telling you, the hungarian education system has more flaws then windows vista. Everyone knows that.

What year are you in and what field?


you cannot discredit a system based upon allegations with no solidification here or elsewhere. There has to be sound and fundamental proof of so called flaws.

[SwedenForTheWin]

you cannot discredit a system based upon allegations with no solidification here or elsewhere. There has to be sound and fundamental proof of so called flaws.

Listen pumpkin, Ive been 2 years in hungary. I know everything about the system. If you go to any hungerian university and talk to 10 students, the majority will say the system sucks and tell you about the flaws ive mentioned.

But the posters in here must be university representives or the students posting in this thread doesnt want to hear critic. Imagen, they want to graduate from a university with a decent reputation, if people knew the system in hungary, the reputation would equal to the african universities where you can buy a degree from.

DONT GO TO HUNGARIAN UNIVERSITY, I havent meet 1 student so far in hungary who says they did a good thing coming to hungary. Cause once you get to hungary, sure you might think its a good option and all. But then you start meeting people who went to romania, ukraine and other countries and you understand how much harder hungary is compare to the other countries. And for 6 years, you will retake 1 or maybe 2 years. Good? No.

I would suggest ukraine or romania, its cheaper, people talk better english and educationsystem is much much fair. DONT GO TO HUNGARY.

I also want to mention one last thing.
Not to long ago, I went to the following countries to check out the educationsystem;

Poland
Ukraine
Romania
Slovakia
Cechz

All of the above is better then hungary. You have to learn as much as in hungary, but the examsystem is 10 times more fair compare to hungary.

Read what ive posted before if you dont know what I mean.
A student who knows 80% of a subject in hungary can fail a subject while another student who knows 20% of a subject can pass. Only in hungary.
Lottery university.

[african_child]

hi kristo,
Just wondering why you left DOTE. Wanted to know if it had anything to do with the school. Thanks.

[gawtti]

dude, you came to hungary because you couldn't get into any medical school in your own country, correct? if you hate it so much go to romania and leave us in peace.

there are so many posts on here detailing the many flaws the hungarian system has. we don't need another disgruntled student acting a fool on here. move on, let it go, please!!!!!!!!!

Listen pumpkin, Ive been 2 years in hungary. I know everything about the system. If you go to any hungerian university and talk to 10 students, the majority will say the system sucks and tell you about the flaws ive mentioned.

But the posters in here must be university representives or the students posting in this thread doesnt want to hear critic. Imagen, they want to graduate from a university with a decent reputation, if people knew the system in hungary, the reputation would equal to the african universities where you can buy a degree from.

DONT GO TO HUNGARIAN UNIVERSITY, I havent meet 1 student so far in hungary who says they did a good thing coming to hungary. Cause once you get to hungary, sure you might think its a good option and all. But then you start meeting people who went to romania, ukraine and other countries and you understand how much harder hungary is compare to the other countries. And for 6 years, you will retake 1 or maybe 2 years. Good? No.

I would suggest ukraine or romania, its cheaper, people talk better english and educationsystem is much much fair. DONT GO TO HUNGARY.

I also want to mention one last thing.
Not to long ago, I went to the following countries to check out the educationsystem;

Poland
Ukraine
Romania
Slovakia
Cechz

All of the above is better then hungary. You have to learn as much as in hungary, but the examsystem is 10 times more fair compare to hungary.

Read what ive posted before if you dont know what I mean.
A student who knows 80% of a subject in hungary can fail a subject while another student who knows 20% of a subject can pass. Only in hungary.
Lottery university.

[gawtti]

[quote=SwedenForTheWin;868810]Its clear that cools didnt study or studies in hungary. actually he does.

Most exams are oral this is a lie, cools is right. everything is written until second year (exception being anatomy-2nd sem), there are a few exceptions like chemistry.
You have A, B and C chance. Once you have failed all 3, then you have failed the subject. However, dont think you always get A, B, and C chance in all subjects. Cause lately hungary universities accept more students than they have room for. Result in some cases are that you wont even get B chance. this is an assumption. no concrete evidence to back it up.

Oral exams in hungary are really bad, why? Teacher decides from his head what he wants to ask you. He can making babies you bigtime, and this is the case for most students. Dont think they follow some kind of standard like civilized countries. from your demeanor i think you're one of those losers that think you deserve to pass a subject.

If you fail a subject in hungary, you automaticlly lose a year. Why? Lets say you fail biology the first semester. Second semester anatomy starts. You wont be able to take anatomy and histology leassons second semester, cause you need to pass biology the first semester to do so. this is common in the US where classes have pre-requistes before you can take it and so what? students know this beforehand. so, they should put more effort in trying to pass cell biology. may i add that i have a lot of classmates that were able to take anatomy, after failing cell biology. however, they have to put in a request to the dean.

clearly, if you plan to come to hungary....piece of advise, be humble and treat others as you would want to be treated and you'll do fine.
quote]

[SwedenForTheWin]

[quote=SwedenForTheWin;868810]Its clear that cools didnt study or studies in hungary. actually he does.

Most exams are oral this is a lie, cools is right. everything is written until second year (exception being anatomy-2nd sem), there are a few exceptions like chemistry.
You have A, B and C chance. Once you have failed all 3, then you have failed the subject. However, dont think you always get A, B, and C chance in all subjects. Cause lately hungary universities accept more students than they have room for. Result in some cases are that you wont even get B chance. this is an assumption. no concrete evidence to back it up.

Oral exams in hungary are really bad, why? Teacher decides from his head what he wants to ask you. He can making babies you bigtime, and this is the case for most students. Dont think they follow some kind of standard like civilized countries. from your demeanor i think you're one of those losers that think you deserve to pass a subject.

If you fail a subject in hungary, you automaticlly lose a year. Why? Lets say you fail biology the first semester. Second semester anatomy starts. You wont be able to take anatomy and histology leassons second semester, cause you need to pass biology the first semester to do so. this is common in the US where classes have pre-requistes before you can take it and so what? students know this beforehand. so, they should put more effort in trying to pass cell biology. may i add that i have a lot of classmates that were able to take anatomy, after failing cell biology. however, they have to put in a request to the dean.

clearly, if you plan to come to hungary....piece of advise, be humble and treat others as you would want to be treated and you'll do fine.
quote]

Since you are still studying in hungary, I guess its possible for people to pass since you seem to be slow minded.

There are 4 universities in hungary wihch has medicine in english.
The only exception in hungary is semmelweiss when it comes to exams.
But only for the first year or so, then the rest are oral like in the other universities.

Again, semmelweiss has the exception from all 4 universities that if you fail a subject you can still move on.

But here is the catch dickhead, during dec-jan the goverment/universities decided that all the universities should have the same rules.

So, it means semmelweiss has to adapt within the coming years to the other univs. Like this year is the last year you can come back in august and retake some exams. LAST YEAR. Next year it wont be possible.

So before you come and say "this is a lie this is a lie", please, just STFU for a minute and think that there are 4 universities. I am aware of the handicap rules they offer at semmelweiss, cause I have a cousin studying there.

But dont worry, they are gone soon.

[Scandiguy]

Hi everybody - No need to continue this thread. I think I have got the point, some are very much against and some are more pro the exam/educations system in HU. Thanks for giving your opinions! I could have done a search of the forum I guess, this topics seems to be recuring frequently - as mentioned.

[gawtti]

wow, how do you know i'm slow minded..****? welcome to the club!:) dote needs to REALLY do a better job of screening their applicants. the ONLY disgruntled students that come on here and talk s*** are the ones from dote.
i guess szollosi and the gang need to get their act together and give REAL people with brains a chance at becoming a doctor. just a thought. or, maybe the ministry of education need to step in and have a chat with the incompetent admissions board at dote. this is really annoying because these FEW bad apples are just hurting the good ones.

[kristo]

There are 4 universities in hungary wihch has medicine in english.
The only exception in hungary is semmelweiss when it comes to exams.
But only for the first year or so, then the rest are oral like in the other universities.

OK, I'll repeat myself. At DOTE, almost all tests in the first two years are currently written tests. The only oral ones are the physiology and biochemistry finals, and all anatomy tests, except the two written anatomy tests in neurobiology.

SwedenForTheWin, in another post you keep discrediting the Hungarian system as unfair and claim it to be a "lottery". Yet, in another post you admit to being an "average student" and that Hungarian schools are simply too difficult for you. You advise people to go the countries like Romania and even Ukraine, which have really shady reputations, to say the least, saying that they are easier. Who, exactly, do you think will benefit from such suggestions?

[kristo]

hi kristo,
Just wondering why you left DOTE. Wanted to know if it had anything to do with the school. Thanks.

Not really. I still think you can get quality education at DOTE. I just wanted to be a bit closer to my family, that's all.

[cools]

Thanks to everyone who agree to me and believe that I am a student at DOTE. I dotn need to prove to anyone that I actually study there.


but some statement of SwedenForTheWin (http://www.valuemd.com/members/swedenforthewin.html) are so worng... that it in itself proves , that he/she is not a student of DOTE

Lets say you fail biology the first semester. Second semester anatomy starts. You wont be able to take anatomy and histology leassons second semester, cause you need to pass biology the first semester to do so.

First of all there is no subject called biology at DOTE. If you mean to say CELL and MOL BIO , then they are only in 2nd sem. Yeah but you might have been a student long long ago , then they hadn't divided the BIOs ... that means that was more than 6 years ago and you info is very outdated. So please please don't argue and waste evryones time

[SwedenForTheWin]

Thanks to everyone who agree to me and believe that I am a student at DOTE. I dotn need to prove to anyone that I actually study there.


but some statement of SwedenForTheWin (http://www.valuemd.com/members/swedenforthewin.html) are so worng... that it in itself proves , that he/she is not a student of DOTE



First of all there is no subject called biology at DOTE. If you mean to say CELL and MOL BIO , then they are only in 2nd sem. Yeah but you might have been a student long long ago , then they hadn't divided the BIOs ... that means that was more than 6 years ago and you info is very outdated. So please please don't argue and waste evryones time

Im a student in another univ in hungary, not dote. Dote however has the worst reputation in hungary for bribes. It is widely known that Dote accepts students through bribes and some subjects are bribe-able.

I might also add that szeged, pecs and semmelweiss has a partnership when it comes to university. Debrecen doesnt. Its a bit different.

[kristo]

Im a student in another univ in hungary, not dote. Dote however has the worst reputation in hungary for bribes. It is widely known that Dote accepts students through bribes and some subjects are bribe-able.

I might also add that szeged, pecs and semmelweiss has a partnership when it comes to university. Debrecen doesnt. Its a bit different.

Again, I'm calling B S. See my reply in the "Hungary - complete rubbish" thread.

[ag51]

Swedish boy except all the other things you said about hungarian univeristies (comments I do not agree with) you did a reference to alcohol consumption of the Hungarian people.
They drink a lot BUT do not forget what happens on your own country and general on Scandinavian countries :

1)Everybody gets drunk.
2)High rate of people who put end to their life's.
3) Nobody uses condom.

[whattupdog6969]

scandiguy, listen, i wish i had this kind of information before i went to hungary. Hungaries education SUCKS. Majority of the students will agree with me. The system is UNFAIR, thats why it sucks.

In histology and embryology (2 subjects with 1 test together), you are given 2 slides in histology that you should check up with a microscope and then tell the teacher what you see if you can recognize both slides, teacher will ask you on embryology, if you cant recognize your 2 slides, the teacher will fail you directly, to save time.

So, my friend and I are in the same room about to get examed, he goes first and couldnt recgonize ANY slide of the both. He didnt even know the name of the slides. What it was. Teacher helped him and he passed.

My turn, I recognized both my slides, BOTH, and did good on my embryology, but teacher failed me, cause i was "weak" on the histology part. Ok, lets put this into logic.

Person A cant even name his 2 slides, teacher helps, and he pass.

Person B knows his 2 slides with no help and he fails.



So much to say. So much to say. Lets take some other example, the guy up here who disagree with me on a few issues. Lets put some logic into what his saying.

Its true that for example sweden, only AAA students gets acccepted into medicine and dentistry. But others, like us, we dont have that kind of grades and have to go abroad. So, lets make a comparison.

Swedish student VS forgeiner student in hungary.

If you take the swedish exams from the first semester of medicine and dentistry and give it to the students in hungary who are on the same semester. The students in hungary will do pretty good.

Now, reverse it.

Give the hungarian tests to the swedish students, i am telling you, they wont be able to answer pooh pooh. Cause the exams in hungary are making babiesed up. Insted of asking questions about the most important things, they can go into details that no doctor on this planet even knows.

Save your time and money and dont go to hungary.



they ask you things covered alot on USMLE for instance.

[LeanBack]

Biophysics in DOTE is 55 % to pass

[LeanBack]

AG51 - You Pwned him