should i write the MCAT? [Archive] - ValueMD Medical Schools Forum

View Full Version : should i write the MCAT?

r01k08

05-30-2008, 01:18 PM

Hi,

I have been accepted in SABA without writing my MCAT. now, i am just wondering if i should bother to write the MCAT?

Will the scores help me down the road?

Thanks!

Mike77

05-30-2008, 03:37 PM

if you want to apply to another school as a backup, yes. If you want to perform better at Saba, no.

If you want saba prep, do what i'm doing: Read an overview of the entire med school curriculum (e.g a USMLE prep book,etc.). It'll give you a foundation of knowledge to build upon. I'm also going to cover some anatomy. This is my advice, and yes, I expect to be flamed for it.

Boulderunner

05-30-2008, 03:48 PM

If you want saba prep, do what i'm doing: Read an overview of the entire med school curriculum (e.g a USMLE prep book,etc.). It'll give you a foundation of knowledge to build upon. I'm also going to cover some anatomy. This is my advice, and yes, I expect to be flamed for it.

I hate to burst your bubble but the best way to "prepare" for saba is to relax and enjoy the last free days of your life. I always find it interesting when students that havent even begun school yet are so eager to provide advice on how best to prepare or how to succeed etc...Im not trying to attack you but honestly do you really think that reading first aid is going to do anything for you but waste your time....

covarubious

05-30-2008, 04:00 PM

prestudy??? thats madness, madness i say! lol is it getting a lil warm in here? ;)

in response to the question though, if you got in forget the mcat. as far as i know you only need it to get into med school then never again.

if you want to apply to another school as a backup, yes. If you want to perform better at Saba, no.

If you want saba prep, do what i'm doing: Read an overview of the entire med school curriculum (e.g a USMLE prep book,etc.). It'll give you a foundation of knowledge to build upon. I'm also going to cover some anatomy. This is my advice, and yes, I expect to be flamed for it.

kryptik

05-30-2008, 04:12 PM

did you prestudy for college in highschool? i know i didnt. Although i think its not a bad idea to maybe go over some fundamentals such as glycolysis and such...maybe am wrong some feel free to correct me.

Mike77

05-30-2008, 04:15 PM

I hate to burst your bubble but the best way to "prepare" for saba is to relax and enjoy the last free days of your life. I always find it interesting when students that havent even begun school yet are so eager to provide advice on how best to prepare or how to succeed etc...Im not trying to attack you but honestly do you really think that reading first aid is going to do anything for you but waste your time....

well i am far from an expert on studying for med school, and I do respect your opinion as you clealy have more med school experience. However, I will tell you this much. If there is one thing I know how to do well, it is study. I have a degree in psychology, and I have spent 2 years tutoring uni kids on study skills, giving MANY presentations and workshops, and had to spend a significant amount of time learning the best techniques for long term retention, etc. Everything I know is based on a lot of studies that show the best way to learn, etc. I know that med school is different from undergrad, but you can't tell me that it's COMPLETELY different.

To read first semester books from beggining to end IS almost a complete waste of time. To read the main points, or the overview, of all the major topics is far from a waste of time. To enter every single course with the bigger picture and the main points well understood increases your confidence, and helps you put the informatio into a mental framework (dare I say 'schema'? :) ). DO NOT study the details, because unless you constantly review them, you will forget them. DO however, read the summaries on major topics in medical school because it actually increases your memory for the details when you do eventually learn them.

I know that you tihnk if you pre-study you'll burn yourself out, and yea, for some people that is the case. But if you're like me, have 6 months of working to do before you start, it's probably not a bad idea to read a few hours every week. Should you study 12 hours a day for the weeks before med school starts? Hell no. I plan on traveling for a month or two before I start med school.

Any good study skills instructor will tell you the first thing to do before reading a new chapter is to read the end of chapter summary first, and skim through the entire chapter to set up a framework. Having this will allow you to place these often abstract details into place, and will allow for a deeper consolidation of memory, thus increasing long term memory for the material.

I also have learned that nothing works for everyone, and so please keep this in mind. Do not tell me that when it comes time to do the first day of a histo lecture that I will be worse off by knowing the main details then some guy who's sitting in class thinking 'his... stol.. ogy? What's that?'.

You guys all had to take first year bio, right? Now imagine taking that with a Science 10 background only. They made the curriculum for bio 11/12 and first year bio that way for a reason :) .

Mike77

05-30-2008, 04:18 PM

prestudy??? thats madness, madness i say! lol is it getting a lil warm in here? ;)

in response to the question though, if you got in forget the mcat. as far as i know you only need it to get into med school then never again.

From what I understand, the residency match does NOT consider your mcat score at all, which was why I said don't bother. I should have clarified, sorry. Once youre in med school they have much more medical-specific knowledge that they care about, not broad biochem, organic, etc. knowledge.

kryptik

05-30-2008, 04:23 PM

Mike77

05-30-2008, 04:31 PM

Reading review books as Mike77 posted i think will be a waste of time, but skimming through textbooks i dont think will be a waste. Traveling and having fun with friends and family would be a great way to relax and put ones mind at ease before medschool too.

It really depends on the information. if you're reading a review book and have NO idea what it means, then it's a waste of time. If you can learn really broad facts about a subject, it's far from a waste of time. Perhaps summary chapters for most of the med school books would be better? But again, you're right, if you're confused by the review books, then don't bother.

covarubious

05-30-2008, 05:11 PM

learning is never a waste of time... as long as you are learning ;) remember, spending too much time with family tends to lead to long prison terms... or is that just my family?

Reading review books as Mike77 posted i think will be a waste of time, but skimming through textbooks i dont think will be a waste. Traveling and having fun with friends and family would be a great way to relax and put ones mind at ease before medschool too.

covarubious

05-30-2008, 05:17 PM

As your review book supplier I gotta agree with you! I solid base of knowlledge befor you begin couldn't possibly hurt you. Didn't hurt me in university. as long as you are not chained up in some dark dungeon forced to slave over a book then go for it. I'm still in undergrad so I have a ton of studying to do anyway. An extra book or two won't make much difference. ;)

It really depends on the information. if you're reading a review book and have NO idea what it means, then it's a waste of time. If you can learn really broad facts about a subject, it's far from a waste of time. Perhaps summary chapters for most of the med school books would be better? But again, you're right, if you're confused by the review books, then don't bother.

Mike77

05-30-2008, 07:09 PM

covarubious

05-30-2008, 07:19 PM

i was born burnt out. lol not too sure you are right on the assumtion part though. i was very clear in a previous post about only a lil bit of studying here and there and they still jumped all over me. lol

I think that most people against pre-studying in this forum are under the impression that you're going to be studying hardcore up to the start of beggining of the semester. If that is the case, then they are 100% right. That could defenitly lead to burnout

r01k08

05-30-2008, 10:02 PM

Thank you guys for your replies!

i am finishing my undergrad this december and starting saba in january, so i guess skimming through some books won't be bad...

with the mcat i was more concerned about the residency match...but since it's not considered why bother!

covarubious

05-31-2008, 01:27 AM

lol exactly. it would be an interesting challenge but why waste the time and money if you don't have to.

Thank you guys for your replies!

i am finishing my undergrad this december and starting saba in january, so i guess skimming through some books won't be bad...

with the mcat i was more concerned about the residency match...but since it's not considered why bother!

rokshana

05-31-2008, 02:26 AM

I think that most people against pre-studying in this forum are under the impression that you're going to be studying hardcore up to the start of beggining of the semester. If that is the case, then they are 100% right. That could defenitly lead to burnout

i am against pre-studying and not for the reason you state. Simply put what you wil "pre-study" over days or weeks, will be covered in a few days of your 1st semester...you will be studying for the next 4 years (well, 3 and a half :D), there is time enough for that when you get to med school...enjoy the time you have now with friends, family, your favorite restaurant....

and while study skills may not be different from UG, med school definitely is...it is NOT like UG school (or even grad school)....and the details are important, but WHICH details? well, you figure that out as you go along...

Mike77

05-31-2008, 05:30 PM

i am against pre-studying and not for the reason you state. Simply put what you wil "pre-study" over days or weeks, will be covered in a few days of your 1st semester...you will be studying for the next 4 years (well, 3 and a half :D), there is time enough for that when you get to med school...enjoy the time you have now with friends, family, your favorite restaurant....

and while study skills may not be different from UG, med school definitely is...it is NOT like UG school (or even grad school)....and the details are important, but WHICH details? well, you figure that out as you go along...

they do an overview of all of medical school in the first few days? I thought it was more topic based throughout.

covarubious

05-31-2008, 05:41 PM

i think what (she? i wish there was a way to tell gender on this thing lol) means is those people who try to learn everything in debth and cram. i have seen some of the anatomy notes, you won't have time to get too far into it if you are heading to Saba soon. Us on the other hand, we have tons of time. lol i have a year. ;) but your point was geared more to knowing the main points of each subject which would be much easier to review. ;) am i right or way off? lol btw soooooooooo bored at work thus all the posting the past 2 days

they do an overview of all of medical school in the first few days? I thought it was more topic based throughout.

Mike77

05-31-2008, 06:48 PM

i think what (she? i wish there was a way to tell gender on this thing lol) means is those people who try to learn everything in debth and cram. i have seen some of the anatomy notes, you won't have time to get too far into it if you are heading to Saba soon. Us on the other hand, we have tons of time. lol i have a year. ;) but your point was geared more to knowing the main points of each subject which would be much easier to review. ;) am i right or way off? lol btw soooooooooo bored at work thus all the posting the past 2 days

yea. Like i've said many times before, reading the detailed stuff is, for the most part, a waste of time. I'm just going to read the main points for everything so I'm not out in left field when we start a new course.

covarubious

05-31-2008, 07:28 PM

Well, since I have 100 years until I start I will do some review. I am going to try to replace some of my useless courses at Ryerson to for some anatomy and histology too. ;) I know I know, I will still be studying my *** off my entire time there and no matter how much i learn now that won't change. but i would rather take an anatomy class then advanced basket weaving anyway. ;)

yea. Like i've said many times before, reading the detailed stuff is, for the most part, a waste of time. I'm just going to read the main points for everything so I'm not out in left field when we start a new course.

Boulderunner

05-31-2008, 07:30 PM

I am telling you that you are going to regret wasting your time trying to prestudy. Mark my words. Take the people who have gone through its words for it. we are not trying to lead you wrong. Our advice is based on experience.......

covarubious

05-31-2008, 07:35 PM

I hear you and thank you for your advice but what if we have nothing better to do with out time? lol it would keep us off this forum for a bit and thats best for everybody ;)

I am telling you that you are going to regret wasting your time trying to prestudy. Mark my words. Take the people who have gone through its words for it. we are not trying to lead you wrong. Our advice is based on experience.......

wolfvgang22

06-01-2008, 10:57 AM

Mike77

06-01-2008, 11:21 AM

Yeah, this is basically those who have been there saying "dont pre-study" vs. those who haven't done basic sciences saying "but i think it will help".

I'll pitch in with the been-there-done that crowd and say "dont do it!". Up to now you guys, even the ones who have gotten 4.0 GPA's studying advanced engineering or whatever have been drinking knowledge from a nice, slow trickling mountain spring. You might turn up the volume a bit if you study hard several hours a day on your own. When you get to the island and start classes, you will be exposed to the stinging blast of a firehose of knowledge shot down your throat at full force. Just how it was for most of us who have been there.
Finally, you won't look back and go, "oh I wish i had spent more time shut in a room studying", you will think "oh my god, i miss my friends, family, my life!" after a few months (or much less).

Wouldn't drinking a bit before cause less pressure on the firehose? I won't lie to you, I just feel there is absolutely nothing to lose by pre-studying, as long as it is not a chore. You know how most people read novels in their time off? I'm not a big fan. I love learning new things. Rather then casually reading a novel, Ill casually read some anatomy. I find it really interesting anyway.

Unfortunately, Psychology does not prepare you overly well for the basic sciences of med school, so i am worried. With respect to anatomy, I don't know an arm from a leg. I at least want to know the basics just so the firehose can release some pressure a bit. I don't feel that you guys are really listening to what me and cov are saying... Im not planning on studying any less in med school.

Using the logic of many people against pre-studying, people with a Bachelors of Nursing would be the least succesful in med school due to all of the prior knowledge they would have. I somehow doubt that is the case.

I really appreciate the advice from everyone and i KNOW you guys mean well. However, everyone is different. I'm guessing that you guys didn't pre-study and did fine, and thus would try and find reasons to support your decision (it's a cognitive bias :p ). So to discredit that idea, did anyone try pre-studying and find it completely useless?

Honestly, even if it WAS completely useless, there is no way in hell it could ever be detremental.

wolfvgang22

06-01-2008, 12:00 PM

I see where your coming from mike...i had a degree in psych, and a masters in education, and was also somewhat worried. Don't worry, you'll be fine.

covarubious

06-01-2008, 12:07 PM

the only thing i can think of is if you learn a ton of really bad innacurate info then have to work harder to overcome the corrupted info while taking in the good. but all this talk of hoses and water and drinking makes me wanna go to the bathroom! dang! as usual I agree with your comments, only difference is I do have a more science/chem/bio educational background and a lot of my courses in Ryerson are health/desease related so I think it'll give me a pretty good base but yeah, would it be completely slaughtering a metaphore to say i thirst for knowledge? lol

Wouldn't drinking a bit before cause less pressure on the firehose? I won't lie to you, I just feel there is absolutely nothing to lose by pre-studying, as long as it is not a chore. You know how most people read novels in their time off? I'm not a big fan. I love learning new things. Rather then casually reading a novel, Ill casually read some anatomy. I find it really interesting anyway.

Unfortunately, Psychology does not prepare you overly well for the basic sciences of med school, so i am worried. With respect to anatomy, I don't know an arm from a leg. I at least want to know the basics just so the firehose can release some pressure a bit. I don't feel that you guys are really listening to what me and cov are saying... Im not planning on studying any less in med school.

Using the logic of many people against pre-studying, people with a Bachelors of Nursing would be the least succesful in med school due to all of the prior knowledge they would have. I somehow doubt that is the case.

I really appreciate the advice from everyone and i KNOW you guys mean well. However, everyone is different. I'm guessing that you guys didn't pre-study and did fine, and thus would try and find reasons to support your decision (it's a cognitive bias :p ). So to discredit that idea, did anyone try pre-studying and find it completely useless?

Honestly, even if it WAS completely useless, there is no way in hell it could ever be detremental.

covarubious

06-01-2008, 12:20 PM

How competative is it in the US for med school? I thought there were tons of them? Odd how soo many very educated people have to come to SABA. what is the criteria like? is it an issue like rokshana where you have a weaker undergrad even though you have strong work after?

I agree though, a good science base is a plus but the bigger advantage is the ability to study efficiently and learn fast. the material isn't overly difficult, its the quantity thats the killer.

I see where your coming from mike...i had a degree in psych, and a masters in education, and was also somewhat worried. Don't worry, you'll be fine.

wolfvgang22

06-02-2008, 07:23 PM

Yeah, it's common to have a weaker undergrad. I never wanted to be a doctor until I worked for some time as a professional in mental health and in education, so B's were ok to me when I first went to college. I preferred to have a life than break my head getting A's. Though I had a good undergrad GPA, and a terrific grad GPA, I was still considered a weaker applicant to med school in my home state. Also, I am older, non-traditional student and there is still a lot of bias in medical education for and against various things that have little to do with ability or desire.
Undergrad work is always more highly considered by med schools as undergrad science is considered most like med school courses, and the fact that a lot of graduate programs are known to more easily give higher grades in the U.S.

Mike77

06-02-2008, 07:36 PM

I see where your coming from mike...i had a degree in psych, and a masters in education, and was also somewhat worried. Don't worry, you'll be fine.

Thanks for the helpful advice, AGAIN!

Are you still on the island?

Cheers,
Mike

KingMo

06-02-2008, 07:46 PM

Thanks for the helpful advice, AGAIN, I can only hope I can return the favor again!

Are you still on the island?

Cheers,
Mike

HAHAHAHAA. You should just edit your post and delete that, Mike77.

Big Baller

06-02-2008, 08:18 PM

Go and watch House/Greys Anatomy/ER. Thats how i would spend my last few days before med school.
sidereel.com

darkmansaad

06-02-2008, 08:29 PM

i pre studied for anatomy and it was the only course in saba i came very close to failing. this semester i also only went out maybe 3 times.

future semesters involved upregulating heineken intake and upregulating my gpa at the same time. my bench press is probably the only thing that declined during this time period

i also had a ** in science, 30 on the mcat = strong candidate by most means for caribbean at least. i really advise against pre studying....like im trying to be serious on this forum for the first time in months please listen to me before i change my mind

covarubious

06-03-2008, 03:18 AM

i'm not sure if i'll have time to get adicted to pain pills while limping to the attending orgy party in the on call room before i head off to doctors without borders ;)

Go and watch House/Greys Anatomy/ER. Thats how i would spend my last few days before med school.
sidereel.com

azulpanther

06-03-2008, 04:28 AM

Mike77

06-03-2008, 05:40 AM

wolfvgang22

06-03-2008, 08:02 AM

Thanks for the helpful advice, AGAIN!

Are you still on the island?

Cheers,
Mike
Of course not. You know we can see edits, right? ;)

rokshana

06-03-2008, 09:52 AM

Did you feel that because you pre-studied, you almost felt like you didn't have to work at hard in the course?

there is that...many people will have a false sense of security because they DO have a background in med school classes or the medical field. While they are studying, they may look at something and think, "oh, I know that" and not focus on it, then come test day, they will get a question and go..."doh!!! i can see IT in my mind's eye, but just can't recall it!!!!" I had to remind myself of that all the time for anatomy and histology, even though i taught it to college students for years!

Mike77

06-03-2008, 10:34 AM

Of course not. You know we can see edits, right? ;)

It was like 1am for me at the time (i'm at GMT) and I was tired and didn't re-read what I wrote. I read it in the morning and realized It made no sense. Did it come off as sarcastic or something? I meant it to be serius, your advice has been helpful.

KingMo

06-03-2008, 12:58 PM

It was like 1am for me at the time (i'm at GMT) and I was tired and didn't re-read what I wrote. I read it in the morning and realized It made no sense. Did it come off as sarcastic or something? I meant it to be serius, your advice has been helpful.

The humor was in your question, not the part you edited out. Wolfvgang is many rotations and a 23X Step 1 score away from the island...that's pretty far away.

covarubious

06-03-2008, 02:45 PM

And since we are already aware of that danger we will be able to avoid it ;) we are well aware we will still have to study our ***** of when we get there but with current fail rates like 50 failing histology and 38 failing anatomy out of 79 students for block 1 a little prestudy couldn't hurt lol

there is that...many people will have a false sense of security because they DO have a background in med school classes or the medical field. While they are studying, they may look at something and think, "oh, I know that" and not focus on it, then come test day, they will get a question and go..."doh!!! i can see IT in my mind's eye, but just can't recall it!!!!" I had to remind myself of that all the time for anatomy and histology, even though i taught it to college students for years!

Mike77

06-03-2008, 05:19 PM

And since we are already aware of that danger we will be able to avoid it ;) we are well aware we will still have to study our ***** of when we get there but with current fail rates like 50 failing histology and 38 failing anatomy out of 79 students for block 1 a little prestudy couldn't hurt lol

I found that information kinda encouraging. If you have to work that hard just to pass, then surely you'll be prepped for the USMLE. That, or the class is filled with idiots :p . I can tell you first hand that from changing schools mid way through my degree to what might be considered an 'easier' school, caused me to slack off a bit more. In short, bring on the harsh grading!

covarubious

06-03-2008, 06:12 PM

lol, nah, not idiots. i think its more the shock to the system and adjusting to the flood of info. according to another friend last semester was the same...

I found that information kinda encouraging. If you have to work that hard just to pass, then surely you'll be prepped for the USMLE. That, or the class is filled with idiots :p . I can tell you first hand that from changing schools mid way through my degree to what might be considered an 'easier' school, caused me to slack off a bit more. In short, bring on the harsh grading!

darkmansaad

06-03-2008, 06:29 PM

most classes are filled with idiots. actually i take that back, most of them are actually intelligent....most classes are filled with herbs

Mike77

06-03-2008, 06:41 PM

most classes are filled with idiots. actually i take that back, most of them are actually intelligent....most classes are filled with herbs

I've never heard that term in my life, wanna elaborate? And the comment about them being idiots was a joke ;) .