massive curves justified?

[gianefiasco]

Unless there is legitimate problem with question or answer choices I think its ridiculous, I didnt earn those points and its just falsely inflating these "meaningful grades".

I fail to see what babying half the class into a "passing" mark does to help anyone. You failed one test, get your act together and study harder.
/end rant

[KarmaInsight]

Unless there is legitimate problem with question or answer choices I think its ridiculous, I didnt earn those points and its just falsely inflating these "meaningful grades".

I fail to see what babying half the class into a "passing" mark does to help anyone. You failed one test, get your act together and study harder.
/end rant

We should be on a pass fail system anyway. At least thats what they are going to in the states and it seems to be working better.

[spyyder]

maybe you forgot why carib schools exist.

[bigkap87]

We should be on a pass fail system anyway. At least thats what they are going to in the states and it seems to be working better.

I disagree... pass/fail would not motivate me to study as much as the letter system. I think students would do what they do to get by and not go the extra mile studying and learning.

[Boulderunner]

massive curves? I prefer a nice 3:5 ratio.. or perhaps 34-26-30...nothing too massive...

[JeebusLives]

what semester are these massive curves happening in? we had some last semester but this semester the well seems dry. :)

[Boulderunner]

jeebus knows what Im talkin bout..

[summerwind]

What course are you talking about?

[medschool22]

its usually not just simply "pass/fail"

it's "pass/pass with honors/fail" - so, you're "motivated" to get a "pass with honors"

[bigkap87]

its usually not just simply "pass/fail"

it's "pass/pass with honors/fail" - so, you're "motivated" to get a "pass with honors"

so how is that different from the letter grading system?

[krust3]

so how is that different from the letter grading system?

more letters....obviously

[jameslynton]

its usually not just simply "pass/fail"

it's "pass/pass with honors/fail" - so, you're "motivated" to get a "pass with honors"I got no honor - I would do poorly at Saba.

[gianefiasco]

I got no honor - I would do poorly at Saba.


NAH youd fit right in LOL:twisted:

[BTH]

Salutations:

I wouldn't worry too much about grades as much as doing well on Step 1. If you're learning your material then don't worry about what other students are getting. If the professors decide to give a curve then so be it. So your grade is 3.5 or a 3.0. It's not going to make much of a difference when you take your boards. Someone with a 3.0 can study hard for their boards and perhaps perform better than someone with a 3.5. And I would take that situation any day.

I'm sure a lot of people already know that our grades are inflated anyways which is why the new incoming September class will be on a new grading scale.

[medschool22]

Nope, new grading scale started for classes of 2007.

I'm not 100% sure if January is affected (I think they are), but the May Class is.

New grading system is:
A - 4.0
B - 3.0
C - 2.0

I used to go to the Univeristy of Georgia, and while I went there, we were on this kind of grading system (they changed it to the standard A = 4.0, B = 3.7, etc the year after I graduated)

[playarf]

massive curves are not justified in public.

[JeebusLives]

if someone passes a class because of a curve and that allows them to go on to be a good doctor then i guess the curve wasnt that big of a deal anyways.

of course if they pass and get thru to become a terrible doctor then the curve was a bad idea.

i guess it all depends on how good of a prediction these grades were getting now are for the quality of doctor were gonna become.

:)

[medschool22]

if someone passes a class because of a curve and that allows them to go on to be a good doctor then i guess the curve wasnt that big of a deal anyways.

of course if they pass and get thru to become a terrible doctor then the curve was a bad idea.

i guess it all depends on how good of a prediction these grades were getting now are for the quality of doctor were gonna become.

:)

Why does a "curve" matter? The USMLE standardizes everyone on a level playing ground.

[bigkap87]

I think curves are OK. From undergrad on we have all been compared to our peers and adjusted accordingly so the mean/median of the class is a passing grade and the top% pass, and the bottom % fail. I agree there definitely is some grade inflation at Saba, it seems like at least 25% of our class would get A's. Even though the NBME says your USMLE score is not curved, statistics are generated with median/mean scores and standard deviations. I do believe certain questions are thrown out and there must be some type of curve instituted as students feeling like they failed leaving the step 1 exam are pulling 240's and up. The mean now is 218 or so and those 1-2SD below fail and those 1-2 SD above represent the top of the examinees.

In this complex and confusing learning period, I think it is important to know where you stand as compared to your peers, which is the end goal of the shelf board exams and Kaplan. So I guess this is a long way of saying we are constantly going to be compared to our peers and curves help normalize any type of inconsistency in our teaching/learning as long as the curves are reasonable.

[gianefiasco]

I think curves are OK. From undergrad on we have all been compared to our peers and adjusted accordingly so the mean/median of the class is a passing grade and the top% pass, and the bottom % fail. I agree there definitely is some grade inflation at Saba, it seems like at least 25% of our class would get A's. Even though the NBME says your USMLE score is not curved, statistics are generated with median/mean scores and standard deviations. I do believe certain questions are thrown out and there must be some type of curve instituted as students feeling like they failed leaving the step 1 exam are pulling 240's and up. The mean now is 218 or so and those 1-2SD below fail and those 1-2 SD above represent the top of the examinees.

In this complex and confusing learning period, I think it is important to know where you stand as compared to your peers, which is the end goal of the shelf board exams and Kaplan. So I guess this is a long way of saying we are constantly going to be compared to our peers and curves help normalize any type of inconsistency in our teaching/learning as long as the curves are reasonable.

well stated. I agree with you after talking with some classmates. I guess from my point of view Id like the A's to be really tough to get and then mean something when you attain it, For me it means I work harder and will do better on the USMLE.If i know on every test i just nee a B and will get curved to an A it kinda kills the anxiety i need to study.

[amyames]

the great equalizer is the USMLE....your score on that exam will show how much you know, curve or no curve on Saba block exams. When you're taking the USMLE it won't matter that you got that A in said class because of a massive curve....when you take the USMLE, it's just you and your knowledge.

so stop whining about curves people! just focus on the big picture.

though I do have to say if you feel that massive curves baby the class, don't teach students anything, and inflate grades then just refuse the curve for your grade! obviously, people aren't upset enough over the massive curves to want their grade changed back to the original.

for me, I can understand if the professors gave such a massive curve that even the people with low scores passed the exam, but they didn't. people still failed with X amount of massive curve points, so they aren't just giving random curves to placate the class. They are giving curves where they see fit.

but again, if curves aren't your thing then just refuse them. after all, with no curves, you'll honestly know how you're doing in basic sciences, and will probably be a leg up on your fellow classmates who are blindly going through the semesters happy they passed X class forgetting the passed because of X amount of curves.

[medschool22]

nobody forgets they had a curve in a class...lol

[gianefiasco]

the great equalizer is the USMLE....your score on that exam will show how much you know, curve or no curve on Saba block exams. When you're taking the USMLE it won't matter that you got that A in said class because of a massive curve....when you take the USMLE, it's just you and your knowledge.

so stop whining about curves people! just focus on the big picture.

though I do have to say if you feel that massive curves baby the class, don't teach students anything, and inflate grades then just refuse the curve for your grade! obviously, people aren't upset enough over the massive curves to want their grade changed back to the original.

for me, I can understand if the professors gave such a massive curve that even the people with low scores passed the exam, but they didn't. people still failed with X amount of massive curve points, so they aren't just giving random curves to placate the class. They are giving curves where they see fit.

but again, if curves aren't your thing then just refuse them. after all, with no curves, you'll honestly know how you're doing in basic sciences, and will probably be a leg up on your fellow classmates who are blindly going through the semesters happy they passed X class forgetting the passed because of X amount of curves.

Quite possibly the worst advice ever.

[amyames]

Quite possibly the worst advice ever.


why? because some people want to complain yet still keep the curve?? it's simple...you don't like curves then ask for it to be removed from you grade

I have to say I agree with your initial statement that curves shouldn't be given out at random. If a question is bad or more than 60% of the class got a question wrong then by all means give a curve. Don't give a curve if say the average is 80 and you give a curve to simply bump the average to an 85. however, you could have portrayed your sentiments in a better way. telling people to study harder and get their act together when they clearly did both of those things is insulting them. many students worked their butts off for the first block....it's not about sucking it up, rather a lot of times it's about finding the right way to study for a certain class. and as for babying a class, I fail to see how a curve with 15 or so odd people still failing qualifies as babying a class.


but this could go on forever....let's all just focus on kicking butt in block 2 exams, shall we?:p

[golfman]

I agree. Just refuse the curve if you don't need it.

[gianefiasco]

why? because some people want to complain yet still keep the curve?? it's simple...you don't like curves then ask for it to be removed from you grade

I have to say I agree with your initial statement that curves shouldn't be given out at random. If a question is bad or more than 60% of the class got a question wrong then by all means give a curve. Don't give a curve if say the average is 80 and you give a curve to simply bump the average to an 85. however, you could have portrayed your sentiments in a better way. telling people to study harder and get their act together when they clearly did both of those things is insulting them. many students worked their butts off for the first block....it's not about sucking it up, rather a lot of times it's about finding the right way to study for a certain class. and as for babying a class, I fail to see how a curve with 15 or so odd people still failing qualifies as babying a class.


but this could go on forever....let's all just focus on kicking butt in block 2 exams, shall we?:p

Okay so people have to "find the right way to study" and stop complaining for points they dont deserve.

The school is a business and failing students is bad for business I understand. Giving curves to keep people passing I guess is the only alternative left since dumbing down the material OR level of testing is worse...OH WAIT, some people do want the material dumbed down and the level of testing lowered. Even to the point of complaing to one professor that the other professor is "too HARD"!!! LOL I kid you not!



Bottom line: Its better to be "getting it" now and step your game up, then "get it" on USMLE where no curve is gonna save you.

[amyames]

Bottom line: Its better to be "getting it" now and step your game up, then "get it" on USMLE where no curve is gonna save you.[/quote]

I totally agree :) whoo-hoo, lol :) no more talk about curves!


yah what's with the all the complaining about professors being hard? I wouldn't want to hear that my doctor had it easy in medical school!

[gianefiasco]

Bottom line: Its better to be "getting it" now and step your game up, then "get it" on USMLE where no curve is gonna save you.

I totally agree :) whoo-hoo, lol :) no more talk about curves!


yah what's with the all the complaining about professors being hard? I wouldn't want to hear that my doctor had it easy in medical school![/quote]


I KNOW!!! I hope what was said in class at that meeting was just a rumor, cause if not there is some real nutbars in the class. A
nd I mean nutbar in the most nonjudgmental and freindliest way possible!

[wolfvgang22]

Eh...:shrug: Nobody cares where you rank in your class except you. so...

Curves should make no difference to you one way or another. Occassionally they might help you out when you have a brain melt-down. Your goal should always be to score 100% without a curve. Do YOUR best. Nobody else matters. This is the only way to learn what you need to learn to do well on the step 1 and appear to have half a brain while getting pimped on rounds. You WILL be asked this stuff again, I'm learning this the hard way right now. :lol:

[JeebusLives]

Eh...:shrug: Nobody cares where you rank in your class except you. so...

my momma cares.

:cool:

[gianefiasco]

Eh...:shrug: Nobody cares where you rank in your class except you. so...

Curves should make no difference to you one way or another. Occassionally they might help you out when you have a brain melt-down. Your goal should always be to score 100% without a curve. Do YOUR best. Nobody else matters. This is the only way to learn what you need to learn to do well on the step 1 and appear to have half a brain while getting pimped on rounds. You WILL be asked this stuff again, I'm learning this the hard way right now. :lol:

curves have no effect on anyones class ranking, since everyone gets it. SO, not sure where your going with this one.