Wyckoff Hospital, Brooklyn, NY

[ducman]

Wyckoff Hospital, Brooklyn, NY

[TMI]

Hi

it's me. nice. i'm going to wyckoff on oct. 16th for peds. apparently the place is good. their homepage is

Home (http://www.wyckoffhospital.org/homepage.cfm?id=210)

anyhow, if anyone else is going, maybe we can get together or something. and by get together i mean...go for coffee.


i'm going to be part of the first set of students Saba is giving to this hospital, we just got this one. so hopefully i'll bust my :cencsore: and i'll leave a good impression on the staff there, so we all can go there if we want. from my understanding brookdale is booked and we need more hospitals in NY, so this is good.


let's hope the staff doesn't get sick of my "niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiice". :)

i got a place 3 blocks from the hospital, if anyone needs a place, gimme a shout at mispahany@hotmail.com.

nice
lutz

[peach]

ill be wyckoff soon too. i was wondering though, do u know if surgery and peds at wyckoff are ACMGE accredited?
thx

[Locuscoeruleus22]

Wyckoff is ACGME accredited for family medicine only. Thus, you will need to check with the state you want to practice in to see if they accept the "family medicine umbrella". Family medicine umbrella means that the core rotations are automatically green book if the hospital is ACGME accredited for family medicine.

[rifster]

just a correction..wyckoff if acgme for IM, FM, Surg, Peds and most recently, OB/GYN...they have their own IM and FM programs...surg is affiliated with st. john's queens as is OB...peds is thru brookdale or brooklyn i believe...yes the acgme website might not be updated but they just got their new ob and surg affiliations when they bought mary immaculate and st. john's last month...i also think they're working on a psych rotation...

i'm not a saba student but i go to mua and started IM here in june...now in surg and peds next...

rifster

[singer]

just a correction..wyckoff if acgme for IM, FM, Surg, Peds and most recently, OB/GYN...they have their own IM and FM programs...surg is affiliated with st. john's queens as is OB...peds is thru brookdale or brooklyn i believe...yes the acgme website might not be updated but they just got their new ob and surg affiliations when they bought mary immaculate and st. john's last month...i also think they're working on a psych rotation...

i'm not a saba student but i go to mua and started IM here in june...now in surg and peds next...

rifster

The Surgery rotation was ACGME under Bronx Lebanon but the affiliation ended. J.R will tell you things but if the Surgery rotation is ACGME why does the ACGME site not show it even though it was updated October 26, 2006 and even more important why doesn't the Wyckoff website show it even though it does show Ob/gyn as being ACGME.

[SanP977]

Does anyone know anything about IM @ Wyckoff? As for the ACGME approval, both Freida and ACGME site show that Peds and OB GYN @ Wyckoff are not approved by ACGME...anyone know anything?

[Gigi25]

Hi

it's me. nice. i'm going to wyckoff on oct. 16th for peds. apparently the place is good. their homepage is

Home (http://www.wyckoffhospital.org/homepage.cfm?id=210)

anyhow, if anyone else is going, maybe we can get together or something. and by get together i mean...go for coffee.
nice
lutz

Hey,

I'm going to be at Wycoff in April for OB GYN. I've heard good things about the rotations there. If you can, please let me know how it goes for you and if anyone is rotating there now can you please let me know if the docs are nice and stuff..Thanks Gina

[peach]

HI RIFSTER,
im coming to wyckoff to do surgery and peds. have been hearing alot of terrible stuff about the surgery rotation there. since ur in it now, can u share ur experience. how are the hours? on call- schedule? teaching?
thanks

[TMI]

Does anyone know anything about IM @ Wyckoff? As for the ACGME approval, both Freida and ACGME site show that Peds and OB GYN @ Wyckoff are not approved by ACGME...anyone know anything?


hey.
i was at wyckoff doing peds and obgyn. i heard that IM at wyckoff totally sucks big time. i heard that you don't even write SOAP notes there. this is stuff that i heard from my friends from Ross while i was at wyckoff for 3 months. i haven't directly been involved in that department, but from what my friends told me, which is just heresay, i would definitely NOT do IM there if it was me.
hope that helped.
lutz

[Gigi25]

hey.
i was at wyckoff doing peds and obgyn. i heard that IM at wyckoff totally sucks big time. i heard that you don't even write SOAP notes there. this is stuff that i heard from my friends from Ross while i was at wyckoff for 3 months. i haven't directly been involved in that department, but from what my friends told me, which is just heresay, i would definitely NOT do IM there if it was me.
hope that helped.
lutz

I have heard the same from people, but who knows :).. how was OB??

[Scientific]

I have heard the same from people, but who knows :).. how was OB??

I heard the same about IM as well as most of the other cores......and most of the electives actually. I don't want to bash that hospital, but my brief experience at Wyckoff was not pleasant. There is a serious lack in teaching and an overabundance of scut work. There's also a even more serious lack in teaching of clinical procedures. Wyckoff takes a more "hands off" approach rather than allowing students to actively participate in even minor procedures...(on the rare occassion that you might get to see a procedure that is). If you want to go somewhere where you can pass your rotation with minimal effort and study independantly for Step 2/Shelfs, then Wyckoff is for you. If you want to LEARN while doing your rotation, and get some practice with your clinical skills I'd choose another hospital.

[Gigi25]

well, since I have absolutely no interest in OB GYN I should be OK LOL!!! I'll just take the time to study. I work well on my own and I'm sure I'll find something to do... Too bad about the teaching issue!!! Nothing I can do about the rotation now since it's starting in 5 weeks.. I guess I'll just make the best of it

[MedChe]

I just completed OBY/GYN at wyckoff. It is acgme accredited(just go to the site). Rotation was very good. THere basically are three residents..so you will have all the hands on experience you can ask for. I say its the best rotation wyckoff has to offer.:p

[Gigi25]

I just completed OBY/GYN at wyckoff. It is acgme accredited(just go to the site). Rotation was very good. THere basically are three residents..so you will have all the hands on experience you can ask for. I say its the best rotation wyckoff has to offer.:p

Sweet :)

I'm excited either way.

[rifster]

actually from what i hear...peds might be their best core rotation...i did IM, Surg and peds there with peds head and shoulders above the other 2..again i personally did not do OB, so for those who did OB and peds, they can say which one is better...
IM, when i did it, left alot to be desired but you do learn as you do anywhere if you put an interest in it...
Surgery, yes i learned in surgery too...again it's what you make of it, ya the teaching wasn't all that great but the main attending now who teaches students, he's a great teacher...and you can get ample hands-on experience if you show an interest...the call is a lot of scut work but most surgery places are...
i'll be there for FP in July...

[nycteena]

CHEAP HOUSING........ Late Dec 2007- End Mar 2008

Looking for DOG-LOVING student to sublet an apartment 4 subway stops (10 mins) away from Wyckoff hospital.

Low rent - but you pay utilities and you need to take care of a dog for the 3 months.

[wolfvgang22]

What is call at Wycoff for peds? So is the consensus here that Peds at Wycoff is good teaching and hands on?
I ask because a student I know rotated there and told me that you are not even allowed to carry a pen in your pocket because they don't want students writing in charts. Is that true?

[djinbh]

After having time to reflect on my experience at Wyckff surgery,and having completed other rotations in other hopitals, I can say that Wyckoff surgery rotation was a horrible experience. The lack of profesionalism starts at the top. The head of student education is rude and disrespectful to students. On the first day,during orientation, told the audience of proud and excited students recently off the island and completed step one, that if we didn't follow the rules perhaps we should go back to our island.That many of us were quit unethical, and he would not stand for that. The head of the program, the one that writes his name on your grades at the end, literally doesn't even look at students or even acknowledge a hello or good morning let alone teach us. I had asked the head of education early on what I could do get a letter of recommendation from him, thinking he might say write a paper, help him with a research progect. He said "drop dead". The administrator for surgery is a weak, gossipy man with no experience as an administrator, who enjoys hearing dirt about students from the chief student.The chief student is the horrible idea of having a fellow student become your superior. He will give you orders and be in part responsible for you grade. You may think that this would be ok, and in some instances it is. But more frequently the students are not trained as administrators and friendships, race ,personalities,and other factors come into play.People you thought were your friends change. The 24 to 30 hour long call is the Lord of the Flies experience you never wanted.
And all of this would be ok with me if I learned.
I really learned very little about surgery. We were so busy doing scut work that we had little time or energy to study. Night call was terrible. Running around getting data that the resident already had usually. No where to sleep but the chairs in the usually locked library.The residents frequently pimp you and will laugh at you as a group if you make a mistake. Surgery day was an effort in trying not to get yelled at by the nurses.
I had actually asked for Wyckoff surgery because it was in NY, and I hadn't read much about it on Vauemd. I understand that they've made changes recently, but with those same administrators present, I can't imagine things will change much.Good luck with your rotations.

[ducman]

This is exactly the type of vital feedback Saba administration needs to hear so that our future students do not have a similar experience.

Have you relayed this info to Sandy via the eval form or via direct communication so that they can research and document students' experiences during the time period this occurred?!?

[wolfvgang22]

I agree with ducman. I've heard similar negative things from others about Wycoff surgery. Nothing good we can do about it as students except to let the clinical office at Saba know through the eval. I'm sorry for your poor clinical experience, all students eventually have one or two I think. It should never happen.
Good luck with your next clinical rotation, things can only get better now that you can reflect and develop strategies on how to approach a potentially bad rotation.

[HJMA]

Just finished surgery from Wyckoff. Agreed with DJINBH, what a horrible experience and we paid a lot money for tuition. I didn't learn surgery, I learned how to use computer to get pt. data. I didn't learn surgery becuase I only scrubbed in 12 days (12 procedures observed) in 12 weeks of surgery rotation.
We make false comment on wound care procedure form, so the attendings get paid. The hospital should be closed, there are too many violations, even a medical student is awared.

[infosuperhighway]

Hi everyone, Im just curious about the weekly schedule for surgery at Wycoff. Ill be doing my surgery rotation May 16 to Aug 15 this year. Can anyone shed some light on that? Is it 5 day week or 6 day week (or more?). Do the daily hours tend to run late? How often is call? Thanks a lot.

[Gigi25]

Just finished surgery from Wyckoff. Agreed with DJINBH, what a horrible experience and we paid a lot money for tuition. I didn't learn surgery, I learned how to use computer to get pt. data. I didn't learn surgery becuase I only scrubbed in 12 days (12 procedures observed) in 12 weeks of surgery rotation.
We make false comment on wound care procedure form, so the attendings get paid. The hospital should be closed, there are too many violations, even a medical student is awared.

LOL, I heard similar things about all the electives there as well. Basically, if you have absolutely no interest in learning medicine then Wyckoff is perfect for you!! There are way too many students and a great lack of organization. OB was actually OK there. I saw several deliveries, both C section and NSVD. Clinic was long, but I did learn how to do paps on my own. OBGYN is probably the only rotation I would recommend at Wyckoff. I also completed my Peds core there and was extremely disapointed!! Most of the time we just sat around stared at each other :beat:

[facemask]

QUESTION: I am interested in taking neurology and radiology elective at wyckoff because i heard the hours are short and that you actually do learn during those hrs. Did any past student from NYS who either did neuro or radio at wyckoff have any trouble with NYS Medical Board or getting residency/medical license in NYS? I'm not sure if these electives fall under the "green" book status or if this status is even important for NYS. Appreciate any input.

[gianefiasco]

LOL, I heard similar things about all the electives there as well. Basically, if you have absolutely no interest in learning medicine then Wyckoff is perfect for you!! There are way too many students and a great lack of organization. OB was actually OK there. I saw several deliveries, both C section and NSVD. Clinic was long, but I did learn how to do paps on my own. OBGYN is probably the only rotation I would recommend at Wyckoff. I also completed my Peds core there and was extremely disapointed!! Most of the time we just sat around stared at each other :beat:

OMG i gotta get outt peds then sandy has scheduled me for ob?gyn then peds here back to back

[Gigi25]

OMG i gotta get outt peds then sandy has scheduled me for ob?gyn then peds here back to back
Like I said previously, OBGYN wasn't so bad. There are 6 weeks of rotation. 1 week is spent in the OR, seing things like hysterectomies/cyst removals etc. 1 week is spent in labor and delivery, this is where u get to see the c-sections and vag deliveries. 2 weeks are in the GYN clinic. You will be doing mostly paps, cultures, and giving results to the pts. The OBGYN ONC Dr. is extremely NICE and will let you do a lot (colposcopy etc). He's at the GYN clinic. 1 week is in OB clinic for check ups. Then one extremely waste of time week, is spent in "sono" clinic. There we surfed the internet, told stories, and sat around looking at each other. Oh, we saw like one sono. Lecture is pretty good esp with Dr. F, who actually came up with Friedman's curve (look it up, its in every OBGYN book)!!!! He's awesome. You mostly work with the PA's. There are 2 girls and 1 guy PA. 1 of the girls is SUPER nice :) The attendings will not know your name. Peds = no learning. If someone had a dif experience, plz share!! For me, it was a complete waste of my life. In fact, I may take a peds elective just so I can learn something!!!!!

Good luck

Gina

[Andes]

I'm almost done OB/GYN in Wycoff, two more weeks and this is what I think. First there are way too many students for you to get noticed. You start your day by rounding on your one patient with other students as well, at time there can be four to five students per patient. Then you go to morning rounds, where the residents present to the attending and you basically just stand there. At the end if you get to present a topic they assign you in the beginning of your rotation that's one of the few opportunities you have to shine. Then depending on what team you are on you go to clinic, or sono, or OR etc. There are also some lectures scheduled during the rotation but they get cancelled a lot.
Saying all this OB is probably Wycoff's best rotation, and the people that say it's good are ones that probably did all their rotations at Wycoff.
If you want to get scutted out, learn "protocol", and teach yourself while working under the radar then Wycoff is for you. If you actually want to learn something, and have more responsiblity, then I would recommend another site. As for me this is my first, and last time at Wycoff.

[darkmansaad]

I would like to set up a family practice elective @ Wyckoff and was wondering if there is someone at the hospital I contact, our clinical co ordinator from Saba, or whatever, I have no idea. Anyone who does, please let me know. Also any ideas of housing that will be accessible to brookdale and wyckoff let me know as well as i am doing some rotations at both this fall/winter. Holla back

[PAtoMD]

What is the schedule like for OB/GYN at Wyckoff? Thanks

[wolfvgang22]

I would like to set up a family practice elective @ Wyckoff and was wondering if there is someone at the hospital I contact, our clinical co ordinator from Saba, or whatever, I have no idea. Anyone who does, please let me know. Also any ideas of housing that will be accessible to brookdale and wyckoff let me know as well as i am doing some rotations at both this fall/winter. Holla back
Funny you say that. I just got an email from our clinical coordinator today about FP at Wycoff being available. I think it was for this fall. I deleted the email so I'm not sure what month it was. Call our clinical coordinator in Gardner and ask her about it.

[eljefe]

starting psychiatry rotation in june 23rd. how is the schedule like and what to expect. any information will be greatly appreciated.....

[PAtoMD]

Does anyone know anything about GI elective at Wyckoff? Schedule, learning etc? Thanks

[vref24]

does anyone know whether anasthesia at wyckoff is green book ??

[bigguy]

I just finished Anesthesiology at Wyckoff in October 08, and I too was concerned about the greenbook issue.

I spoke to Julius Romero who is Assistant Vice President of Medical Education and he indicated that Anesthesiology falls under the "umbrella" of their greenbook Surgery core. I think virtually all electives at Wyckoff are greenbook by "umbrella". Apparently this greenbook by "umbrella" thing is fine for licensure in New York, however, some states like Texas require rotations that are greenbook by specialty; in that case a rotation at Wyckoff is no good.

FYI, Anesthesiology at Wyckoff is an okay rotation. It's a long day, 7:00 a.m. to about 4:00 p.m., but no call, and no weekends. You do the anesthesia pre-op paperwork on patients and start their caths. You then help move the patient to OR, set them up on the table, connect the monitors, and then watch as the MD or CRNA does the induction/maintenance/emergence of anesthesia. They're usually pretty goood about explaining the details to you if you're polite, introduce yourself, and help them out with the patients/paperwork. If you ask, by the end of the rotation they may let you intubate a patient or two.

The Chairman, Dr. Raggi, is a nice guy, but tough. Because new students are coming in every 2 weeks, he doesn't remember who just started, and who has been around awhile. He expects you to know everything about anesthesiology on the first day (the drugs, the anesthesia machine, intubation techniques). There's no lecture, instead one student presents a topic every day (you're required to do one per week) during which Dr. Raggi will pimp you on the details. If you take this rotation, or Anesthesiology at any hospital I HIGHLY RECOMMEND reading NMS Anesthesiology the weekend before. It's only 185 pages and it goes into the perfect amount of detail for a medical student, and reinforces a lot of stuff that appears on Step 2. It's a great little book. Like I said, Dr. Raggi is tough, but his constant pimping and high expectations force you to learn a great deal in a short amount of time. Like all rotations at Wyckoff, this is one that you can either hide out in the library and learn nothing, and end up with a B, or be the first to arrive, work a little harder, show some interest, and end up with an A.

Good luck!
Bigguy

[bigguy]

Hey, since more and more Saba students are ending up at Wyckoff, I thought I'd give some feedback and dispel some myths and reinforce some others.

I'm finishing 4th year and matching in 2009. Here's my feedback on the rotations I've done at Wyckoff to date:

Internal Medicine:
Pros: An easy A if you show any level of initiative/competence at all. Interesting and diverse patients, and excellent range of morbidities. You have full access to examine any patient on the medical floors. Generally 9-5 with no call. You're assigned to two different attending for 6 weeks, so if you don't impress the 1st one, you get a second shot with the next one. You generally do bedside rounds with the attending and residents, and then you have a 20-60 min. question/answer session based on the cases you saw that day. Plenty of time to sit in the library studying or doing Step 2 questions. You have 1 hour of lectures/day of varying quality. You also have time to do 4 weeks of research electives concurrently if you're motivated.

Cons: No procedural experience, no charting, no direct patient responsibility of any kind. You may be assigned to a resident, but they will generally avoid you; they will not gratuitously teach you anything. The nurses are certifiably evil. There are way too many students, most of whom are lazy Ross students. Therefore, the attendings and residents expect little from you, and it's hard to stand out, even as a motivated student. You spend many hours a day just waiting around to sign out at 5:00. The attendings will arrange a time to round with you, and then routinely keep you waiting, standing in a hallway for 30 to 90 minutes. Some attendings are great, others are marginal. Basically, there's not a lot of supervision or responsibility in this rotation, so if you're going to learn anything, you have to take the initiative and either learn it yourself or pester someone into teaching you.

Surgery:
Pros: Not worse hours than other surgery programs, and possibly better....55-85 hours/week. There is no 24 hour call. Day call is 12 hours and night call is 12 hours with the following day off. The lectures are excellent. The residents are tired and overworked, but generally nice...with a few evil exceptions. You split the weeks between day and night call (seeing and reviewing the course of patients on the surgery service), OR, wound care, and ambulatory surgery clinic....so it's not the same thing week after week. This is a good rotation for someone who DOES NOT want to be a surgeon.

Cons: It's difficult to get an A in this rotation. There are way too many students, and since you're not assigned under any particular attending or resident, it's very hard to get noticed...conversely, it's very easy to slide under the radar and hang out in the library doing nothing. Instead, you're assigned under a chief student who influences your evaluation, and can make your life heaven or hell. You only spend 2 weeks in the OR and you're essentially fighting with other students to be the "scrub" assist on the procedure. You're supposed to do 20 "scrubs" but this is impossible because of the number of students. However, you can observe almost any procedure you want. The range of procedures is pretty limited; no trauma and no transplant. On most of the services you're packed liked sardines into "call" rooms for hours on end, hating your life and wanting to die and/or kill your fellow students. Much of your day/night call weeks are spent quickly seeing a patient, memorizing the new details of the chart to regurgitate to the resident during inservice rounds in the call room, and then working with a chief student to update the patient's details on the census, and writing a somewhat bogus progress note that will be signed off on by an attending during morning rounds. Procedurely you won't learn much except how to hold forceps, if you're really nice to a resident they may let you do one or two sutures. Many would consider this a high "scut" rotation, however, you're not doing anything that the residents don't have to do. The scrub nurses are the brides of satan. The attendings and residents are generally nice as individuals, but there's an overall toxic feel to this rotation. There's a lot of walking on eggshells trying not to get screamed at, especially in the OR. There are a lot of short trigger tempers. This is a terrible rotation for anyone who wants to specialize in surgery.

Ob/Gyn:
Pros: This rotation is considered one of the best at Wyckoff, and for an Ob/Gyn rotation, the hours aren't bad...40-50 hour weeks. This is one of the more hands on rotations at Wyckoff, and you'll actually get to assist with surgeries, do Gyn and Ob exams, and write notes. The weeks are split between Ob clinic, Gyn clinic, Sonogram clinic, Labor and Delivery, and OR. The attendings and residents are very interactive, and interested in teaching. Night calls are sparse (maybe 2), and you only have two 5 hour saturday calls. If you're a hard worker, it's easy to stand out. The patients are very interesting and there are a lot of premature births, high risk pregnancies, and advanced gyn pathology. You can learn everything you need to know about Ob/Gyn in this rotation. Unlike the other departments at Wyckoff, the nurses are generally nice, and the atmosphere is generally good. Lectures are excellent when they have them, but are cancelled about half of the time.

Cons: There are way too many students, and most people get B's in this rotation. Evaluations are left up to the PA's and are given months after the end of the rotation. These are early days with sign in at 7:00 a.m. Morning rounds are torture standing for an hour with 50 other students in a cramped room while the residents present their patients. Dr. Riggs, the director is a tough guy, but all of the other attendings are very approachable. The clinic days means standing in a hallway waiting to interview patients for 9 hours a day...this rotation is a back/feet killer. You're not assigned to any particular attending or resident; instead, 3 chief students hand out the work. The department as a whole is not well organized, which can make the rotation a bit chaotic at times.

Cardiology Elective: Virtually everyone gets an A in this rotation...even the people who rarely show up. Just a few hours a day, and Mon/Wed cardiac clinic for a few hours. Most of the time is spent in lecture with two ancient attendings who are excellent. This is a great rotation for learning how to read an EKG cold, but if you want to view procedures, you have to seek them out on your own. This is a great rotation to take while you're getting ready for Step 2, or during interview season.

Anesthesiology Elective: See my post above. Overall good, but tough.

Pulmonary ICU Elective: This is another easy A, and also a great elective during studying for Step 2 or during interview season. The lazy Ross and St. Matts students show up less than half the time, and no one seems to notice. This rotation is just a couple hours a day spent in lectures which are excellent, as well as ICU rounds. Again, you can choose to sit in on and observe procedures, but you have to seek out a resident and pester them.

I'll edit this post as I complete more electives.

I rarely log onto valuemd, so don't post with questions, because I won't see them for weeks/months.

Good luck!

Bigguy